General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsA case for Biden pardoning Trump
Okay, I can't believe I'm even saying this, since my gut is so invested in the other direction, but with the talk of not just Manchin but even Clyburn also saying he could support Biden pardoning Trump, I had to give it some more thought, and here's what I realized:
A Biden pardon is irrelevant to Trump's legal issues. So then the question is whether there is any benefit--to Biden, the Democrats, or the country--to have Biden pardon him.
The reason I say a Biden pardon is irrelevant to Trump's legal issues is that the Federal cases (the only ones Biden can pardon him for) are going to go away regardless. Either he'll get his DOJ people to drop them, or he will pardon himself, or if all else somehow failed to sufficiently close the door, he'd resign the presidency near the very end of of his term (perhaps for "health reasons" ) and have Vance pardon him a la Ford. (Heck, he probably wouldn't even have to resign, merely create some time when Vance would be "acting president" via 25th amendment, section 3.) I think it is realistic to say that the federal cases are NOT going to happen, period.
That being the case, what good does a Biden pardon do for Trump? Not much. Save him a little effort maybe. Or maybe he'd find a way to score some rhetorical points off of it. But in the end, it provides no actual change to Trump's legal status. Therefore, I think the remaining question is what advantages it might have for Biden, the Dems, or the country. And with Trump's legal status not truly being at issue, I think the answer to that balance of advantages vs. drawbacks is not entirely clear, and could at least be worthy of further thought and analysis.
It has been said by many, for a long time, that the fact that the federal cases go away may have been the the over-riding reason Trump ran for another term in the first place. Since he did win, his federal legal jeopardy is essentially over, and a Biden pardon is moot from his perspective. So the remaining question is whether there might be some benefit from our perspective, and I"m not sure what the answer is. I'm keeping an open mind.

yourout
(8,240 posts)We're having a hard enough time getting people to come out and vote for us so the last thing we need to do is pardon Trump.
IzzaNuDay
(851 posts)This mess started 50 years ago when Ford pardoned Nixon. I don't seeing something like this resolved in my lifetime, and certainly not the US existing as a nation.
Trueblue1968
(18,380 posts)#LockUpTrump !!!!!
No pardon for Rump !!!!!!!
Autumn
(47,246 posts)displacedvermoter
(3,440 posts)sorry.
snowybirdie
(5,843 posts)How can there be a resistance if Biden capitulates to the right wing? Trump is my enemy and we need to fight his regime
claudette
(4,988 posts)was right. She said Americans are tired of Dems bringing a butter knife to a fight
303squadron
(713 posts)Jack Smiths cases can be reopened. We know that he did that on purpose.
At some point we still have hope for justice.
Also, fuck the Orange shit weasel!
yorkster
(2,707 posts)and Judge Chutkan on record as leaving the cases open until Trump regime ends.
Hope the hell it's "only" 4 yrs.
No pardon for Trump.
thesquanderer
(12,480 posts)For the reason I explained in the OP, I don't see Trump leaving office with any ability for those cases to be re-opened.He essentially has the power to shut them down permanently. That's why I said a pardon doesn't give him any legal relief that he won't end up having anyway.
303squadron
(713 posts)thesquanderer
(12,480 posts)I mean I know that, as of now, it is true (at least if whoever is running the DOJ in 2029 thinks it's a good idea)... but as I said in the OP, once Trump takes office, from what I can tell, he has numerous ways of assuring that that does not happen, which I described.
Callie1979
(532 posts)"There there; we're going to take away your convictions you poor soulless bastard"
Paladin
(29,365 posts)Tommy Carcetti
(43,721 posts)And I seriously doubt Biden is considering such a thing.
claudette
(4,988 posts)The orange felon belongs in prison.
thesquanderer
(12,480 posts)that was pretty much my point. Our only real hope, I think, is that he can end up convicted of state charges, which he doesn't have the control over.
Johonny
(22,713 posts)MineralMan
(148,447 posts)thesquanderer
(12,480 posts)muriel_volestrangler
(103,000 posts)MineralMan
(148,447 posts)Prairie Gates
(4,047 posts)For example, he can say "We have to move on from these issues. So, I am issuing a pardon for
1) Trump
2) Jack Smith and his entire staff, as well as any federal officer involved in any of his investigations
3) All members of the January 6 Committee and their entire staffs, and any witnesses who testified before the committee
4) All non-violent January 6 defendants not convicted of sedition or conspiracy or insurrection (he should consider reducing some of the sentences for non-violent ones, however)
5) Any federal officer involved in January 6 investigations or prosecutions
6) Any officer of any state or local court who has been involved in Trump investigations, election interference investigations, etc.
This would put Trump in a position where he would have to issue pardons to VIOLENT January 6 offenders, as well as those convicted of sedition, seditious conspiracy, or insurrection. It would also significantly limit the revenge prosecutions that are in the offing.
Biden should also continue to follow up with large numbers of pardons for those caught up in the drug war. Not everybody, of course (you don't want to release El Chapo), but large numbers of the otherwise decent citizens who got gaffled up by the draconian enforcement and sentencing mechanisms for which Biden himself was partly responsible.
HereForTheParty
(599 posts)The MAGAts would just ridicule him.
Gore1FL
(22,158 posts)Ohioboy
(3,572 posts)MAGA wants to believe all of Trump's crimes are just a witch hunt. A pardon would be looked at as confirmation of their false narrative.
thesquanderer
(12,480 posts)🤬
✌🏻
travelingthrulife
(1,512 posts)screeching that he has been 'exonerated' from the highest rooftops.
Again, haven't we just seen this movie...Russia, Russia, Russia.
the_liberal_grandpa
(91 posts)No donations and no votes.
I would be done with them
ColinC
(11,098 posts)It could also undermine the victim stance that Trump has used to a huge success...
There are a lot of bad things about this idea too though.
bucolic_frolic
(48,541 posts)a pardon wrapped around immediate resignation should be considered. If you're going to give something, get something.
thesquanderer
(12,480 posts)While I like your idea, my premise is kind of based on the fact that granting a pardon doesn't actually give him anything (i.e. it gives him nothing he wouldn't end up having anyway).
crud
(895 posts)in such a way, including all the charges and evidence of guilt. Spell out all the crimes for which he is being pardoned. Make it a damning document for the ages. He's already gonna get off. Folks need to know what he did.
LW1977
(1,445 posts)An elephant in donkeys clothing.

Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)sinkingfeeling
(54,000 posts)Charging Triceratops
(441 posts)Pardoning Trump would be an insane act.
berksdem
(769 posts)CrispyQ
(39,013 posts)No, no, no, no, no. Bad idea!!
Silent Type
(8,216 posts)trump deserved charges and trials, it didn't help us at the polls. In fact, one could make a case there was a backlash against all the trials/charges.
ProudMNDemocrat
(19,421 posts)As far as the Federal charges are concerned and his hatred of all things Biden Family and Democrats. NO PARDON. He is NOT WORTHY, period! No remorse, empathy, compassion, or admission of Guilt.
As for the State of New York and Georgia! Kemp might pardon tRump for RICO charges if it ever comes to trial. But in New York? NO WAY will Gov. Kathy Hocul pardon him at the State level.
Blues Heron
(6,350 posts)Groundhawg
(1,087 posts)Ping Tung
(1,628 posts)Answer: Screwed again.
The object of civil society is justice, not truth, virtue, wealth, knowledge, glory or power. Justice is followed by equality and liberty. Lord Acton
ZonkerHarris
(25,577 posts)Scrivener7
(53,897 posts)EnergizedLib
(2,334 posts)Let the felon try to pardon himself. Hes been enabled and gotten away with everything. Let us not be the ones to contribute to the great miscarriage of justice in our country.
jalan48
(14,657 posts)So now we want to pardon this man? This Fascist and existential threat to Democracy? It makes it look like we only have one political party in this country with two wings.
AKwannabe
(6,560 posts)Fuck pardoning tRump!
Fuck that fuck that fuck that!
thesquanderer
(12,480 posts)... having over 60 replies without a single Rec!
Though it does seem that some replied without having read the actual post. (Which, sadly, is not exactly rare 'round these parts!)
Emile
(32,330 posts)Not me.
Solly Mack
(93,861 posts)then why should those without power bother at all? Why should anyone fight for those who would only surrender the fight?
tenderfoot
(8,982 posts)eom
Meowmee
(7,037 posts)flvegan
(64,751 posts)Pardon a traitor? Someone who may be seeking to end democracy? No thanks.
Then there's the optics. "Beta Biden Pardons Alpha DJT!" -Rogan, probably
standingtall
(3,032 posts)and I could've swore the crimes Trump has been convicted of are State crimes in which I also could've swore were outside of the pardoning power of the President.
thesquanderer
(12,480 posts)...which he's not going to be convicted of anyway (for reasons discussed), which is why Biden granting him a pardon doesn't really get him any legal relief he won't be getting anyway. Either way, he can still be prosecuted for state crimes.
ecstatic
(34,604 posts)Cirsium
(1,701 posts)I guess we wouldn't want to question Clyburn's judgement, so I guess we will have to question all of ours.