A pump action AR-15 style rifle

[Kaleva]

Narrated by Keanu Reeves

krispos42 mentioned this gun in a post in GD and I've never heard of a pump action AR-15 so I google searched for some videos an found this one.

Looks well made and for those who live in states with an assault weapon ban in place, this may be a choice for those who want an AR-15 style rifle. They go for $800 and up.

[Fred Sanders]

1. Gun porn is disgusting. And these days totally tone deaf. What a shocker!

The tide is turning, the snuff porn will be banned.

[NRaleighLiberal]

2. + a zillion

[Fred Sanders]

5. Thanks. Gunner logic is just plain weird. Where is Dr. Spock when you need him?

[Kaleva]

3. A pump action, in my view, is much better then a semi-auto

There's a reason mass shooters don't use pump actions.

[Fred Sanders]

4. Whatever. Not much difference when you are dead, or grieving for the dead. Is it?

Peering into the mind of an insane gun murderer for a solution is futile.

[Kaleva]

6. The AWB only banned semi-automatics. Did you support the AWB?

Or did you argue that it didn't make much of a difference when you are dead, or grieving for the dead.

[Fred Sanders]

7. Here you go, post your gunnerjabber here:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100210249665

[Kaleva]

8. I ask you again. Did you support the AWB which only banned semi-autos?

[AtheistCrusader]

39. I'm confused. In that thread you refer people here. Here you refer people there.

And that thread is locked anyway.

[krispos42]

9. Why are you trying to silence people educating themselves on this?

You're DEMANDING action, and you shout down anybody that doesn't agree with you.

[friendly_iconoclast]

19. Gun control advocacy draws self-appointed witchfinders the way Trump draws racists and idiots

[Squinch]

21. You mean like the way gun slaughters bring out gun-humper trolls?

[friendly_iconoclast]

22. There's a reason I don't hold these types of spittle flecked, self-righteous tirades against you lot

Very often, a long gap ensues between realizing ones' ineffectuality and achieving enough self-possession
to actually *do* something about it. It's only human nature to act out when one is continually reminded
of the futility of their actions.

I suggest some form of meditation, or perhaps one of the more contemplative forms of yoga.

Or maybe a nice pot of chamomile and some cleansing breaths- whatever works for
you.

Think 'acta non verba'...

[muriel_volestrangler]

23. 13 hours ago, you wrote

"Gun control advocacy draws self-appointed witchfinders the way Trump draws racists and idiots". You seem to have a remarkably short memory. Maybe your meditation, yoga or chamomile treatments could stop you calling people "witchfinders".

[friendly_iconoclast]

25. When someone not a member of DU management attempts to act as if they were...

...and try to control what's discussed, I'll say something about it.

EarlG's, Elad's, and Skinner's writs are the only ones that matter, and their rules are
the ones I follow.

If this group were to be eliminated tomorrow, I'd remain at DU to discuss
all the other things important to me: civil rights, healthcare, the environment, the economy,
trade unions and labor- all of which has been implied I don't care about 'because gunz automatically = NRA'
to certain doctrinaire types

This particular thread is far from the first time these sort of 'volunteer political officers' have popped up,
and doubtless won't be the last. I've also noticed over the years that these sorts tend to end up
sparring with the real management and getting booted.

[muriel_volestrangler]

28. Bullshit. A post commented about gun porn

(and, let's face it, a video about a pump action gun is that). The group host incorrectly characterised that as "trying to silence people". That was bullshit. It's not an attempt to silence (I'll tell you what is an attempt to silence - that's alerting). You joined in with the mischaracterisation by calling it "witchfinding".

The OP appears to break the group SoP of "Discuss gun politics, gun control laws, the Second Amendment, the use of firearms for self-defense, and the use of firearms to commit crime and violence." It is, instead, admiration of a gun. That's why it's gun porn. Sadly, the group host seems oblivious to what the group SoP says.

[friendly_iconoclast]

29. Then alert on it if you feel so strongly about the matter. It'll either get pulled or it won't

Personally, I wouldn't have posted it myself as one could simply point out that those
determined to ban semi-automatics -the 'bad' gun of the moment- would have then to contend with rifles
like that which *are* actually legal in every state- ARs are not.

If semi-automatics are banned, expect lots and lots and lots of those to be sold. There's not a hope
in hell that pump/slide actions rifles would be banned.

I forsee a repeat of 2012, when gun control proponents tried to get everything, and got nothing.

[Kaleva]

32. It clearly doesn't break the SOP of the group

From the Group SOP

"Discuss gun politics, gun control laws, the Second Amendment, the use of firearms for self-defense, and the use of firearms to commit crime and violence."

Semi-auto AR-15s are very much in the news and there is demand to control, regulate and even ban them. The AR-15 style gun in the video is legal in all 50 states and would not be affected by most bans being it's pump action. The gun is,IMHO, a very good choice for those who want a rifle that fires the .223 round and one that accepts most of the accessories that are available for the AR-15 platform. Devices like bump stocks will not work with this gun so it can't be made to fire at a rate close to an automatic weapon like a semi-auto AR-15 can.

[muriel_volestrangler]

33. Yeah, that's back to the gun porn

"IMHO, a very good choice ". It was long recognised that people discussing the merits of guns was not meant to appear in this group at all. If it was a legitimate interest for hunting, then 'Outdoor Life' was the place; if not, then it's gun porn. It just looks like the standards here are crap, and the host likes the gun porn after all, since he's clearly aware of it. Being the only host, there's fuck all point in alerting. You posted a video extolling a gun ("it's a really nice firearm", "slick" and much more), and say you like it.

This is, of course, why most DUers stay the fuck out of this place. It's alien. The host can't be bothered to enforce the SoP, and makes accusations about those complaining of gun porn. The 'gungeon' is worse than ever. Maybe it's the general atmosphere in the USA that has done this.

[oneshooter]

35. How about "legitimate interest" for target competition?

Where does that go?

[Kaleva]

36. Where did I say I like it?

If you think it violates the group's SOP, then alert on it and send an e-mail to Admin or make a post in the AKA. I really don't think it violates the SOP as ARs are very much in the news and there's an effort to regulate or even ban them. This is an AR-15 style rifle that apparently many don't know about, I didn't until yesterday, that's legal in California and New York and in every other state in the Union and most likely never will be regulated or banned.

Edit: In the past, years before the Vegas shooting, I posted vids of people using slide stocks, the people in the videos were laughing and acting like it was a great deal of fun. I was using them to show others the potential danger these devices pose as they make a semi-auto fire very fast.

I use videos often to more clearly show what I'm talking about.

[Straw Man]

37. The OP is central to the debate on an AWB.

How can you fail to see that? People are clamoring for a ban on semi-auto AR-style rifles. The point of the OP is that such a ban will not have the result that its well-meaning proponents are hoping it will. His point is that when one "weapon of choice" is taken off the table, another will take its place. The slippery slope is a real thing, and the next call would be for a ban on pump and lever actions rilfes -- both 19-century technology.

Any attempt to ban pump-action rifles and shotguns would bring a huge backlash. It would force the "Fudds" (gun owners who primarily hunt and have no interest in non-traditional guns) to take a side, and that side wouldn't be the gun-control side. It would hammer the wedge of the gun issue far deeper into the split between moderate, rural Democrats and the national party.

[friendly_iconoclast]

40. Culture warriors, Right *or* Left, don't handle 'inconvenient' information very well

"NRA talking point(s)" is functionally no different from "fake news"-
they merely arise from different factions in response to something percieved as 'threatening
and/or harmful to the general good'.

The "general good", of course, will have a 1:1 coincidence to whatever the claimant believes.

And if and when whatever it is they wan't doesn't come about, well it's *always* some
nefarious conspiracy that stopped it.

Because it's simply unpossible that their cause isn't as popular as they think it is...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_consensus_effect

In psychology, the false-consensus effect or false-consensus bias is an attributional type of cognitive bias whereby people tend to overestimate the extent to which their opinions, beliefs, preferences, values, and habits are normal and typical of those of others (i.e., that others also think the same way that they do).[1] This cognitive bias tends to lead to the perception of a consensus that does not exist, a "false consensus".

This false consensus is significant because it increases self-esteem (overconfidence effect). It can be derived from a desire to conform and be liked by others in a social environment. This bias is especially prevalent in group settings where one thinks the collective opinion of their own group matches that of the larger population. Since the members of a group reach a consensus and rarely encounter those who dispute it, they tend to believe that everybody thinks the same way. The false-consensus effect is not restricted to cases where people believe that their values are shared by the majority, but it still manifests as an overestimate of the extent of their belief. For example, fundamentalists do not necessarily believe that the majority of people share their views, but their estimates of the number of people who share their point of view will tend to exceed the actual number.

Additionally, when confronted with evidence that a consensus does not exist, people often assume that those who do not agree with them are defective in some way.

All that aside, if I were the NRA, I would be absolutely delighted if attempts to ban pump/slide and lever
action long arms were to get more traction- even those gun owners that dislike semi-automatics would feel threatened,
much as you said.

[demmiblue]

38. No hide from me. n/t

[Squinch]

24. So that's a yes?

[friendly_iconoclast]

26. 'Ask the Administrators' awaits your question/requests:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=forum&id=1259

By all means, do feel free to give them a try!

[Squinch]

31. I see it is a yes.

[krispos42]

10. All the accessories and parts for a regular AR-15 can be used on this one.

So it's already tapped into the huge aftermarket components set. Barrels, grips, foregrips, buttstocks, magazines, sights, optics, triggers, mag releases, etc.

[Kaleva]

11. And nobody, except for the fringe, is talking about banning or even regulating pump actions.

[krispos42]

13. Wait until they look scary...

... then there will be an attempt. Remember, it looks just like an AR-15 assault weapon! It must be bad!

[samir.g]

12. MLK was murdered with a pump-action rifle

[Kaleva]

14. Pump actions are not the weapon of choice for mass shooters.

[samir.g]

15. They will be if we ban only semi-auto weapons

[Straw Man]

17. What's your recommendation?

Total ban on private ownership of firearms?

[samir.g]

18. At ban anything that had a large magazine and can fire rapidly

Pump, lever, whatever.

Probably have to leave single-shot guns off the table.

[Straw Man]

20. So ... 18th century technology?

At ban anything that had a large magazine and can fire rapidly

Pump, lever, whatever.

Probably have to leave single-shot guns off the table.

It's going to be a very, very hard sell.

[Straw Man]

16. The thing is that ...

MLK was murdered with a pump-action rifle

... MLK was murdered by a single shot from a pump-action rifle. The action type was therefore completely irrelevant.

[FraDon]

27. the child's voice, briefly in the background . . .

seemed an odd counterpoint.

[muriel_volestrangler]

34. It adds a touch of authentic obscenity (nt)

[samir.g]

30. That doesn't sound like Keanu Reeves

[Always Right]

41. A glimpse of the future

I've said in the past that the AR-15 is essentially the same as any other gun and that an assault weapon ban is worthless because there is no way to describe what an AR-15 is without including many other guns.

That is why the AR-15 was back the last time it was banned because manufacturers removed the banned cosmetic features.

Now they have converted the gun from semi-automatic to pump, which has always been the substantial difference between an AR and every other gun.

Guess what, now the pump AR isn't semi-automatic so it can't be a semi-automatic assault weapon. However it still fires one shot per trigger pull but requires the action to be manually activated between shots. However that takes little time and that there are many guns that hold a lot of ammo and are just as quick.

The Henry rifle immediately comes to mind. As I recall, it is a lever action rifle invented 158 years ago and it hold 17 rounds. You might call it the assault weapon of the old west.

[oneshooter]

42. They want to ban those also, 17rd magazine. n/t