Army investigates 101st Airborne chaplains accused of dismantling on-post programs for Jewish..

[MineralMan]

This seems pertinent just now, as we see a new wave of antisemitism rising.

https://www.armytimes.com/news/2018/04/27/army-investigates-101st-airborne-chaplains-accused-of-dismantling-on-post-programs-for-jewish-soldiers/

Army investigates 101st Airborne chaplains accused of dismantling on-post programs for Jewish soldiers

Chaplains in the 101st Airborne Division have fired the longstanding Jewish lay leaders at Fort Campbell, Kentucky, allegedly without providing any reason, effectively ending Friday night Shabbat services for Jewish soldiers and their families.

The two ranking chaplains also refused to support the Jews’ attempts to celebrate Passover on March 30, the first night of the eight-day long religious celebration, allegedly because it conflicted with Christians’ Good Friday observances and would save money during the installation’s four-day holiday.

{snip}

When Mize said that chaplain has never attended a religious worship service, he responded that “it would compromise his religion to attend,” according to Mize.
{snip}

“When you say that some of the most senior military chaplains can’t even observe Jewish faith practices because it would be offensive to their religious views, it doesn’t get much worse than that, except when you tell them that if they want the base chaplains to support Passover, they have to choose a day that isn’t Passover,” Weinstein said.

This is from April, 2018. It demonstrates a level of prejudice against the Jewish faith among some military chaplains. Fundamentalism is, no doubt, the reason, but that such things occur in our military is distinctly disturbing. The claims are under investigation, but we may never find out what is done about this. The military is pretty closed-mouth about such things.

[MineralMan]

1. Personal Story about a Jewish Chaplain Who Helped Me

In USAF Basic Training at Lackland AFB, when I got my dog tags, they said "PROTESTANT" on them, despite my checking off the NONE box. I pointed this out to the drill sergeant and said that I was an atheist, and wanted that on my dog tags, so they'd correctly reflect my status.

"Take it up with a Chaplain, Airman!" he shouted at me, since that was the only way he ever spoke. So, I did. I found the Jewish chaplain, and told him my story. He said, "I'll see what I can do for you, but don't get your hopes up."

About halfway through Basic, I was called into the Orderly Room, where I was given an envelope. My new dogtags were in it, with ATHEIST embossed on them in an irregular line. Apparently, someone had to hand stamp each letter. At my next opportunity, I visited the Jewish chaplain again and thanked him for interceding.

"Well," he said, "That was an interesting thing. It was also not easy. As far as I can tell, you may be the first Airman to ever have dogtags like yours. I had to make a 1st Amendment argument with the Base Commander to get it done."

I thanked him again. Sadly, I can't find those old dogtags from 1965 anywhere. They disappeared during one of my moves, I guess.

[bitterross]

2. They are in Kentucky. This doesn't suprise me.

I thought the assignment of personnel to bases was not by choice of the personnel but by command so I'd hope there would be some unintentional diversity in the upper ranks.

Seems like they have people who are true Southern Baptists as their Chaplains.

[MineralMan]

3. I don't know how things are now, but

when I was in the USAF, the Protestant chaplains were, by and large, mostly Baptists of one stripe or another. The RCC chaplains and Jewish chaplains were the only ones who were not fundamentalists, really.

I'm not sure exactly why that was, or is. Perhaps it's easier to get ordained as a Southern Baptist preacher. I don't know.

[bitterross]

5. I was raised Southen Baptist. Seems like it's easy to be ordained.

I'm not certain of the process but it does not seem to me the Baptist ministers I grew up with had much higher education. I suppose it depends upon which of the versions of Southern Baptist you are.

[MineralMan]

7. There are a number of SBC "Bible Colleges" out there,

training young pastors. I don't really know much about how rigorous the education process is. I do know that becoming a military chaplain requires some sort of official ordination. I don't know whether the quality of education is every really checked, though.

[exboyfil]

6. The RCC and the direct offshoots require 3-4 years

of seminary work beyond a Bachelor's degree (this includes Lutheran, Presbyterian etc). In general the Baptist churches do not.

[MineralMan]

8. Yes. I suppose there is quite a bit of variation out there.

I have an ordination certificate from the Universal Life Church, along with a B.A. in Literature. I wonder if that would qualify me to be a military chaplain? It qualifies me to officiate at marriages, anyhow.

[exboyfil]

4. To get additional revenue

My small Lutheran church on the Mississippi Gulf Coast used to rent their sanctuary to a small Jewish congregation so that they could worship. They just covered up the Christian objects in the sanctuary during their worship.

Never thought anything about it. We thought it was a good use of our facility.

What is wrong with people. I have known several Pastors who have worked closely with Rabbis over the years.Sometimes they are even close friends.

My church was not the more liberal ALC (which eventually merged with the LCA), but the more conservative Missouri Synod.

[bitterross]

9. Southern Baptists would never do that.

As I mentioned above, I was raised Southern Baptist. With all the hell-fire and brimstone that goes along with it. What I remember is our minister spending a good deal of time each Sunday yelling at us about how awful we were as sinners. How were were dammed from the moment we were born - now pass the offering plate.

The ONLY way to heaven is through accepting Jesus. Anyone who has not will burn in hell.

Where I grew up there were no Jewish people. I didn't even know they existed until history lessons in high school.

[msongs]

10. the military should not be in the chaplains/religion business.

[MineralMan]

11. Yeah, well, I disagree with that.

Military personnel are sent all over the world. Many of them have religious beliefs and want to practice their religion, wherever they are. To accommodate those people, the military sends chaplains to the places where the personnel are. In many places, like in the Middle East, there are no local Christian churches, for example. Without chaplains, those who are Christian will not be able to worship as they wish to. That is a serious morale issue.

I have no problem with the military including chaplains in their ranks. I don't see any reason to deny military personnel access to the worship options of their choice. I'm an atheist, but I recognize that religious belief is important to many people. Military service doesn't change that.

So, I have no problem with the military's chaplain services. Not at all. I do have a problem with biases within the chaplain's service, however. Where it exists, it denies some the right to worship as they choose.

[Pope George Ringo II]

14. During my father's army service ('54-'56), he was told only catholics got posted to Spain

Something to do with keeping Franco and his pet church happy. I can't find anything to confirm this, and it should be mentioned he was posted to sunny Alaska and I gather it was not a lovely spot to spend a few years.

But, if that really was the formal policy, that sort of thing also has implications on American military personnel and freedom of religion. Generally, I do agree that if you're going to send religious people in harm's way, you have to allow them to take their trappings with them.

[Major Nikon]

16. They don't need a chaplain for that

Especially in the age of everything that’s available online. If the religious nutbags can protest tax dollars being used for abortion, other people should have a say in their tax dollars being used to support irrational superstitions.

[qazplm135]

15. of course it should

and mostly they do things the right way...but unfortunately there are evangelical nutjobs that see the military as a way to convert new followers and send some zealots into the chaplains corps.

Kind of like how some gangs send recruits into the military to learn discipline. (real thing)

[gtar100]

12. Apparently they don't have enough faith in their gospel

that they felt it necessary to rely on underhanded tactics. Apparently their God isn't big enough to handle it himself. They aren't seeking the divine in their ministry but control. That's what I see in their actions.

[MineralMan]

13. Could be. Or, maybe, they're secretly antisemitic.

There's a lot of that going around in right-wing circles. I'm guessing that is the case here. It might be limited to just that base. Or, it might not. I don't know. See, those "Christian" chaplains are so worried about "compromising their beliefs" that they can't even attend a Jewish service. I find that informative.