TIME: Meet the rust belt voters who voted for Trump

[Fast Walker 52]

http://time.com/4591112/time-person-of-the-year-donald-trump-voters/photo/voters-donald-trump-person-of-the-year-poy-08-2/?xid=tcoshare

They profile 9 of them. They are pretty stunning. A lot of them are former Dems, who sadly were just conned big time by Trump. They heard his economic message and not much else, it seems.

The first is a doozy:

Shannon Goodin, 24, Owosso, Mich. A first-time voter who doesn’t consider herself a Democrat or a Republican, Goodin says Trump earned her support by being “a big poster child for change,” adding, “Politicians don’t appeal to us. Clinton would go out of her way to appeal to minorities, immigrants, but she didn’t really for everyday Americans.”

Gee, that's not racist, is it?

[pangaia]

1. OMG..

Of course it's not racist.
Why, some of her best friends are even black , and her sister is dating a guy from Venezuela.

[still_one]

2. The media were willing accomplices

[duffyduff]

45. And they still are by promoting this "Trump Democrats" bullshit.

I would be willing to bet there were far more Republicans who voted for HRC than Dems who voted for Trump.

[still_one]

49. You are absolutely right

[TwilightZone]

3. Well, minorities and immigrants clearly aren't everyday Americans. Trump could tell you that.

Exit polls: Trump won on immigration and terrorism.

[duffyduff]

46. Translation: Racism and xenophobia, with a lot of sexism thrown in. n/t

[Coventina]

4. Blech. A bunch of moronic racists.

[snooper2]

7. I don't see them as racists just low information fucktards

These are the exact people that I hope get what they deserve for putting asshole in power. Fuck them and their livelihood.

[Fast Walker 52]

10. well, the first one seems a little racist...

but I agree they are fucktards

[Lithos]

54. Low-information is a good description

I bet she had no idea that speaking to BLM meant speaking to the issues which affect *all* Americans, not just Blacks. Ie, her understanding was shallow and likely manipulated by the heavy use of Fake News.

The difference between her and a racist is that the racist actively chooses it, low-information people just are ignorant and thus easy to manipulate.

[brush]

59. You're too kind. She's an out-and-out-but-unaware-that-she-is racist.

Last edited Sat Dec 10, 2016, 01:06 AM - Edit history (1)

Her remark that Clinton ". . . would go out of her way to appeal to minorities, immigrants, but she didn’t really for everyday Americans.” is nothing but racism.

We run into it everyday. After all, we do live in America.

[Lithos]

63. Still stand behind my comment

I think that most people here on DU got that when people were saying BLM, they were meaning that to protect everyone's civil rights, we have to start with those being affected them most. The information challenged do not get the inclusive message, and only hear the "or" exclusive case.

I would argue this is one of the motives of the non-news click-bait websites and low-fact based broadcasting done by Fox who do their best to make it only a Black (or identity-based) issue rather than something that affects all of us in some capacity.

I think in the end, this comes down to the following pragmatic difference. These people are still reachable in some capacity - it just takes the right message. They mean well even if they chose to live a life of ignorance.

Or more simply - there is no motivation among low-information people, you may hear parroting, but no understanding On the flip side, there is motivation among those who are racists/bigots with a high degree of motivation.

And yes, I chose to not stereotype people which I think many are doing here when they unilaterally slam people.

For the record, I'm a Texas Progressive/Populist (a real Populist, not like Trump), and it burns me whenever people generically and stereotypical slam Texas or other red states in the same way that they are slamming the people in the Rust belt.

L-

[brush]

64. Your ideas are thoughtful and valid. I feel however, much unconscious racism abounds

That woman's comments are a typical example.

And to your point, her lack of info afforded her no idea of how off-putting and bigoted her comments were, but they still were.

[Lithos]

70. Her comments were an echo

Of what she's been fed. Until she understand and internalizes them, she's not a racist.

Yes, those who are feeding her this crap are indeed racist. I will give you that. The distinction is until she internalizes it, she's not a racist - but a parrot.

Maybe a subtle distinction, but I think important enough as a differentiator to those who want to discount these people offhand vs those who think she can come around with the right message (which penetrates her grey matter).

L-

On Edit: Short answer, I'm not giving up on the Rust Belt like several here who are calling for wholesale abandonment out of disgust and grief.

[brush]

71. Good on you. What's needed is robust progressive media to combat 24/7 FOX and right wing radio.

[Lithos]

72. More than that

You are talking a 2004 solution...

Needs to be updated to 2020 with a focus on Social Media and other wall of sound media.

L-

On Edit: Right idea, different implementation

[brush]

73. Of course, 24/7 progressive media would encompass all of that. Has to be state of the art

[Lithos]

74. True

n/t

[EffieBlack]

65. "Everyday Americans" white people. But they don't do "identity politics."

Completely sick of these people and even sicker of the media's ass-kissing obsession with them.

[Lithos]

69. They don't get it...

Big difference...

As I've said before, identity politics can come across as an "us" vs "them" type of thing when the authors really are trying to say it's an "all of us" kind of thing.

This is what Conservatives designed Faux News (and other conservative outlets ) to counter 24/7. The conservatives do an excellent job of misinterpreting the message of Identity politics which dilutes the usefulness of this for us in certain markets.

Rather, we need a campaign which focuses on simpler messages - like Obama did in 2008 with "Hope". There is change happening and we need a good message to help people with transition. "Keeping ahead!" or some "change friendly" slogan where we articulate our gaps and what we need to do to keep moving forward.

L-

[bettyellen]

11. Everyone of them has that yay bootstraps no handouts mentality that is a cover for racial resentment

[iluvtennis]

40. +1

[stopbush]

5. All that remains is how quickly they blame the Ds for Trump's

broken promises and looming disasters.

It will be "the Ds blocked his great ideas," and the media will nod in agreement.

[Wellstone ruled]

6. If these areas think for one minute that

all those Steel Mills and Stamping Plants are going to reopen,FOR GET ABOUT IT. Guarantee most of these plants have been cannibalized with the good salvage having been sent to other Countries. It takes years to build new or rework a Steel Mill. BTW,it is called over capacity. China has reduced the number of mills from 160 to just over 100. To much Capacity.

[NCTraveler]

8. We should have talked about raising the minimum wage....

Or a more progressive tax structure. Or clean energy and the jobs of tomorrow.


Ohhh.... Wait..... We did.

Fuckwads.

[KittyWampus]

13. Not one of Clinton's ads talked about any of that. And she didn't even bother

going to the Rust Belt.

[Justice]

14. HRC went to Michigan, PA, OH. Didn't go to WI.

[NCTraveler]

16. It's like they didn't watch one second of the campaign. nt.

[Garrett78]

47. That's what I've concluded. I read a lot of nutty stuff at DU during the primary, but...

...some of the postmortem posts take the cake.

[EffieBlack]

66. If she had gone to Wisconsin, these people would have voted for her?

I don't think so.

[NCTraveler]

15. Both of your claims are outright dishonest.

Actually, complete lies.

&index=10&list=PLt9jO9QkAAocHqyifNQaGPR-9jipern-b

On top of that, she spent a lot of time in the rust belt. Would you like for me to list some of the stops you seem to be completely oblivious to?

Your comment here is literally an easily provable lie.

[Glassunion]

22. Those are both great ads. Where were they run?

I live in PA and did not see either of those. I saw others that were unrelated, but nothing on those two topics.

[progressoid]

23. I never saw them in IA/NE either.

Missed opportunity

[NCTraveler]

33. Poster said Clinton didn't have them.

Now it's I didn't see them. Poster also didn't see Clinton campaigning in the rust belt.

It's just flinging poo at this point.

[Glassunion]

37. I hear ya.

She was in the rust belt throughout Oct.

If I had a complaint, it would be that she did not do too many rallies compared to Trump in the same region and she stuck primarily to the larger cities. Her campaign staff should have noted what Trump was doing and adjusted her schedule accordingly.

[pstokely]

44. they were expecting big city turnout at 2012 levels

Last edited Fri Dec 9, 2016, 08:07 PM - Edit history (1)

big rallies in Philly but not much effort in Bumfuck PA where tRump was going

[Glassunion]

57. That was a mistake

You need a truly exciting candidate for that

[MFM008]

9. They can drop dead

Along with their pet maggot.

[Vinca]

12. I hope they do a follow-up with them a year from now.

[yardwork]

17. Minorities and immigrants don't "count" as Americans.

That's exactly what people mean when they say that Hillary focused too much on identity politics. Civil rights for everybody is a turnoff to those who consider minorities to be less than.

It's white supremacy, plain and simple.

[realmirage]

18. So rather than win them back we want to lose again?

All we need is an economic message that speaks to those people in the rust belt. If that's too much to ask, get used to losing.

[Fast Walker 52]

26. well, as many have said here, we HAD an economic message. These people just didn't hear it.

I wonder why.

[EffieBlack]

67. No - we pull in other voters. These people are a lost cause and a waste of time

There are plenty of other voters who will vote Democratic - they're a sure thing - if we reach them and get them out to vote (and help them overcome the voter suppression barriers).

Forget these idiots. The message was laid out before them like a golden carpet and they crapped all over it and then voted for Trump. Screw them.

[Justice]

19. I read this hoping for some thoughtful reason and all I got was

- HRC was for people who aren't like us and don't work

- Donald was for people like us who work very hard

Lots of ducking and bobbing but essentially that's it.

[NewJeffCT]

30. It's the same with unemployment or abortion and other issues

"Sure, I took unemployment, but I had worked so hard before that and Company XYZ really screwed me over, so I deserved it. It's all those lazy black and brown people that are freeloading moochers." (When somebody called Rush out for taking unemployment before, manly he-man Rush said his wife at the time *forced* him to take it. Not sure if that was Wife 1 or 2...)

And, wasn't there a book or article several years back "The Only Moral Abortion was my Abortion."?

[Tarheel_Dem]

20. And yet there are those who declare, emphatically, that race didn't play a role. "Identity politics"

my Aunt Fanny.

[progressoid]

24. Did you look at all nine?

Included were an AA male and a Hispanic female.

[Fast Walker 52]

27. yes, I saw that, and I felt bad for them. I wonder where they get their news from.

[duffyduff]

42. Yes, the token minority people who help promote the lie of "Trump Democrats."

You can bet your ass there were plenty of "Clinton Republicans" who voted against the orange asshole. Time doesn't seem to care about that demographic.

[progressoid]

50. Token?

Exit polls show that Drumpf got 8% of the AA vote. Romney got 7% in 2012.
Latinos went for Drumpf by 28%. Romney got 27% in 2012.

These are groups that he routinely insulted. Yet they still voted for him.


And if exit polls are to be believed, then I wouldn't bet my ass there were plenty of "Clinton Republicans" who voted against the orange asshole. It was a wash. 8% of Dems voted for Drumpf. 8% of Repubs voted for Clinton.

[hueymahl]

21. Yep, just dismiss their concerns because the are part of the deplorables

Because that worked so well for us last time.

[duffyduff]

43. They are willfully stupid. You can't fix these people.

n/t

[progressoid]

25. Blame it on racism but most of them say it was the economy and jobs that swayed their vote.

[Fast Walker 52]

28. yes, but Hillary had an economic message. Why do you think Trump's was more effective for them?

[progressoid]

32. Lots of reasons.

She represented the status quo.
They preferred the messenger over the message.
Her message was drowned out by media coverage of all the other shit.
People are stupid.
And all the other things we've been rehashing for the last few weeks.

[duffyduff]

41. Do you even think they are honest at all?

Of course they are bigots. And stupid.

And we don't need them.

[brush]

62. Of course they said that. You think their going to say we liked Trump's . . .

calls for a wall and promise to deport 11 million and exclude Muslims?

One of them said,IMO, what many thought: ". . . Clinton would go out of her way to appeal to minorities, immigrants, but she didn’t really for everyday Americans" . . . meaning that minorities are not Americans.

That's nothing but barely-below-the-surface racism — only whites are real, everyday Americans.

[EffieBlack]

68. Of course they say that - while making racist comments and revealing their white supremacy

They can say anything they want. But they lined up with the Ku Klux Klan to put a racist in the White House.

[BeyondGeography]

29. They come across as mostly impressionable

although you can see from a couple that his racism might well have been the clincher. Their votes were for the most part up for grabs IMO and he got them. We need to fight harder next time.

[duffyduff]

39. We don't need them, period.

We need the ones who didn't vote at all, not the bigot vote.

[LisaM]

51. I agree with you.

We are talking 77.000 votes across three states. There are some people we're never going to reach. I think there are people who don't participate now that would be a better target for GOTV.

[DesertFlower]

31. it didn't bother her that he was a racist, misogonist, xenophobe. if

that didn't do it how about mocking the disabled. anyone who voted for trump has no sense of moral decency.

[Paladin]

34. Fuck 'em. (nt)

[DonCoquixote]

35. I love how the union worker and the immigramt's grandduaghter

both were Trump voters. Guess what, you two are the early ones on the hit list, as the people Trump put into power HATE YOU.

[coco22]

36. If you aren't white..

you aren't American in their eyes that is why they chant USA!USA!USA!. I guess when they get rid of all other races whom were here before many of them and their families,they will live in shangrali and all the ills of the world will go away. I wonder will there be white on white crime like we see on 20/20,dateline and the nightly news?

[duffyduff]

38. More b.s. trying to foster the fake trend of "Trump Democrats."

It isn't about economics. For crying out loud, the quote undercuts the notion that was what motivated the voters.

Nope. These people are bigots, and Trump appealed to their racism, xenophobia, and sexism, and not necessarily in that order.

[Starry Messenger]

48. Speaks volumes doesn't it?

I agreed earlier with Jennifer Palmieri--I'd rather we lost the way we did than win the way Trump did.

[napi21]

52. My biggest fear came true. I use to live in the rust belt (Pa.) and I know how upset

the former steel mill, auto makers, etc. were when their jobs disappeared, and they still are to this day! When I first heard the Con promising to bring those jobs back, all I could think of was "Oh dear God, please don't let them really believe this idiot!" In a way, I feel sorry for them now, because they will be horribly disgusted when those promises never happen.

[JDC]

53. Twit

[AlexSFCA]

55. fair enough

We desperately need a non-partisan movement in this country. Van Jones is onto something with his MessyTruth but it will always be viewed as partisan since he is a democrat. We need a new non-partisan media network with focus on fact-checking and ordinary people like the ones profiled in the article. Both prties have been focusing hard on pushing out moderates over the years so we are now a hyperpolarized, post-truth society. If we continue with Pelosi, Ellis, name-calling, etc., we are going to see collosal losses in the midterms. Please ask yourself, how exactly does a San Francisco democrat, Nancy Pelosi, connect to critical voters in rust belt states?? Democrats need to start being strategic and stop being idealistic. I know the truth is hard to swallow sometimes, but America is worth sacrifice, so the focus should be on long-term, two step back is better than 10.

[Seasider]

56. I can kind of see why some rust belt Democrats appealed to Trump's message

Trump came at them with a hardline anti-free trade stance which was a position that was to the left of Hillary. Sadly, people are often too easily drawn to candidates who tell them what they want to hear mixed with "tough talk" which Trump did under his phony macho bravado persona he showed on the campaign trail. Never mind that this guy a rich jerk who had never shown any prior evidence that he gives a flying crap about the working class folk.

[boston bean]

58. and this is suppose to convince us many of these fucks who voted trump aren't misogynist racists?

[DFW]

60. The Rust Belt and the gold-buckled, diamond-studded belt

[URL=.html][IMG][/IMG][/URL]

[Chitown Kev]

61. Well alrighty, then

"Clinton would go out of her way to appeal to minorities, immigrants, but she didn’t really for everyday Americans.”

Do I laugh or cry or both?