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Men's Group
In reply to the discussion: The Medea Complex and the Parental Alienation Syndrome [View all]redqueen
(115,164 posts)9. Understanding and Collaboratively Treating Parental Alienation Syndrome
http://www.fact.on.ca/Info/pas/waldron.htm
... Earlier researchers had rioted similar processes in families (for example, the "medea complex" described by Wallerstein and Kelly in the late 1970s), and professionals working with divorcing families easily recognized the syndrome, sometimes described as brainwashing, presented by Gardner. That his "syndrome" was so readily adopted is less a testament to Dr. Gardner's "discovery" than to his conceptualizing a familiar type of high-conflict divorcing family problem that is complex, perplexing, very resistant to change; and sometimes tragic.
Gardner's conceptualization of the problem and the dynamics underlying the problem proved at best incomplete, if not simplistic and erroneous. He portrays the alienating parent as virtually solely responsible for the dynamic, turning the vulnerable child against the innocent target parent. More extensive research on the topic(3) has more clearly established the complex involvement and motives of all of the actors in this disastrous family drama. ...
...
Think of the opportunity here. If a lawyer representing an accused child sex abuser can find a mental health professional who will testify that the children are victims of PAS, the same expert can take the next step to say that it would be rare for a child suffering from PAS to suffer genuine sexual abuse. By simply naming the child's antipathy for the parent as PAS, the lawyer has a defense.
...
The article attacks Dr. Gardner in strong terms. The commentator points out that the PAS theory is built upon criteria that Dr. Gardner invented and included in his widely discredited sex abuse legitimacy scale. It then goes on to argue that testimony regarding PAS should be excluded from the court both under the Daubert test and under the Frye analysis. Under Daubert, the trier of fact must rule on admissibility based on an expert's opinion as to whether the evidence is reliable and thus relevant. Under Federal Rule of Evidence 104(a), the trial judge must make a preliminary assessment of whether the reasoning or methodology underlying the testimony is scientifically valid. in other words, the court may consider whether the theory has been tested, whether it has been subjected to peer review and publication, and whether it has attracted widespread acceptance.(7)
...
... Earlier researchers had rioted similar processes in families (for example, the "medea complex" described by Wallerstein and Kelly in the late 1970s), and professionals working with divorcing families easily recognized the syndrome, sometimes described as brainwashing, presented by Gardner. That his "syndrome" was so readily adopted is less a testament to Dr. Gardner's "discovery" than to his conceptualizing a familiar type of high-conflict divorcing family problem that is complex, perplexing, very resistant to change; and sometimes tragic.
Gardner's conceptualization of the problem and the dynamics underlying the problem proved at best incomplete, if not simplistic and erroneous. He portrays the alienating parent as virtually solely responsible for the dynamic, turning the vulnerable child against the innocent target parent. More extensive research on the topic(3) has more clearly established the complex involvement and motives of all of the actors in this disastrous family drama. ...
...
Think of the opportunity here. If a lawyer representing an accused child sex abuser can find a mental health professional who will testify that the children are victims of PAS, the same expert can take the next step to say that it would be rare for a child suffering from PAS to suffer genuine sexual abuse. By simply naming the child's antipathy for the parent as PAS, the lawyer has a defense.
...
The article attacks Dr. Gardner in strong terms. The commentator points out that the PAS theory is built upon criteria that Dr. Gardner invented and included in his widely discredited sex abuse legitimacy scale. It then goes on to argue that testimony regarding PAS should be excluded from the court both under the Daubert test and under the Frye analysis. Under Daubert, the trier of fact must rule on admissibility based on an expert's opinion as to whether the evidence is reliable and thus relevant. Under Federal Rule of Evidence 104(a), the trial judge must make a preliminary assessment of whether the reasoning or methodology underlying the testimony is scientifically valid. in other words, the court may consider whether the theory has been tested, whether it has been subjected to peer review and publication, and whether it has attracted widespread acceptance.(7)
...
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Considering that courts almost automatically give custody to the mother...
TreasonousBastard
Nov 2012
#4
Assuming both men and women are equally inclined to this sort of petty vengeance
4th law of robotics
Nov 2012
#3
Personally, I've found a lot of equal opportunity in the people I know in this spot
ProudToBeBlueInRhody
Nov 2012
#5
Mea culpa, I thought Bonobo had replied to me. I did pay attention to that name,
redqueen
Nov 2012
#20
And this, too, is certainly not evidence that most high conflict divorces involve domestic violence.
redqueen
Nov 2012
#26
No, it isn't. It is impossible to reply to posts made by people on your ignore list.
redqueen
Nov 2012
#49
Coming into this group and demanding people listen to you while simultaenously complaining that they
Warren DeMontague
Nov 2012
#50
It was written by a lawyer on behalf of a battered women advocacy organization
Major Nikon
Nov 2012
#22
It is primarily mothers who have custody and fathers who are alienated.
lumberjack_jeff
Nov 2012
#38
Though it is obvious to me that women engage in this more, it isn't vital to this discussion.
Bonobo
Nov 2012
#64
Where are your scientific, peer-reviewed studies proving that mothers do it more often?
redqueen
Nov 2012
#69
A member of a forum with over 20 banned members calls another forum
4th law of robotics
Nov 2012
#72
Also: scientific, peer reviewed studies regarding the patriarchy, objectification
4th law of robotics
Nov 2012
#76
The concept of PAS (at least Gardner's version of it) is not well accepted in the medical community
Major Nikon
Nov 2012
#10
It is real. It really does happen, and there are enough first-hand accounts to demonstrate it.
lumberjack_jeff
Nov 2012
#15
I think the concept is a real thing, I'm just not convinced of Gardner's version of it
Major Nikon
Nov 2012
#17
The extraordinary fight over "parental alienation syndrome" and what it means for divorce cases.
redqueen
Nov 2012
#35
"But no hypothesis so rooted in gender bias should be credited by medical science."
lumberjack_jeff
Nov 2012
#39
Yes, the MRA spin is extremely popular all over the net. Most people don't bother to argue.
redqueen
Nov 2012
#43
So when the rate of incidence doesn't support your claims, you change the subject
Major Nikon
Nov 2012
#54
Its a shame when the adults cant put their personal shit aside for the sake of the kids.
Warren DeMontague
Nov 2012
#66