2016 Postmortem

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)

141. Post hoc ergo prompter hoc. The go-to fallacy in place of supporting evidence.

Reply to green917 (Reply #71)

Thu Dec 15, 2016, 10:49 AM

Dec 2016

Post hoc ergo prompter hoc. The go-to fallacy in place of supporting evidence.

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

188 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

i would like to apologize to the bernie supporters [View all] okieinpain Dec 2016 OP

You're good in my book, my dear okieinpain! CaliforniaPeggy Dec 2016 #1

This message was self-deleted by its author Maven Dec 2016 #2

On "supporters:" Holding a grudge against populations is the antithesis of effective politics. Eleanors38 Dec 2016 #5

Can't disagree with anything you said. Maven Dec 2016 #42

There aree no "Bernie or Busters here, so please stop hat p ing on it. It reads like sour grapes. hedda_foil Dec 2016 #154

Sorry, but I disagree. One only needs to look around this particular forum and... George II Dec 2016 #179

I was a Clinton delegate to the DNC Gothmog Dec 2016 #157

Thank you for the factual information - HRC did wonder jump pulling off convention while Justice Dec 2016 #184

I doubt that the bernie or bust-ers exist in any great numbers dionysus Dec 2016 #162

Really? lastone Dec 2016 #17

Well said. TonyPDX Dec 2016 #27

Wow, the irony. Maven Dec 2016 #44

Check myself, hilarious! lastone Dec 2016 #59

Exactly! green917 Dec 2016 #71

Post hoc ergo prompter hoc. The go-to fallacy in place of supporting evidence. LanternWaste Dec 2016 #141

Yes, check yourself. Maven Dec 2016 #86

+1 jack_krass Dec 2016 #45

You're arguing that Clinton lost voters because she didn't apologize that Bernie lost? BobbyDrake Dec 2016 #57

Re-read what I said lastone Dec 2016 #66

No, it's not "obvious." BobbyDrake Dec 2016 #85

I realize bias such as yours forces us to hold others to a higher standard than we hold ourselves LanternWaste Dec 2016 #142

As if Sanders wouldn't have been skewered mercilessly. Hillary stayed completely away from . . . brush Dec 2016 #101

Quick questions GeoWilliam750 Dec 2016 #126

I'll say this brush Dec 2016 #135

And how many times does it have to be repeated........ Amaril Dec 2016 #151

Of course I read it. After seeing what the repugs did with the non-issue of emails . . . brush Dec 2016 #153

Let's be honest here. The issue isn't the actual things that Republicans say, it's how a candidate Exilednight Dec 2016 #161

We're talking about Sanders' baggage not Obama or Bill brush Dec 2016 #163

And exactly what baggage would that be? Exilednight Dec 2016 #164

You seem very well informed regarding GeoWilliam750 Dec 2016 #168

You forgot to add this: George II Dec 2016 #173

No. I am not in the least bit sarcastic GeoWilliam750 Dec 2016 #176

Well you won't get "what is perceived as horrible" from me. There are just too many..... George II Dec 2016 #180

Come on. You have to know some of this stuff brush Dec 2016 #174

This is all well known, and hardly "brutal" GeoWilliam750 Dec 2016 #175

So you were playing dumb before? You knew this baggage existed all along. brush Dec 2016 #185

"But I wouldn't say his supporters deserve an apology." LovingA2andMI Dec 2016 #35

Nope, I don't put you into any box at all. Maven Dec 2016 #48

Nobody has claimed we deserve an apology green917 Dec 2016 #72

Great. nt Maven Dec 2016 #87

'Many', 'some', 'not all', sure is nice not to have to back that smear up with facts or real numbers AtheistCrusader Dec 2016 #84

Stating that a candidate's supporters exploited a perceived weakness of his opponent Maven Dec 2016 #88

For what it's worth, I never expected an apology. AtheistCrusader Dec 2016 #90

OK. Sorry if my framing was divisive. Maven Dec 2016 #91

The important thing now is to look toward overhaul of the Party. And soon. Eleanors38 Dec 2016 #3

+1 n/t. okieinpain Dec 2016 #18

The Party doesn't need an overhaul. George II Dec 2016 #106

Losing a ton of ground each cycle makes it look like the party needs an overhaul. hellofromreddit Dec 2016 #109

What "ton of ground" did we lose this cycle? We gained seats in both Houses AND.... George II Dec 2016 #112

We've been losing ground since 2008's peak. hellofromreddit Dec 2016 #114

Yeah, because we win everywhere & every time we run a candidate... BlueProgressive Dec 2016 #129

But it needs some serious adjustment in leadership, messaging, KPN Dec 2016 #137

Without Major changes, the Party will become a 3rd party in a two-party system. Eleanors38 Dec 2016 #147

Thanks. closeupready Dec 2016 #4

This Eleanors38 Dec 2016 #6

Very nice of you. The quicker the past is left to be the past and we move forward all NRaleighLiberal Dec 2016 #7

I never had a grudge against anyone, I just wanted to see a democrat in the WH. I liked RKP5637 Dec 2016 #8

I think people ignore that Hillary had considerable baggage on the left. immoderate Dec 2016 #63

and a lot of it was carried by the same credulous people who thought obama was some pure, far-left, TheFrenchRazor Dec 2016 #78

I know a lot of lefties who didn't vote for her. Scruffy1 Dec 2016 #139

I knew a few lefties who felt this way Generic Other Dec 2016 #177

Yea, with a little help from the left, the FBI and the GOP leftofcool Dec 2016 #9

+1 La Lioness Priyanka Dec 2016 #10

Really? closeupready Dec 2016 #12

yeah really. nt La Lioness Priyanka Dec 2016 #13

Megadittos. Buzz Clik Dec 2016 #75

I'll add another really n/t kcr Dec 2016 #121

+ 2 cwydro Dec 2016 #61

Blaming "the left" FailureToCommunicate Dec 2016 #16

My sentiments exactly. As for the rest of my sentiments, I'll keep 'em to myself as they might.... Tarheel_Dem Dec 2016 #20

The "left"? So where does that put you? TonyPDX Dec 2016 #29

+1 SunSeeker Dec 2016 #37

Why would you thank me for that? Seems like it'd be better if Hillary Clinton had won el_bryanto Dec 2016 #46

My response precisely green917 Dec 2016 #81

+1 Buzz Clik Dec 2016 #74

I can't accept an apology elmac Dec 2016 #11

These weren't actually her emails anyway. That was a different fake issue. LisaM Dec 2016 #22

When you began treating other Democrats the same exact way? BobbyDrake Dec 2016 #32

I'm so tired of it all. LisaM Dec 2016 #41

Well said. riversedge Dec 2016 #156

Indeed radical noodle Dec 2016 #24

Thank you, elmac. and well said. n/t pnwmom Dec 2016 #25

Thank you. Maven Dec 2016 #50

Excellent points, and for that a well deserved Thank You (not apology). George II Dec 2016 #113

Thank you and K&R mountain grammy Dec 2016 #14

No worries, some will crybaby at your opinion. Rex Dec 2016 #15

no kidding. n/t. okieinpain Dec 2016 #19

I knew it would be an issue. It's all they had. But I didn't delude myself into thinking pnwmom Dec 2016 #23

Even Bernie dismissed the email issue as not central to winning. Rex Dec 2016 #26

It isn't amazing. Comey's letter bombs made the critical difference. pnwmom Dec 2016 #33

Sad that we live in a country where our elections are decided Rex Dec 2016 #38

Exactly. And over NOTHING. SunSeeker Dec 2016 #40

FBI had the emails since at least early October. They could have checked them all LisaL Dec 2016 #100

He must have known he had nothing before he issued the letter. SunSeeker Dec 2016 #123

What was in this "two feet of oppo research"? GeoWilliam750 Dec 2016 #170

Some examples from Newsweek reporter Kurt Eichenwald: pnwmom Dec 2016 #171

It bugs me that people like you don't realize that Bernie would have had pnwmom Dec 2016 #21

If a "2 foot thick file of opposition research" on Bernie existed, Hillary and DWS would TonyPDX Dec 2016 #34

Not true. Just as Bernie chose not to use the emails against Hillary, pnwmom Dec 2016 #49

Clinton and DWS used only what was needed. NCTraveler Dec 2016 #60

They stopped running against Sanders in April but Sanders attacked Dems till the convention. bettyellen Dec 2016 #64

+1 Paka Dec 2016 #94

There is no "if" about it. The RNC was armed and ready. pnwmom Dec 2016 #120

Not all people have to burn the Earth to win uponit7771 Dec 2016 #96

Sanders had LOTS more "baggage" than Clinton, except we just weren't allowed.... George II Dec 2016 #119

It would be so tremendously nice to finally put all of this to rest GeoWilliam750 Dec 2016 #172

Trump's oppo research on Sanders was said to be "brutal" Justice Dec 2016 #183

We can only imagine what they had in store for Martin O'Malley. StevieM Dec 2016 #150

They took a war hero's service -- John Kerry's -- and twisted it around pnwmom Dec 2016 #155

Excellent point...and here is another good one: What if Wes Clark had been the nominee in 2004? StevieM Dec 2016 #158

Move on everyone... It's important what is now not then... LakeArenal Dec 2016 #28

As you should green917 Dec 2016 #83

The email problem was not necessarily why Hillary was defeated.. INdemo Dec 2016 #30

What utter nonsense. Bernie "supporters" helped push the meme that everything & everyone.... Tarheel_Dem Dec 2016 #31

I agree..Hillary had more votes in the Democratic primary and the Presidential election...nt asuhornets Dec 2016 #39

And now it's like they want to be thanked and praised for their knife in our backs. BobbyDrake Dec 2016 #51

yup. La Lioness Priyanka Dec 2016 #67

True, I though I found something false about the OP... they were scorched Earth post April uponit7771 Dec 2016 #97

I was a Sanders supporter Dopers_Greed Dec 2016 #36

Thank you. I don't think he deliberately did that, but he did pnwmom Dec 2016 #52

Word n/t otohara Dec 2016 #62

should have would have AlexSFCA Dec 2016 #43

This Broke My Heart McKim Dec 2016 #79

She had to choose someone she would actually be able to work with. LisaL Dec 2016 #99

hmm AlexSFCA Dec 2016 #103

Thank you! denvine Dec 2016 #47

Bernie supporters said everything Jean-Jacques Roussea Dec 2016 #53

That is true. I also don't think it was just Bernie supporters saying this, and as one, I never JCanete Dec 2016 #125

OH PLEASE! montana_hazeleyes Dec 2016 #54

You're a class act okie Arazi Dec 2016 #55

Best wishes to you. n/t PoliticAverse Dec 2016 #56

Nice post Equinox Moon Dec 2016 #58

yes in oklahoma and yes it's a nightmare. n/t. okieinpain Dec 2016 #70

Post removed Post removed Dec 2016 #65

sorry, but i had to give credit were it was okieinpain Dec 2016 #69

This posts makes me think... NCTraveler Dec 2016 #108

It was the FBI's anti-Hillary people that actually made the problem what it was, not Hillary. ehrnst Dec 2016 #68

blah! Sanders was a one-dimensional candidate who stood no chance in the general. Buzz Clik Dec 2016 #73

so what do you think the ruskies had on bernie? cuz you know they had something.. nt TheFrenchRazor Dec 2016 #76

As a Bernie supporter, I don't think the emails were the issue. Clinton has a long past. It's more JCanete Dec 2016 #77

Clinton hate is generational on the Right.... Spitfire of ATJ Dec 2016 #98

totally true...generated in no small part by 30 years of this same shitty media. nt JCanete Dec 2016 #124

I never thought it would be a big deal HassleCat Dec 2016 #80

Exactly. Emails were over and done with until Comey wrote his letters. LisaL Dec 2016 #93

Bernie refused to let it be about personalities. Spitfire of ATJ Dec 2016 #82

Give it a freaking rest. Bernie had a big file on him too. LisaL Dec 2016 #89

... and the moon is made of green cheese... JudyM Dec 2016 #115

The Russians, FBI and proliferation of "fake news' etherealtruth Dec 2016 #92

Oh please...don't get me started... Demsrule86 Dec 2016 #95

How about those self-identified progressives who refused to vote for Hillary, or the media still_one Dec 2016 #102

As it turns out ... NanceGreggs Dec 2016 #104

They voted their "conscience," Nance mcar Dec 2016 #105

Yep. 50 shades of told ya so. nt ucrdem Dec 2016 #110

Apologies are not about the recipients. okieinpain is mending wounds that need mending. hellofromreddit Dec 2016 #111

Mending wounds by saying ... NanceGreggs Dec 2016 #116

Still ignoring the fact that this election should have been KPN Dec 2016 #138

Yes, it should have been. Probably would have if not for Bernie's divisive anti-Dem campaign. DanTex Dec 2016 #149

NOT! Do you really believe the GOP wasn't going to raise the same KPN Dec 2016 #167

Personally GeoWilliam750 Dec 2016 #169

I hear you. Who can we trust anymore? KPN Dec 2016 #181

Divide and conquer GeoWilliam750 Dec 2016 #182

The irony in this is astounding. Nt NCTraveler Dec 2016 #107

Stand up thing to do. Ken Burch Dec 2016 #117

There was no "hillary's email problem". It was an attack by Russia upon the United States. baldguy Dec 2016 #118

Many thought the email would get her because she's corrupt, evidence would be found. betsuni Dec 2016 #122

Your apology is accepted. Yes, we were right - and ridiculed for it - but, I take no pleasure in that. Fuhrer-Elect tRump is a nightmare from which we may never wake up. InAbLuEsTaTe Dec 2016 #127

I and my family (4 adults) were ardent Bernie supporters.... ReRe Dec 2016 #128

A nearly fictitious problem. Orsino Dec 2016 #130

Fuck that shit. Paladin Dec 2016 #131

Thank you - much appreciated. Now Bernie for 2020! Joe941 Dec 2016 #132

I don't apologize for exercising my voting rights as I see fit BainsBane Dec 2016 #133

As it was, Clinton mainly won in the slam dunk Dem states. BlueWI Dec 2016 #186

You forget one key group Sanders did not appeal to BainsBane Dec 2016 #187

BTW, I am a Black man. Maybe Sanders did make me white!! BlueWI Dec 2016 #188

10 years from now, trust me, no one will remember these damn emails. Sunlei Dec 2016 #134

There is absolutely no reason to apologize to any Sanders supporters Gothmog Dec 2016 #136

I backed Bernie in the primary. He said publicly that America was sick of hearing about the e-mails Mc Mike Dec 2016 #140

In my opinion neither was a great candidate. Scruffy1 Dec 2016 #143

It wasn't just the e-mails. Apology accepted, SMC22307 Dec 2016 #144

No need to apologize to me. I put the problem much more on the Corporate Press and harun Dec 2016 #145

Thanks, I HATE it when I'm right. joanbarnes Dec 2016 #146

As a Sanders supporter, I always thought the email "scandal" was bullshit Bucky Dec 2016 #148

Thank you budkin Dec 2016 #152

Thank you, that means a lot.. Raine Dec 2016 #159

You people are in for a nasty surprise. liquid diamond Dec 2016 #160

No. It's Bernie who needs to appologize to his supporters. R B Garr Dec 2016 #165

Don't want one. Don't need one. Iggo Dec 2016 #166

You are apologizing to Clinton critics about being "right" about a right-wing smear campaign? RelativelyJones Dec 2016 #178