Two most important documents in the history of the human race.

[Irish_Dem]

And no, not the gd commandments.


1. DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE In Congress, July 4th 1776

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed.


2. UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION September 17 1787

We The People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.


Edit to Add:

This is my belief:

The US Declaration of Independence, US Constitution and Bill of Rights are the most important human rights documents in the history of humanity.

They are sacred documents written by geniuses. Yes of course there were prior works they borrowed from.

But none of those works are in the same league as our founding fathers' documents.

The thought of "We The People" aways makes me tear up. It is the single most important concept in history.

[Midnight Writer]

1. July 4, 1776

[Irish_Dem]

2. Merci

Changed it.
Duh how did I miss that.

[BlueKota]

3. I think the Republicans have at the very least

already trashed the rights of life, liberty. and the pursuit of happiness. Womens' right to life is being jeopardized by forcing them to go through at risk pregnancies even if medical experts proclaim the fetus is no longer viable. Doctors aren't even allowed to use all treatment options to try and save the at risk woman, for fear they will lose their license or worse.

Not to mention they plan to take away some people's right to pursuit of happiness by enacting laws that would prevent some individuals the right to establish relationships that would make them happy.

[WarGamer]

4. Seriously?

Magna Carta?

There IS NO US Constitution without the Magna Carta.

[dutch777]

6. Exactly, the US founders built on documents and philosophies that pre-date the US

[Irish_Dem]

9. I know, I feel guilty about not mentioning the Magna Carta.

I tried to think of a way to slip it in. I really did.

Actually I had a first draft with the MC mentioned.

But it diluted the punchy impact I was going for.

So I had to go clean with DoI and Const.

At least you made a comment about it.
I feel better.

[muriel_volestrangler]

13. I'm not sure if the Declaration of Independence and US Constitution are the 2 most important, but probably more

than the Magna Carta. It's a written list of grievances and remedies of the barons at the time; it did not have that great a long term influence on rights or democracy for the world in general, or, for the most part, in England (it's not about democracy at all; in amongst it is the right, not just restricted to barons, to a fair trial).

[Charlie Chapulin]

20. I was going to say...

The Magna Carta was big step in the right direction.

[MiHale]

5. I get your point...

Maybe in the U.S.. The Code of Hammurabi and the Magna Carta should be included.

[Irish_Dem]

10. I don't think they are as important.

[Charlie Chapulin]

24. You are correct, sir.

I have seen and touched the Code of Hammurabi at the Louvre in Paris. An artifact muy importante.

[Disaffected]

7. The two? Really?

https://books.google.ca/books/about/Milestone_Documents_in_World_History_235.html?id=iKxaAAAAYAAJ&redir_esc=y#:~:text=Among%20the%20documents%20included%20in,Osama%20bin%20Laden's%20Declaration%20of

Key documents from all important world cultures are included, from the ancient Near East and ancient Egypt to the Greek and Roman Empires, medieval Islam, Renaissance Europe, and modern Africa and Asia. Constitutions, speeches, letters, acts, treaties, and legal cases are all covered. Among the documents included in the set are iconic legal and constitutional documents such as the Code of Hammurabi, Magna Carta, Meiji Constitution, and the Constitutive Act of the African Union; famous treatises such as the Plato's "Allegory of the Cave," the Communist Manifesto, and Osama bin Laden's Declaration of Jihad against America; important legislative acts from the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo to the Treaty of Nanjing to the Treaty of Versailles; and cultural and political declarations such as Martin Luther's 95 Theses, Gandhi's "Quit India" speech, and Nelson Mandela's inaugural address--From publisher description.

[Irish_Dem]

11. I believe the US Constitution and D of I are the two most important human rights docs

in the history of the world.

They are sacred documents and more important than the Bible.

This is my belief system.

[SamKnause]

8. The Supreme Court has shit all over both.

Corporations are NOT people.

Money is NOT speech.

Federal tax dollars should not finance religious schools.

Cops should have never been given qualified immunity.

All votes should have been recounted in 2000 etc.

[Prairie Gates]

12. Oh Lord

[Irish_Dem]

14. Most Americans are clueless about what it means to be American.

Being the grandchild of Irish immigrants makes me think quite differently from the rest of
Americans.

The Irish faced one thousand years of persecution, loss of rights at the hands of their oppressors.
The British.

For the Irish, it was illegal to practice their faith, to be educated, to read or write.
Forced to subsist at the barest minimum. Constant deliberate starvation
and ruthless barbaric treatment.

America is the greatest democracy in the history of the world.
Its founding fathers were true geniuses and enlightened thinkers for their time.

In my US military family, as a teenager grousing about one thing or another,
my first generation Irish Catholic Dad would tell me to get on my hands and knees
and thank God I lived in the greatest country on earth, the USA.

I rolled my eyes of course, I was just a kid and took it all for granted.

But the older I get, and especially with the loss of our democracy quite possible,
I see things quite differently now. My Dad was 100% correct.

[John1956PA]

31. The Greatest Generation prevented the Nazis from getting the bomb.

Thank you for your post.

[unblock]

15. we're a bit over 4% of the world population and a tiny percentage of human history

so while these documents are undeniably significant, in the context of the entirety of world history, not so much.

moreover, there's plenty of less-than-admirable aspects to those documents. the constitution, in particular, had quite a number of deep flaws due to the desire of the founders, who largely represented wealthy northerners and slaveholding southerners, who ultimately agreed on a series of anti-democratic provisions, many of which remain problematic to this day.

we addressed slavery and the right of women to vote, but the electoral college is a disgrace, senate representation by state isn't really consistent with a real democracy, the constitution is too hard to amend, the senate and the electoral college give too much power to smaller states for no good reason (these were largely a way to preserve slavery, which is no longer relevant; well, with donnie and the magats i should hedge that a bit...).

the declaration of independence largely objected to taxation without representation, and then the constitution doesn't even provide for the people to elect a president. historically, all 50 state have always had presidential elections (well, elections for electors to elect the president, anyway) but any state legislature could constitutionally simply appoint the electors.

the donnie/magat rise to power took great advantage of corrupt provisions in the constitution, such the way they took over the supreme court and managed to get in the white house and remain viable while a majority of america strongly disapproves of him.

the constitution is deeply flawed and we continue to pay a price.

[Doodley]

16. "We the people?" Really? That was written in a time of slavery, a time of great poverty, a time when women were second

class citizens. We wouldn't need a Democratic Party if it had real meaning. A fascist who wants to destroy our institutions and take away our democratic rights could be elected in November. What has the constitution done to stop that? Nothing. Not a darned thing. America is not the center of the universe, and the US Constitution is not one of the two most important documents in the world.

[patphil]

17. The Iroquois Nation heavily influienced the founding fathers, and some of their principles are in the US Constitution.

https://www.history.com/news/iroquois-confederacy-influence-us-constitution

[former9thward]

18. Nothing like being ultra USA centric.

[Hermit-The-Prog]

19. It is our government, we agree to give it certain powers and we reevaluate it frequently.

[PCIntern]

21. Both signed in my hometown.

[Martin68]

23. The first was written by a boy from my hometown.

[Martin68]

22. I'd have to disagree that the US Constitution was a work of genius because it originally preserved slavery and

denied woman the right to vote. But I would totally be on board posting the modern version with the amendments.

[róisín_dubh]

25. Chuckles in historian.

I get your point. But it's pretty blinkered.

I too am descended of Irish immigrants, who fled in the 1910s because it was far too violent to live there any longer and they weren't free living under English rule (ironically I now live in the UK and cannot get an Irish passport for love nor money). I would be far freer in Ireland now than in the US and my rights are under no threats from the Tories (may their power perish in 10 days from now).

So what does that say about the power of our founding documents?

[Ocelot II]

26. Start with Magna Carta.

[Wednesdays]

30. Indeed, the courts are flirting with abolishing the Magna Carta

In regards to TCF, if they say he is above the law in all regards. Turning back the clock to before the year 1215!

[SarahD]

27. I take a longer view of history.

The Magna Carta marks an important moment when the people stood up for themselves and broke the absolute authority of kings. Same idea when Martin Luther challenged the Pope. Our Constitution is a codification of many of the values and attitudes set forth in earlier documents, and its importance is reflected by the fact that so many other countries copied it.

[Wednesdays]

28. The Constitution and ALL of its amendments

Except maybe the 18th Amendment.

[Ocelot II]

29. We're not so special. Check out these constitutional provisions of another country:

Article 102.
Everyone has the right to the respect of their privacy and family life, their home and their communication. Search of private homes shall not be made except in criminal cases. The authorities of the state shall ensure the protection of personal integrity.

Article 104.
Children have the right to respect for their human dignity. They have the right to be heard in questions that concern them, and due weight shall be attached to their views in accordance with their age and development. For actions and decisions that affect children, the best interests of the child shall be a fundamental consideration.

Children have the right to protection of their personal integrity. The authorities of the state shall create conditions that facilitate the child's development, including ensuring that the child is provided with the necessary economic, social and health security, preferably within their own family.

Article 109.
Everyone has the right to education. Children have the right to receive basic education. The education shall safeguard the individual's abilities and needs, and promote respect for democracy, the rule of law and human rights. The authorities of the state shall ensure access to upper secondary education and equal opportunities for higher education on the basis of qualifications.

Article 110.
The authorities of the state shall create conditions under which every person capable of work is able to earn a living through their work or enterprise. Those who cannot themselves provide for their own subsistence have the right to support from the state...

Article 112.
Every person has the right to an environment that is conducive to health and to a natural environment whose productivity and diversity are maintained. Natural resources shall be managed on the basis of comprehensive long-term considerations which will safeguard this right for future generations as well. ...

https://lovdata.no/dokument/NLE/lov/1814-05-17

Don't you wish our Constitution included the right to privacy (it used to, but SCOTUS took it away), the right of children to their own dignity and integrity, the right to an education, the right to a job or state assistance if you can't provide for yourself, and the right to a clean and safe environment? We don't have those things but we act like We're Number One and all other countries are inferior. Are they?

[TomSlick]

32. I agree.

While the Magna Carta was no doubt important, I have never taken an oath to defend the Magna Carta.

That being said, If you're looking for predecessor documents for the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution, I suggest the Scottish Declaration of Arbroath of 1320.

"As long as a hundred of us remain alive, never will we on any conditions be subjected to the lordship of the English. It is in truth not for glory, nor riches, nor honours that we are fighting, but for freedom alone, which no honest man gives up but with life itself"

[canetoad]

36. I guess

That the 'History of the human race' equates to the history of TomSlick. Can't believe you would make this call, bro.

[TomSlick]

38. That's unkind.

The Magna Carta is an important predecessor document to the U.S. Constitution, but it pales when comparing when compared to the Constitution.

In the US, the Mayflower Compact may be a more important predecessor document.

[DavidDvorkin]

33. This is embarrassing.

[GenThePerservering]

34. This is such hyperbolic nonsense

It sounds almost trumplite.

They are not sacred.

They are not infallible.

I'm also grandchild of Irish immigrants - we do NOT think differently than everyone else...there are plenty of us around.

[canetoad]

35. Dream on

Magna Carta. Number 1 and only.

Your citation of two American foundation documents reinforces the inability of Americans to see beyond their own historic (well intentioned) failures.

* I've got a line for this: Kennel down kids.

[Celerity]

37. not the Constitution, it is very flawed

[SocialDemocrat61]

39. Really?

Article 1, Section 2

Representatives and direct Taxes shall be apportioned among the several States which may be included within this Union, according to their respective Numbers, which shall be determined by adding to the whole Number of free Persons, including those bound to Service for a Term of Years, and excluding Indians not taxed, three fifths of all other Persons.

Article 4, Section 3

No Person held to Service or Labour in one State, under the Laws thereof, escaping into another, shall, in Consequence of any Law or Regulation therein, be discharged from such Service or Labour, but shall be delivered up on Claim of the Party to whom such Service or Labour may be due.