How to end mass murder in schools and elsewhere

[Cyrano]

"Thoughts and prayers" are a politician's excuse to do nothing.

Getting rid of (almost) all the guns will end mass shootings in schools and elsewhere.

That's the solution.

It's the only solution.

I know many (most?) of you, and most Americans, don't agree.

So tell me the thousands of reasons I'm wrong.

[Irish_Dem]

1. Americans love guns more than their children.

They have made that clear for decades.

[Voltaire2]

27. A majority of Americans (61%) say it is too easy to legally obtain a gun in this country,

according to the June 2023 survey. Far fewer (9%) say it is too hard, while another 30% say it’s about right.
https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/07/24/key-facts-about-americans-and-guns/

[TheProle]

2. Do you suppose Americans will voluntarily give up their guns?

Last edited Thu Sep 5, 2024, 02:28 PM - Edit history (1)

Otherwise, it's high-incentive buybacks or governmental confiscation.

How do you propose "getting rid of (almost) all the guns"?

I am not trying to antagonize you; it's the real rub in all this.

[bullimiami]

3. I don't give a shit. This Republican free for all us not safe for anyone.

Any move to restrict or remove guns is ok with me.

After this carnage do you think a majority is happy with the status quo on guns?

[republianmushroom]

8. Many guns are owned be democrats too.

[bullimiami]

10. Don't care. Take them all, take some.

[republianmushroom]

15. Who is going to take them ?

Govt. don't think so, now who. There are approx. 120 guns per 100 citizens. Now who is going to take them ?

[MarineCombatEngineer]

12. Yep, I own a Colt .45 and an M-14,

the weapons I'm very familiar with due to my military experience, and I know that just on this board, there are numerous Dems who responsibly own firearms also.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

9. You damn well better give a shit.

So tell me just how would you get rid of most of the firearms in America that would pass Constitutional muster, especially with this SC?

Would you have law enforcement go door to door confiscating firearms?
How about the NG/Military, would you have them go door to door?
How about a law that mandated firearms be turned in, how many Americans would do so?

I know I would oppose such scenarios vehemently, as would millions of Americans, it just ain't going to happen.

[bullimiami]

19. Americans have a mental illness when it comes to guns.

Look around the world.

What in the ever living fuck do you see anywhere that makes our obsession with weapons sane.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

20. Be that as it may, and I disagree with you on that,

you didn't answer my question.

[bullimiami]

21. It's not my job to figure it out. The State of our Union wrt guns is BROKEN.

I’ll support, with my one pitiful vote, and my one big mouth, anyone who’s priority is to make it better and any measure to do so.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

22. So basically, you have no solution?

How do you think the majority of Americans would react to the govt. trying to get rid of all or most of the firearms in this country?

[bullimiami]

36. Why you insist on going in one step from unlimited guns to no guns as an argument I'm not understanding.

Are you happy with the school shootings?
Are you happy with 2 mass shootings a day?
Already almost 400 this year.

You’re the gun lover. Propose a solution.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

39. ....

You’re the gun lover.

And with that lie, you just lost me.
But do have a great day.

[bullimiami]

43. Sorry. Enthusiastic Gun Supporter.

[MichMan]

64. The OP stated getting rid of nearly all guns was the only solution

[Cirsium]

54. Not needed

A person does not need to have a solution to recognize that there is a problem.

[PufPuf23]

44. Here is a set of strategies not conclusive, spit balling.

1. Take assault weapons off the market.
2. Require gun owners to register guns, carry insurance and have secure storage including in travel.
3. Have strict rules that are enforced regards violent felons, domestic abusers, other mental health documented or under treatment, and the like possessing arms or selling or otherwise providing arms to such individuals.
4. Have gun learner permits for people less than 18 requiring gun safety classes and identifying the adult individual(s) or organization that must be present and are legally responsible when the minor is bearing or using a gun.
5. Liberal government gun buyback programs where purchased guns are subsequently destroyed.
6. Track ammunition.
7. Commercial licensed public gun depositaries where guns can be stored for whatever reason.
8. Federal laws in support of the above (politically impossible at present).

No mandates. Still can concealed carry. Over time there would be less guns in circulation and less crazy and minors with access to guns.

[kacekwl]

63. The poster stated the

obvious didn't say how to make it happen. They're not wrong.

[Cyrano]

18. Make private ownership illegal

without a permit and a good reason.

It may take a few decades for it to happen, but eventually, private gun ownership will become unacceptable to most of society.

And yes, there are people who need a gun for their profession or their personal safety. Such guns should be revolvers that fire no more than six bullets, or bolt action rifles that fire no more than five bullets. There will still be murders. But parents won't be afraid to send their children to school, and most people won't fear attending public gatherings.

Perhaps some form of the restrictions I've mentioned here will have to be sufficient until we evolve into a more mature/sane species.

I guess it remains to be seen if humanity was an evolutionary mistake and whether we'll thrive or self-destruct.

[Voltaire2]

29. I don't propose that.

I would instead strictly license all firearms. Anyone caught with an unlicensed firearm would face federal charges with time in prison.
One year to comply.

[bucolic_frolic]

4. Guns don't kill people

people with guns kill people.

The 2 need to be separated to some considerable degree.

[soandso]

37. People don't like hearing that

but it's true. This country has always been well armed and the AR 15 has been around a long time (since the 50s, maybe). We didn't used to have all of these mass shootings so why do we now? Too many crazy people.

[bucolic_frolic]

38. Ridiculous distortion of my post. Go back to MAGA, nt

[soandso]

41. Huh?

What a weird remark. Maybe just say you didn't mean what you said. I'm saying there's a mental health problem and it needs addressing.

[Skittles]

52. see that' the problem

repukes don't have solutions for mental health issues any more than they care about gun carnage

hell, they are fine with mentally ill people HAVING guns

[soandso]

57. What to do about it?

Maybe we need to look at some place like Switzerland to see how they handle it. I *think* (not sure) their population = militia and everyone is trained in firearms but I don't see any mass shootings going on there.

[Skittles]

51. yeah

like this:

https://fox2now.com/news/missouri/child-accidentally-shoots-kills-4-year-old-girl-in-north-st-louis/

[onecaliberal]

5. You are 💯 correct.

[GusBob]

6. Whelp, if that is the only solution

And most folks dont agree with it

It aint gonna happen that way, will it?

[republianmushroom]

7. You will never get rid of almost 'all the guns'. Not even close.

In 2017, there was estimated to be near 400 million guns in the United States between police, the military, and American civilians. Over 393 Million (Over 98%) of those guns are in civilian hands, the equivalent of 120 firearms per 100 citizens.

https://americangunfacts.com/gun-ownership-statistics/

This includes an estimated 434 million firearms in civilian possession, with about half, 214 million, of those entering the market since 1991. Of those, "America's Rifle," the AR-15 and similar semi-automatics dubbed Modern Sporting Rifles by the NSSF, account for an estimated 19.8 million, lending concrete numbers to the argument that such guns are in common use.

https://www.guns.com/news/2020/11/17/data-us-has-434-million-guns-20m-ars-150m-mags

Amazing isn't it !

[LexVegas]

11. I don't believe that rights should be taken away. That includes reproductive rights and the right to bear arms.

I do believe that there should be common sense controls in place.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

16. That's the way to do so, not like some here want to do it.

[returnee]

35. You realize, I hope...

…that what our actual right to bear arms according to the constitution is is hotly debated. The text of the Constitution refers “a well-regulated militia.”Know anyone who is in one? Also, in that context, it talks about bearing them, not owning them.
Just a thought.

[consider_this]

59. Right to bear what kind of arms???

There should be regulations on what types of weapons, and what types of bullets/magazines all have a right to.
I know the least about guns and ammo than probably anyone here, since I detest them, but other threads have made good points about the types of bullets, magazines, methods of reload, and attributes of specific guns, that it ought to be reasonable to decipher and legislate what the average citizen should have ability to possess that minimizes one's ability to mass slaughter.

[maxsolomon]

13. An asteroid hitting the earth and wiping out humanity is another solution.

No humans, no one to fire an MSSA at a school.

Why don't you lay out a path for getting rid of all the guns? Does it involve magic?

[WarGamer]

14. How is it a solution... if it's unworkable?

[Mysterian]

17. Other countries have passed laws that worked

Maybe we should start there.

[maxsolomon]

33. Other countries don't have absolutist anachronisms in their Constitution.

We've got a very high hurdle to clear and so far, it's insurmountable.

[Mysterian]

45. Also, most other countries don't have a traitorous major political party like the republicans,

that cares nothing for the welfare of the people.

[Tickle]

23. I've never shot a gun, I've held one

but never shot one. TBH I am thinking about applying for a gun permit. I'm old and I live alone except for my animals. I just don't have much trust anymore.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

24. If you don't mind my asking, but what state do you live in?

Very few states require a permit to own a firearm.
In my state of AZ, as long as one is not convicted of a felony or domestic violence, there is no requirement to have a permit to own, we don't even need a CCL to open or conceal carry.

Check out your state laws and I would strongly urge you to get extensive training on the do's and don'ts and lots of range time and if you still want to purchase a firearm, make sure it's one you're comfortable with and get a good gun locker.
Good luck with your decision.

[Tickle]

46. Thank you I appreciate your response

I live in CT, and I have no idea of our laws, but I will soon find out.

[Arthur_Frain]

31. You'd be better off with bear spray.

Unless you’re willing to do all that marinecombatengineer suggested. And that’s a ton of work. A canister of counter-assault by your door would be safer, and probably fix 90% of the highly unusual encounters you’ll run into for the foreseeable future.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

32. Great post and I would agree with you.

[maxsolomon]

34. Don't.

"I need to defend myself against people with guns" is the same logic that has led to firearm saturation in this country.

[Scrivener7]

25. When the shooter is a minor, charge the parents. That's been way too long in coming.

[Tickle]

47. that's the ticket! NT

[Scrivener7]

48. And universal background checks and a gun registry.

Really, I think those three things would go a long, long way to solving the problem.

[lees1975]

26. Getting rid of stupid politicians is a better solution.

Democrats have talked about, and proposed common sense gun control for decades. It can be done. It won't stop all mass shooting. But it will drastically slow it down.

[Jim__]

28. Getting rid of (almost) all the guns is a problem in itself. It's not going to happen anytime soon.

We need to take some interim stops to try to at least slow it down in the near-term.

[Arthur_Frain]

30. The constitution for a start.

But we lack the political will to do what we can under our current laws, lax as they may be, so I don’t see the drive for a constitutional convention anytime soon, and even if we could, it would get derailed by the money.

You’re right of course, get rid of the firearms and you eliminate a huge portion of the problem. But that’s not rational.

[bdamomma]

40. Hmm.....

attaching this Wikipedia article. Interesting map, We are in the blue as Permissive, so sad.

Gun control

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_control

President Biden's policy

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-61938109

[cyclonefence]

42. You're not wrong

Get rid of all of them sez I. Maybe cops need guns? Maybe they don't, not really, not on a daily basis. I guess the Armed Forces need guns (it's right there in their name, after all), and people who live in places where if they don't have guns to kill food, they don't eat. I'm willing to let them have guns for hunting. But I don't see why anyone else needs a gun. and I see lots of reasons (more every day, it seems) why they don't.

[bcbink]

49. good mental health

Good mental health care is the solution.
While improved gun control will help with the consequences of ignoring people with mental health issues it is not the solution.
The effects of bullying, abuse and neglect on children and adults need to be given the attention that any other public safety crises receives.
Guns, bombs and poisons may be the weapon.
I think the focus should be on the person.
All the people. We all carry burdens that from time to time feel like they may crush us. We all do not have a social or family safety net.
We must do better at looking at and out for each other.
Mental health should matter as much as obesity and diabetes.

Sorry this is so long,
Bernie

[Initech]

50. The biggest problem standing between us and a gun ban is right wing talk shows.

And Fox News. They are the road block to any meaningful legislation being passed. If we want to do something, we have to get past them first.

[Kaleva]

53. Not wrong but is it achievable?

[MarineCombatEngineer]

55. Probably not in our lifetime, this will be up to the younger generations to solve this, if possible.

[Kaleva]

58. Yes

[doc03]

56. We never had problem when hunters had a shotgun or rifle until the AR15 became popular. I suppose

that will start the argument the semi-auto rifle came over 100 years ago, that is true. But the semi auto
never became widely used until the late 50s or 60s. Back 50 years ago a hunter had a double barrel or pump action shotgun and
a bolt action or lever action rifle for large game. Most of your hunting weapons could handle 5 or less rounds. People took pride
in taking game with a single shot. We didn't need 30 or 100 rounds. It would be hard to conceal a hunting gun in those days
now with the AR15 you can easily conceal them.

[RainCaster]

60. Let's look at how other countries have done it

NZ
https://www.guncontrol.nz/the-facts-1
Here, common sense has involved making gun ownership a privilege and not a right. Assault rifles are largely banned, and yet life goes on. Hunters are still able to shot deer and pests as they choose. Severe limits on pistols.

A comparison to other countries
Here's a good comparison to Canada, UK, Japan, Israel and Australia. All use different, yet effective means of limiting firearms.

[Torchlight]

61. Any problems created by humans can be solved by humans

Though it often appears many of the obstacles on the pathwayway to a solution are held more dearly than the solution itself.

[ecstatic]

62. The Supremes opened the floodgates to ignore and/or change the Constitution as needed.

They forced trump onto Colorado's ballot when he's clearly barred after his insurrection attempt.

I don't necessarily think all guns need to be banned but there definitely needs to be strong and ongoing oversight (psych testing, periodic home inspections, liability insurance, etc). It's crazy that we need car and home insurance but gun owners can just place everyone at risk with no means of making victims "whole" after an incident.

[bluestarone]

65. Hell, we have a constitution that gives every citizen the right to bear arms, 1st problem out of the shoot

Is DEFINE arms? We can't even decide that. My way of thinking is we will never solve that problem. So our only choice (i feel) is to regulate a persons age to purchase a gun. We could also control registration of guns. (this includes gun shows) We need to limit magazine to 3 shells. (starting point) I'm thinking only full control of the White house Senate and House will allow this to be done. (full control! that stick together) If we succeed in this, i feel we could do more.