Tomasky: Why Does No One Understand the Real Reason Trump Won?

[Nevilledog]

https://newrepublic.com/post/188197/trump-media-information-landscape-fox

No paywall link
https://archive.li/e29Os


I’ve had a lot of conversations since Tuesday revolving around the question of why Donald Trump won. The economy and inflation. Kamala Harris didn’t do this or that. Sexism and racism. The border. That trans-inmate ad that ran a jillion times. And so on.

These conversations have usually proceeded along lines where people ask incredulously how a majority of voters could have believed this or that. Weren’t they bothered that Trump is a convicted felon? An adjudicated rapist? Didn’t his invocation of violence against Liz Cheney, or 50 other examples of his disgusting imprecations, obviously disqualify him? And couldn’t they see that Harris, whatever her shortcomings, was a fundamentally smart, honest, well-meaning person who would show basic respect for the Constitution and wouldn’t do anything weird as president?

The answer is obviously no—not enough people were able to see any of those things. At which point people throw up their hands and say, “I give up.”

But this line of analysis requires that we ask one more question. And it’s the crucial one: Why didn’t a majority of voters see these things? And understanding the answer to that question is how we start to dig out of this tragic mess.

The answer is the right-wing media. Today, the right-wing media—Fox News (and the entire News Corp.), Newsmax, One America News Network, the Sinclair network of radio and TV stations and newspapers, iHeart Media (formerly Clear Channel), the Bott Radio Network (Christian radio), Elon Musk’s X, the huge podcasts like Joe Rogan’s, and much more—sets the news agenda in this country. And they fed their audiences a diet of slanted and distorted information that made it possible for Trump to win.

*snip*

[Initech]

1. I have literally been saying this for 12 fucking years now!

The propaganda is the problem. It's always been the problem. And why we cannot have nice things in this country.

[William Seger]

10. Me too, but up until Tuesday, I still believed we could overcome it

I was wrong, and I doubt we'll get a second chance.

[Initech]

20. Nope. It's too strong.

Perhaps we could have done something about it when Fox was the only entity. But now Fox has spread tentacles all over the country and even the world. We may never overcome it. And I have absolutely no doubt that Vladimir Putin and Rupert Murdoch are in cahoots with each other.

[William Seger]

26. Well, expecting it would collapse under its own dishonesty sure didn't work

[Initech]

48. I thought the bubble would be bursting with this election, but it didn't.

But it is currently primed and ready to explode, and it won't be pretty when that happens.

[bdamomma]

169. Oh yes,

if you listen to Rand Rhodes 8th November on You Tube free on Fridays, she explained it quite well. We are in the "eye" of the hurricane, which is calm, but when it passes the back end is the worst and we have not experienced that yet.

The felon has promised a bloodbath, so when you say. During the inauguration there will be protests of possibly with young people, that is when he will enact the Insurrection Act.

[Initech]

133. Nope. It's time to burst that bubble by force if necessary.

[Shoonra]

117. I don't know why/how Harris lost

I honestly cannot fathom how or why Kamala - and the whole Democratic slate - lost. Kamala's campaign was almost letter perfect; certainly more well conducted than previous winners'. If someone told me that Trump managed to steal the election and falsify the results, or that Trump hyponitized the whole electorate, I might believe them. But the fact is Trump actually won in an election (not the campaign, but the vote count) that was clean and honest.

All my political notions are shattered. But here is a cruel fact: For the next four years Trump will have his way. We can protest but, let's face it, he has a mandate (and if it wasn't overwhelming it was enough to give him the House and the Senate, which is plenty enough). Things may be very rough and the damage that Trump can do in four years might not be fully repaired in my lifetime. Gee, I wish I could say something encouraging.

[Jon Waters]

132. RACISM AND SEXISM PUT THE CONVICTED FELON BACK IN OFFICE...

Seriously, the majority of white women and Latino men in America voted for Trump (essentially voting against their own best interests). Add in the overwhelming white male base for Trump, and there's your answer.
We need to stop over complicating this. It is not rocket science.

[dickthegrouch]

140. The election was neither clean nor honest

SCROTUS put paid to all notions of either.

The only thing we can do now, IMHO is hammer on equal protection. If the president can do it, so cane, money be damned. This is no longer a country of law and order, consequences, or reliable rights. We are going to have a hell of a time preventing the descent into facism that seems to be coming.

[Meadowoak]

160. Because she's a black woman.

[OrangeJoe]

136. Trump didn't win. The Democrats lost

Trump got almost exactly the same number of votes he got in 2020. (74 million). The Dems got about 11 million FEWER votes (Harris 70 million; Biden 81 million in 2020). So the problem my friends is simple. The Democrats are not proposing solutions to the problems faced by a majority of the public.

[CaptainTruth]

21. Willful ignorance combined with pervasive propaganda.

[Tadpole Raisin]

28. And they have a decades long lead in building their echo chamber,

knowing that people will just listen and believe. No verification needed. After all, they are a trusted source and would never lie.

[Different Drummer]

58. What the average Fox News viewer believes:

"Fox News said it, I believe it, that settles it."

[Tadpole Raisin]

63. lol, Bullwinkle would be a far better president along with his friend Rocky.

Now as for Boris and Natasha… we’ll just let that one go for now even though we know they are welcome in the new order.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

64. It's so beyond Fox at this point.

There are now two (or more) realities.

We are aghast at this or that behavior or policy - they don’t know most of that behavior or policy exists.

[Justice matters.]

91. That, and they haven't "suffered" enough yet to just begin to pay attention.

Or, they more-or-less "suffer" but only pay attention to the lies of the autocrats and they believe them.

If the proposed tariffs are imposed and they "suffer" more in their bank accounts, will they search for the true information?

Doubtful. The autocrats will try to make them believe through their mass medias it's the Democrats' fault and they will probably believe them again.

[AZ8theist]

156. There is no "doubt" about it.

The Trumptards are so fucking ignorant they are unable to even THINK anymore....

[Scully]

69. Dig deeper...

Yes. It's absolutely the propaganda, driven by a hyper-consolidated media market, that influenced voters over an extended period of time, and yes, why Trump got more votes- but the propaganda wasn't spread for shits and giggles. I don't think it was spread for Trump though, or for the GOP, or hell, for the United States even. Trump was just the means to an end. I mentioned this in a thread from Wednesday, but I think the end game has always been more global in nature and getting US out of the way as a trusted global partner was a necessary step.

Think about it. North Korea is on the ground in Ukraine, helping Russia. Trump comes along, pulls US support for Ukraine, and Russia is going to win. Then, what's to stop Russia from continuing on to Poland? NATO? Well, maybe, but a NATO without US won't get far, and Trump has already threatened to pull out of NATO. So you have Europe likely embroiled in a war against Russia and North Korea. Good times, right? Throw Iran and China in there and you can see where this is going- and it is possible only with US out of the way. THAT's the end game- and for all of our democracy-is-dying terror, we're just pawns. It isn't to say what we're fighting for and scared of isn't true and right, but it's bigger than us, and I really think this time we were just...in the way.

[KPN]

113. Maybe ... but it could just be a symbiotic relationship. I'm

to think inclined it’s more the latter.

[MadameButterfly]

150. This whole thing is beign run by Putin

It's a Russian takover from the grooming of Trump to Ruassian misinformtion and actual tutoring in phone calls between Trulmp and Putin.

But none of this would be possible without the right wing media. There was a time when there were rules and standards in media (before Reagan) and campaign donation (Citizens United). Truth is being drowned out by lies and there are too many any more to reach the misinformed masses.

[pat_k]

76. As some may have noticed...

... I've posted some variation of the following countless times over my years here. Often the feedback is a rejection. That it's just stupid people or some such.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=19612951

It's not. I lost my very intelligent mother-in-law to the far right noise machine when she moved to Florida and started watching FOX. I know others who have lost loving friends and family as they were transformed.

[marybourg]

121. Exactly what happened in my family.

She was a NY Dem. Became a FL rwnj in later years.

[pat_k]

129. It happened so fast.

I was mystified when on a visit about 6 months after she had moved she started saying things that were totally at odds with what I knew of her (how unions had destroyed the country, how welfare killed all ambition, and worse).

My partner (her son) got it immediately and asked her if she watched FOX down there (this was 2006 or 7). She had been. We were in NJ (where she and her husband had been big in the local democratic club years before, when they had such things.)

Anyway, he had the patience of a saint (He was Senator here on DU before he died in 2011) and listened carefully and asked questions that seemed to sort of reconnect her the core person who had spent a life coming to a world view that was completely inconsistent with what she was spewing. It seems she was deprogrammed, at least a bit. But no. Every visit the awful notions would slip through, but generally she kept those thoughts to herself, perhaps to escape seeing our pain and having to talk about it. I came to the conclusion that it wasn't just watching FOX in isolation. The whole community where she lived did. And she was connected to those people day-to-day. We're social creatures. I think she knew her family would never shun her, but this new community might if she didn't fit in. I don't think that piece was a conscious choice. Just my theory anyway about our wiring as social creatures. (The community there was pretty much a bunch of nice prefab homes on a golf course on a little lake.)

Anyway, I suspect this kind of tragedy has played out in so many families and groups of friends. We can't dismiss them as evil or lacking humanity. I am very frustrated with, and saddened by, the blanket denigration.

[luvallpeeps]

139. Longer than that!

Since the Obama years even.

[Autumn]

171. Way back to the Clinton years.

[FDRFTW]

152. I've been saying this since 1984.

[mahina]

154. Me too. Here's a genius solution to the silos: The Tangle newsletter. This American Life had a great segment on Sat

https://www.thisamericanlife.org/845/a-small-thing

Act One
A Tiny Thing That Gives Me Hope
A politically divided couple searches for a news source they both can trust. (26 minutes)

The original version of this story first appeared on Question Everything, a co-production of KCRW and Placement Theory.

By Brian Reed and Zach St. Louis; Edited by Jonathan Goldstein and Robyn Semien

[Pepsidog]

175. Hillary said it first, a vast rw conspiracy....

[Irish_Dem]

2. Some of the propaganda supplied by Russia and China.

So there was cheating involved.
The GOP has cheated before and will do so again.

Not hard to understand at all.

[jayschool2013]

3. I just read the same article on the New Republic site

So true. Partisan media have won the battle for eyeballs, and the most powerful partisan media are right-wing hacks with zero regard for the truth.

[William Seger]

22. I think that's definitely A real reason, not THE real reason -- no such thing

You can identify several reasons different people voted for Trump, but in the end, he won because he got more votes.

(Edit: Oops, I meant to reply to the OP.)

[Yavin4]

4. Fox News pushed the immigrant crisis story 24/7

Even on their business channel during the day, they ran immigration stories.

[Tommymac]

5. We lost this in 1988 when Reagan eliminated The Fairness Doctrine. nt

[moose65]

35. That's not really true

The Fairness Doctrine did not apply to cable networks- only broadcast networks. So it wouldn’t have affected Fox News.

However, it DID apply to AM radio stations. The rise of right-wing hate radio can be attributed at least partly to getting rid of the Fairness Doctrine.

[yardwork]

6. Yes. It's this.

EarlG posted a similar point in his OP. The media - in all its permutations- is controlled by billionaire sociopaths who have very detailed data about how everybody thinks. They target messaging to groups, exploiting each group's fears and resentments.

So far, the only demographic that appears to be reality-based are African American voters, but the propaganda is starting to peel off the young and some men even among Black people.

I wish that only Black women could vote. We'd have a paradise.

[brush]

46. On Black men, I have to push back. Black voters voted for trump the same as in 2020, 12 percent.

It was a rethug wish/hope/talking point that Black men were switching to trump. Some younger ones with little knowledge of history did, but overall Black voters vote blue in the high 80th percentile. The highest of any ethnic group. Black women over 90%, Black women a little under 90%.

[yardwork]

86. You're right.

I'd seen some early exit polls that suggested a possible swing of 1% of Black men toward Trump (which would be a tiny shift anyway), but this Washington Post analysis says even that didn't happen.

The problem continues to be white voters. A majority of this large group favors Republicans every election, and they turned out in great numbers for Trump again.

Gift article:

https://wapo.st/3Cm0Enu

On Tuesday, Trump made inroads with Hispanic voters, younger voters and voters without a college degree. At the same time, more than 80 percent of Trump’s voters are still White men and women.

[Rstrstx]

90. Looking at an NBC exit poll

Black men went for Harris 77/21 while black women went for Harris 91/7. Age also was a factor: blacks under the age of 65 went for Harris about 83/15 while ones 65+ went for Harris 93/5.

The black vote held much more strongly than the Latino vote. Trump only lost Latinos by 6 (52/46), while winning Latino men by 12 (43/55). Latino women went for Harris 60/38. The most sobering thing about the Latino vote is that voters under 30 were virtually identical to whites (49/49 whites vs 49/47 Latinos).

[brush]

110. Ahhhh...those numbers don't add up. See post 65.

[Rstrstx]

111. The exit poll is here

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2024-elections/exit-polls

I had to refresh several times since I have an ad-blocker installed.

[brush]

112. See post 65 for what WAPO found.

[nmmi]

155. Do you mean post 86?

Last edited Sat Nov 9, 2024, 08:19 AM - Edit history (3)

#65 doesn't have anything on polls
#86 has this gift article link -- https://wapo.st/3Cm0Enu
which morphs into https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2024/11/08/trump-voter-demographic-shifts-election/

Methodology

The 2024 network exit poll results (https://www.washingtonpost.com/elections/interactive/2024/exit-polls-2024-election/?itid=lk_inline_manual_51) are from interviews of 22,914 randomly selected voters as they exited voting places across the country on Nov. 5; as well as from early in-person voting locations and through live telephone, text-to-web or by email. The poll was conducted by Edison Research for the National Election Pool consortium of ABC News, CBS News, CNN and NBC News. Results are preliminary and will change as additional interviews are included and results are weighted to match vote tallies by region. Like other surveys, exit polls are subject to sampling error and other sources of error.

I looked at that, and I saw the same 2024 numbers as the poll Rstrstx post in #111, namely
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2024-elections/exit-polls
for the groups I checked...

What is significantly different or doesn't add up?
TIA

Edited to add
Looking at the subthread beginning with #6, if the issue is the Black shift from 2020 to 2024. According to the Washington Post link,

Black men down-shifted: from a margin favoring the Democratic candidate of 60% in 2020 to 56% in 2024,
while Black women up-shifted from a margin of 81% to 84%.

there's no Black overall in the Wapo, but yes, judging from the above, Black overall seems to have been about the same margin in 2024 as in 2020, which I don't see anyone disagreeing with in the subthread (and Black women voted in larger numbers than Black men per the NBC data, so the 4% downshift of Black men coupled with the 3% upshift of black women comes to less than a 1% Black overall difference when weighted by the sizes of the two demographics)

Another edited to add - the shifts may be well within the margin of sampling error.

Another issue is turnout - I read that overall tRump got about the same number of votes as in 2020 but the Democratic candidate got millions fewer. This is true of some of the demographic subgroups too.

[Jit423]

143. Ah, but white women voted for and won body autonomy in several states and then

then voted for Trump giving him the margin for victory in the blue wall states.

But shame on the Dems that did not bother to vote at all.

[DFW]

157. Nonvoters are deadly to us

Unless Democrats all vote, anyone who says, “we got this” needs to be told, “not yet, you don’t.”

Just ask Elise Slotkin, Tammy Baldwin, Jacky Rosen or (we hope) Rubén Gallego.

[Disaffected]

7. And social media.

Gives every kook, demagogue and foreign adversary a world-wide, essentially unhindered, soapbox to spew their malevolence..

[misanthrope]

49. Yep, the column in the OP

mentions how the internet injected steroids into the right-wing propaganda network. I think that is every bit if not more pervasive than the TV.

[Initech]

51. Honestly, I think if I could pinpoint American society's downfall in one single event...

It would be Gamergate. That was where everything went completely fuck up. That gave birth to the likes of Andrew Tate and Alex Jones and the virulent, rampant misogyny and hatred that runs wild through the darkest corners of the internet. It led to the rise of Trump and the alt-right.

It was all because some assholes couldn't handle a woman beating them at their own game and writing about it. It can all be tied back to that one incident. And it happened when we weren't looking.

[FakeNoose]

73. A lot of folks here on DU don't know what Gamergate is, or how it came about

I have heard of it but I don't know many details. Perhaps you might consider filling us in?

[AZSkiffyGeek]

79. All the same players, all the same methods

The did video games, comics, sci-fi novels and took everything they learned and applied it to the presidential race.
Hell, there’s a liberal podcaster who gets shared a lot here who was supportive of Gamergate.

[Initech]

89. It's time for some edumacation!

So Gamergate was basically a coordinated harassment campaign against a female journalist who created a text based game, and it just sent the dark corners of the internet into a needless frenzy. It's a bit more complicated than that, but Wikipedia does a good job of explaining it:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gamergate_(harassment_campaign)

[SharonAnn]

101. Rush Limbaugh destroyed my workplace. The men became domineering and loved humiliating female coworkers.

It was awful. It changed from a more or less egalitarian workplace in about a year.

[world wide wally]

8. How about the fact that Americans are mean and spiteful when given the chance to be

[whathehell]

34. How 'bout the fact of that being way too broad a brush?

that oversimplifies greatly in the face of a close election with many variables?

[Srkdqltr]

47. I wholeheartedly agree.

Even people who do charity set boundaries. Many don't want to give to other countries.

[Blue Owl]

9. The sane-washing of an insane criminal

[Ligyron]

144. He's everything they wish they were.

Hes their Hero.

[markodochartaigh]

11. Expecting

an ignorant, propagandized, apathetic electorate to produce good results in a democracy is like throwing weed seeds randomly across the desert floor and expecting a harvest of wheat.

[BattleRow]

16. Evidently there's far more chaff than wheat in those depleted fields

[kentuck]

12. Right on target.

I was working on this very idea.

Also, they persuaded their people not to watch "fake news". They would be told what to watch and what to believe. FOX is the leader. They did not see the same "news" that you saw. It ws excluded from them seeing it. Do you think they saw Trump giving a blowjob to a microphone? Do you think they saw the many threats that Trump made. They saw a different Trump than you and I.

The problem was, and is, that the so-called mainstream media does not call out these propaganda outlets for excluding information from their viewers. They only wring their hands and wish that they had a their very own propaganda network, like Donald Trump.

That is not good enough.

[moose65]

36. So true

They don’t see the same news coverage that we see.

Plus, social media only shows you what it thinks you want to see. I cringe when I go to some troll’s facebook page and see the filth that they share or post. Some people spend all day posting political shit on Facebook. It’s ridiculous.

[RockRaven]

13. One of the reasons I am so pessimistic about American voters/society is that

media diet is a CHOICE that every person makes every day, not something which just happens to a person, but most people are passive and unthinking about their consumption.

[BattleRow]

19. Media doesn't have the list of ingredients on the label as most "consumables" are required to.

Most especially hazardous to your health disclosure,as in cigarettes and alcohol.

[misanthrope]

50. Hold on there

After Trump, Musk and RFK Jr are done, the consumables might not have those ingredients and health disclosures listed anymore.

[BattleRow]

118. Why bother when cats and dogs will be the consumables

until we are consumed aka Soylent Green.

[brush]

14. Biden beat trump in 2020 with the same environment/political facts mentioned...

FOX, OAN, NEWSMAX, Rogan were all there then doing their propaganda. So IMO the logical conclusion is that something is fishy with the lower vote totals for both candidates despite the huge canvassing effort Dems put on.

Was it trump's and Johnson's secret? Why did trump double down with his side calling Puerto Ricans garbage and Vance calling Harris trash in the last couple of days before the election. One trumper even inferred that Harris had a pimp.

Was the fix already in and they knew it?

Something was up.

[calimary]

42. I want to know what that "little secret" was - AND IS.

And I want to know NOW!!!!!

[E. Normus]

61. Because my friend,

Biden is a white man. America seemingly will never bring itself to vote in a woman President. And certainly not a woman of color. Despite the consequences. This will be forever to our shame!

[mountain grammy]

104. As much as I don't want to hear this it's true.

Biden is a white man.. Even Obama being black was ok cause. 1. he's male and 2, he's half white.
I can see 10+ million men not voting, and a few million more voting trump rather than vote for a black woman. white men are scared, and plenty of white women too and it's scared of losing "their place"

Just my opinion. worth absolutely nothing.

[SunSeeker]

105. THIS

[calimary]

123. Well, the "gotta be a man" thing probably does explain it.

But seriously? Voting for that orange beast makes men feel powerful? Or, even worse, makes women feel safe or protected?

SERIOUSLY?????

[DemonGoddess]

130. With some of those women

I have to wonder if it isn't jealousy

[bcbink]

125. this

This and I'm afraid that they just plain agree with him. The like him and would do all the nasty things he does if they had his power and money.
I live in rural upstate NY. A tiny blue dot in a sea of red. Friends, coworkers, even some family.
We make excuses for them.
I have none left.
It's cold and lonely.

[brush]

149. That I don't believe. Hillary was ahead in the polls until that damn Comey sent his letter to Congress.

The bastard had a long-standing grudge against her and just had to get even with his bogus re-opening of her emails. Thanks to her one aide's laptop...I forget the dumb fucker's name. It's not worth looking up.

[AdamGG]

148. "Harris' pimps" was said at the Madison Square Garden rally

The one comment about Puerto Rico being an island of garbage got all the attention, but that was one of the tamer comments compared to a lot of the other things that were said.

The fact that they chose to double down on the gutter level hate as their high profile closing message makes all the pundit discussions about flaws with the Democrats' messaging pretty frustrating.

I think the OP is 1000% correct. The right is getting their information from coordinated propaganda. They have no clue that Trump will slash their health insurance and social security. It's like asking people in North Korea to have a knowledgeable view of their government.

Dump already was doing this in his first term, but I suspect that he will nearly exclusively talk to reporters from right wing outlets and will pressure others to give coverage that he likes to get access.

[Mr. Sparkle]

15. The right wing media empire is too big and too dangerous

most of these outlets flourish in un-regulated spaces in the spectrum, radio, cable and the internet. No one watches the networks for news which is heavily regulated by fcc.

[h2ebits]

54. Hate radio

There is a wide swath of the US that gets their news from the radio and local newspapers only. They have been fed non-stop hate and lies for many years. Rush Limbaugh being the classic example. Look at the electoral map and you can see it.

The Internet is not available or very poor connections to a wide swath of the US.

The poor cannot afford the cost of the Internet.

We are very isolated from social interaction because of social media. Getting together face-to-face has decreased a lot.

More. . . .

[Initech]

142. Nope, news has been replaced by opinion.

And you know how the old saying about opinions goes.

[ancianita]

17. Any suggestions how to overcome the messaging of the next four years?

The new republic only focuses on the problem and offers no solution to the right wing media it names. And so...

Fox News (and the entire News Corp.),
Newsmax,
One America News Network
the Sinclair network of radio and TV stations and newspapers, iHeart Media (formerly Clear Channel),
the Bott Radio Network (Christian radio),
Elon Musk’s X, the huge podcasts like Joe Rogan’s ...

will prevail and thrive over the next four years.

Any suggestions?

[Clouds Passing]

23. Wealthy Dems need to start creating and/or buying media outlets and grow them fast!

[ancianita]

38. Hopeful that you're right and that they could overcome. But why should they invest in counter messaging?

They've got no incentive. They'll do fine no matter what oligarchy runs the US government.

In my view, there is no way out of this oligarchy shit pit.

What we saw this time is what we'll see again:

donors used a mushroom cloud of money to convert an election into an auction, with almost nobody in the press or electorate asking what exactly was being sold. And when that happens — when one side’s billionaires outbid the other side’s billionaires in a clearance sale of a political contest — that’s not a defense of democracy.That’s burning the democracy village down while pretending you’re trying to save it.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1016389180#post8

Our only hope is that the military -- that swears an oath to the US Constitution -- refuses to follow an unlawful order and takes down the commander-in-chief who breaks their oath with the unlawful order. US military leaders are the best educated leaders in the world. They would know how to reset civilian command with through the law of succession.

[Clouds Passing]

135. Thank you for your hope. I have been losing mine.

[ancianita]

138. I hear you. But the oligarchy shit pit is where we are. We have to do something, even depend on our military if need be.

[hadEnuf]

62. Yes!

We couldn't or wouldn't pass any laws to keep the media honest so that is the only way left.

[Kaleva]

18. About 5% of the adult population watches Fox News

What percentage of adults regularly listen to or watch the sources listed?

If the OP doesn't know, then it's just a guess, an opinion, and not an answer.

[hadEnuf]

59. The whole political landscape has changed since Fox news.

Most of the RW people you talk to have no idea what Trump has actually said and done because they get a sanitized and sane washed view of him on stations like Fox news.

Only 5% watch Fox? That just doesn't add up.

[Kaleva]

115. If one looks at the numbers given by the ratings

the actual number of people who watch Fox News is relatively small.

[Mersky]

65. Fox News, Newsmax, OANN, Sinclair's radio, TV, and newspapers, iHeart, Bot (Xtian radio), X, Rogan, etc

Is the full list in the article, so no need to diminish the problem by over emphasizing Fox. The ones that don’t have cable, but watch Fox every chance they get will more regularly turn on rw radio to feed them lies, antisemitism, and a false reality.

[Kaleva]

114. So what is the percentage that watch or listen to all the sources listed?

If the OP doesn't know, then it's just a guess, an opinion, and not an answer

[FDRFTW]

153. MAGATS live in a complete media ecosystem spinning a fantasy land narrative in which dictators are good guys.

[Kaleva]

158. And I wonder about those who rely on sources like Ok occupy Democrats..

and MeidasTouch.

Below is an example of the disinformation they had put out

"On this episode of the MeidasTouch Podcast: Election Day is here! Vice President Kamala Harris’ momentum soars, as Trump ends his campaign in the worst way imaginable. Now, it’s the American people’s turn to decide. Ben, Brett and Jordy break it all down!"

[orwell]

24. While this was a massive "in-kind" contribution...

...it isn't the primary reason.

Granted there was horrible Democratic messaging throughout President Biden's presidency. They believed that competance would "trump" propaganda. It is obvious that you need both. I am tired of our side getting it's ass kicked by bullshit. But until we sling some truth wrapped in a pretty bow of our own, we are at a tremendous disadvantage.

We had a massive economic dislocation through a global pandemic, it's resulting inflationary effects, and the long wave of capitalist working class carnage wrought by Oligarchic Global Capital.

The technology boom of the 70's through today has essentially created enormous quantities of nominal wealth that only benefited the owners of capital. This is not classical capitalism - as if that has ever existed in the real world. It is robber baron capitalism on a global scale engineered by the real elites, not the ones touted by buffoons such as MAGA.

The current messaging apparatus is only the icing on the cake. The message wouldn't work if people were happy with their lives. THEY ARE NOT! They know the reality is that they can't afford to make it in this environment. That is why incumbents are being tossed worldwide. People are desperate to make sense of a world where massive wealth is being created but they are getting poorer.

There is an objective reality here. If we don't confront it we will keep losing.

[HUAJIAO]

41. " The message wouldn't work if people were happy with their lives. THEY ARE NOT! "

THAT IS a BIG BIG BIG ISSUE. And all that follows it.

[sop]

25. Corporate media has now failed to adequately cover Trump for three straight presidential campaigns.

If the so-called "journalists" in our corporate media (laughably referred to as The Free Press) had done their jobs, all the right-wing alternative media sources wouldn't have been so influential. These days corporate media "journalists" are more like lawyers; their job is to make convincing arguments for their clients, their corporate employers, not communicate the truth.

[cilla4progress]

27. Basically

billionaire tech bros

Inevitable

[kentuck]

29. The media that we watch and listen to....

...do not have the same numbers as FOX and right-wing media. They choose to tell the "news" differently. They exclude the stories that might reflect negatively on their favorite politicians. They are political propaganda, pure and simple. They are different from "left-wing" media.

[Martin68]

30. I totally agree. I watched my parents succumb to Fox News brainwashing. They were decent, progressive, intelligent

people, but they turned into extreme right wingers.

[TBF]

33. Now you've given me another factor to think about.

See below. I was thinking about how people seek out the sources they do. My initial assumption was that they are seeking out things that are problematic due to already ingrained sexism, etc.

But the fact that they've become cult-like in their following may indicate other factors at work.

[Martin68]

107. My parents grew up during the Depression and came of age during WWII. They were liberals while I was growing up, but

they were scared to death of the race riots during the 60s, the assassinations of the Kennedys and MLK, and of communism. Fox News confirmed all their fears and added a few new ones, while blaming it all on liberals (socialists). Once they got hooked, that was the end.

[TBF]

31. I've thought on this since I read Earl's OP yesterday - I think it goes a little deeper

we are missing the fact that how the folks are thinking - whether they are racist, sexist, lack critical thinking skills, etc. to start with - goes to WHICH sources they will seek out. Of course, after that it snowballs due to algorithms.

So, why are we there to start with? This would go back to not taking education seriously. The drive to cut public education by the billionaires. That's just one factor. What are children being taught in their homes? In their churches?

[AmandaRuth]

32. i know some dislike msg that are just yup so let me say HELL TO THE FUCKING YES

THAT IS ALL

[Ysabel]

37. NBC, CBS. and ABC did it too don't let them off...

They are bad and they are owned...

[GoCubsGo]

67. Yup! Beat me to it.

They shoved the "Biden is old and feeble" shit down our throats, while completely ignoring Trumps abject deterioration, both mentally and physically. Never mind that they also swept his criminal convictions under the rug, and ignored his culpability when it came to inflation, while ignoring the great things Biden did to repair the economic mess Trump left us. The only difference between them and Fox is that they didn't mix in a bunch of bullshit conspiracies with their one-sided reporting.

[keep_left]

39. We need our own media ecosystem, and we need to *support* it.

Here's an excerpt from a post I made yesterday.

https://democraticunderground.com/100219677391#post40

And that really means more than the one network we tried (Air America), which was not the total failure that some have made of it--Air America launched the careers of a number of personalities, and many of them continue to this day either on other networks or as self-syndicated shows. But the most important thing is that these networks must be supported by both the listeners and the Democratic party. That needs to be seen as an ongoing investment for many years. How long did it take for Fox News to become profitable? And how long did Rush Limbaugh "suck wind in Sacramento", as Randi Rhodes put it? (Her answer: 15 years!)...

...We need to wise up and start creating our own media infrastructure which isn't dependent on MSNBC or other existing organizations. And yes, it needs to be multimodal--it probably is true that radio is a dying format, and podcasts and the internet are the future. However, radio isn't dead yet, and there are still good stations that soldier on (like KTNF in the Twin Cites), often producing their own local content as well. The Democrats need to support these stations, as do other organizations like labor unions and NGOs. Otherwise, I fear we'll continue to be rolled by Fox News and their imitators for years to come.

[DeeNice]

88. Start by not losing what we already have

Support your local progressive radio station if you're lucky enough to have one. If not, wcpt in Chicago has a Livestream at heartlandsignal.com. I'm sure there are others, help spread the word.

[keep_left]

103. I agree completely. And nearly all of the progressive radio stations...

...have an internet stream, so it's really easy to use a computer, phone, or other device to listen to what's going on in the country, even if one isn't lucky enough to have a local liberal talk station.

[Grumpy Old Guy]

40. 100%!

Add to that the mistrust they have created for universities and anyone who is educated.

[snot]

43. I couldn't disagree more.

Most people have always voted their pocketbooks above all else. They may care about racism and gender-related issues, abortion, candidate integrity and other issues; but if in the richest nation in the world, they're struggling to feed their families and afford housing and health care, that's what will be decisive – the other issues matter only if the most urgent ones are addressed.

Kamala tried to make the case that she was going to address some of those urgent concerns to some extent, but having been selected by the Dem establishment, she was not a particularly credible bearer of that message, and she was not offering the kinds of structural change that would make a diffence in the long run. In any case, rightly or wrongly, over the last few decades, much of the working class has come to feel abandoned by Dems.

I think a lot of this crystallized after Great Financial Crash of 2008 when Obama put Wall St. in charge of our response to that crisis and no bankers were prosecuted; but the roots go back at least to Pres. Clinton's time, when he supported the repeal of Glass-Steagall and NAFTA and refused to follow Sheila Bair's advice that credit derivatives should be regulated, among other things.

Trump recognized that workers are hurting, and he's been capitalizing on it ever since.

[GJGCA]

78. Dr. Maslow, I presume?

>> … other issues matter only if the most urgent ones are addressed. …

[leftstreet]

81. +1

[indigovalley]

44. Its also social media outlets that post never ending personal smears and falsehoods

It wasn't just right wing media--it was also postings over and over spreading smears, personal attacks, and downright falsehoods about Harris and Walz on Twitter, Reddit, Instagram, TikTok, Youtube, and MAGA friendly web sites. The Russian attacks were only part of that process.

They haven't stopped after the election. For some reason MAGA's are heavily promoting the meme that Walz lost in his "home" district--an area that he hasn't lived in for years which is a Republican area. Trump edged out Harris there which wasn't a surprise. Yet this is currently being pushed all over the internet on Google, on social media, and even on Youtube as something negative about him. He is being mocked for his heartfelt emotions during the concession speech. And this is after the campaign has ended. There are an endless number of MAGA trolls that evidently monitor the internet and spend their entire day making negative comments in response to any positive posting about a candidate. The personal smears never end and they were relentless during the campaign. Same with Harris--they still post comments, videos, and graphics debasing her as a female or her level of intelligence. They made sexual innuendos. People were (and are still) seeing this daily.

I don't know how to combat all this but we need to figure it out...

[southmost]

45. plenty of free propaganda

same lapdog media

[MiHale]

52. Once they killed liberal talk radio...nuf said

[harumph]

53. Nope. Consumers of such propaganda were lacking

either in a proper education or they're just not very smart or have no empathy or imagination beyond what they can
taste, see or smell. In other words there was a ready market for having smoke
blown up their asses. it gives meaning to their impoverished minds. They wanted it - they sought it - they got it.

[Cirsium]

71. Blaming the voters

Blaming the voters is anti-democratic and counterproductive.

[druidity33]

134. No it's not. It's the truth. nt.

[Klarkashton]

55. Now the question is what do they really want to gain from this?

Once the tax break is extended what is there of value to this?

What would expelling 20 million people do for them of any value?

What would bullying trans people buy them?

It always comes down to money, so what other than the tax breaks does this buy them?

[Envirogal]

106. Lack of accountability

They see regulations as a hamper to their progress, liability, and growth. Granted, they want “some” regulations to protect their interests, so that is where the cherry picking starts on what to dislantle.

[Joe Cool]

56. 100%

I am in Butler, PA. It is utterly mindboggling how many people only consume right wing news and they simply don't believe you if you tell them something that contradicts what they have been told to think.

It's easy to brainwash someone if they want to be brainwashed.

[PlanetBev]

57. It's still a fact that a majority of voters were comfortable with his outrageous behavior

Right wing propaganda or not. Abject cruelty and spite is apparently ok with many Americans. 😢

[DownriverDem]

60. Rich liberals need

to step up or we will never win again.

[highplainsdem]

66. Exactly.

[Basso8vb]

68. Propaganda works and they have an enormous disinformation network.

I don't see how we can counter this, at least not in this 50-something's lifetime.

[Historic NY]

70. We actually have lousy media companies all owned by billionares...

all trying to get a piece of the action and social media click bait. Fox News has one client Trump

[Andy823]

72. The biggest liar

won. People are more likely believe lies than the truth. trump spewed lie after lie and Putin help him.
Also the millionaire and Billionaires OWN the media!

[markie]

74. knr n/t

[progressoid]

75. HUGE REC.

[patphil]

77. The next question after this is why do people prefer the propaganda?

I think it's because the false narratives of the propaganda based media tells them what they want to hear.
This is what these people are all about. Donald Trump merely triggers the deep seated fear, anger, and hatred they already feel.
Willful ignorance is a powerful block to truth. Trump's base is comprised of people who deliberately block out the truth about Trump because he validates the darkness that rages within them. They're unhappy, and they believe that Trump will take vengeance on all those who are responsibility for their unhappiness.
I don't think any of this will change until those people get to the point where they are so miserable they actually look for truth.
At 78 yrs old, it ain't gonna happen in my lifetime; probably take decades, if ever.

I am a strong believer that the main reason we incarnate into physical bodies is so we can have a variety of experiences that help us to learn about love. It's the lessons of love that prepare us to become permanent angels when we die out of our physical bodies. Unfortunately, both history and current experience show that we are not learning that lesson.
I doubt humanity ever will.

[oldmanlynn]

80. Exactly. No matter what we do if those right wing outlets are not destroyed

If they arent destroyed or corrected its foes make a difference how good we do they will never get the message.

Those sites are using our 1st amendment to completely rewrite our existence.

We have to counter the narrative out there with us purchasing tv stations radio stations and push truth propaganda

[valleyrogue]

82. He is not wrong.

The media created Donald Trump. CNN was the biggest culprit through its former head Jeff Zucker. He thought he could turn the 2016 presidential election into a reality TV show with his close friend, Donald trump, at the center. I had never seen anything like it then what I saw in 2016 during the primaries. It was 24/ 7 Donald Trump all the time. It was fawning coverage. There was no big cult surrounding Donald Trump until CNN took this Fringe candidate and made him into a viable candidate. That never should have happened. So while the media bears a ton of responsibility for this mess and added to it, social media was a huge Factor in galvanizing the bigot vote. But in the end, it was the voters who are responsible for voting the way they did. They have the same access to the same information that we have, but they choose not to seek it out. I will say the die was cast when Rupert Murdoch was allowed to have media in the US that was a big, big, mistake. There is no way to reach people who are prejudiced against minorities, women, and so forth. They are unfixable. That is the danger.

[Hieronymus Phact]

83. Worse yet:

If you bring verifiable contradictions between what they say and what's real, It triggers Cognitive Dissonance and the person shuts you off and retreats to their familiar comfort zone.
Very frustrating.

[Trust_Reality]

84. It's more media than right wing media.

All for-profit media depends on advertisers. Advertisers are big money entities, corporations, etc. They do not permit very much criticism of their profiteering, their tax breaks, etc. They demand a slant toward their interests. They advertise to make money.

[LudwigPastorius]

85. "Why didn't a majority of voters see these things?"

They've seen what Trump is, and they embrace it.

Hard to accept, I know, but just because we are Americans doesn't mean we are not members of the human species. I'm sure the citizens of Germany in the 1930s thought they were exceptionally good people too.

[ificandream]

87. Thank you .. exactly what I've been saying.

The RW media is so freaking crooked. They made sure that their audiences didn't know just how bad he was. Fox routinely buries news detrimental to Trump.

Further, you have Republicans who were too scared to impeach him when they should have.

We have a mess in this country we need to clean up.

And here's a link to something I wrote today: https://www.democraticunderground.com/100219687117

[BarbD]

92. The roots of hate and bigotry run deep.

I grew up in Wisconsin. Born in 1937. I lived through Joe McCarthy fighting the evil of communism while destroying many people's lives. My mother, the daughter of German/Austrian immigrants firmly believed in the Master Race theory, denied the Holocaust, feared and hated blacks. My father also the son of German immigrants strongly believed in capitalism and the almighty dollar. Top this off with being raised Roman Catholic and educated in parochial schools. Talk about a toxic environment!

However, I moved to New York City, left the Catholic Church ending up eventually working for the Obama campaign. But, I left behind all those people who feared and hated. Obviously they still remain voting for Trump and Vance. The fear, hate and ignorance is wired into their culture.

[onenote]

93. I think most people don't see any of media sources.

How many people do you think watch the nightly news on broadcast or cable with any regularity, if at all? How many read newspapers?
Somewhere north of 145 million voted. I suspect well under half of them are consumers of news media with any regularity, if at all.

[Elessar Zappa]

172. They get some stuff by osmosis though on social media.

Even non-political people absorb some right wing nonsense on places like Facebook and X. It must have at least a moderate effect.

[ECL213]

94. Oh, and by the way, water is wet.

So, all I have to do to fix the country is spend some of the disposable billions I have lying around to purchase the airwaves? On it!

[LeftInTX]

95. My daughter's mother in law watches end-time

stuff on YouTube. They were told the world was gonna end. Now it's not gonna end

[Lulu KC]

96. Why does no one understand that there's more than one reason?

It's just starting to feel like a pissing contest of who knows the ONE reason. I need to stop reading all analysis of this for a while. I do have my one big reason why, but I know even that is too simple for the matter at hand, even though I know I'm right!

(Not to condemn this particular OP--just a general comment as I watch the headlines go by.)

[Pinback]

108. Thank you -- 100% agree.

Let the historians and political scientists debate the pros and cons and ins and outs. We will soon need to dry our tears and get to work as conscripts in the reluctant citizen army needed to serve as The Trump Resistance 2.0.

[TwilightZone]

164. Exactly.

There are myriad reasons why Trump won - and why Harris lost. Some of them aren't even the same reasons.

I think people who write articles like this like to believe that they know something no one else does. The funny thing is that, despite the 300+ recs, the author couldn't be more wrong. Everyone knows who and what Trump is. Some care and some don't. That's been the case for nearly a decade now. Some know and other issues are more important to them, like a conservative agenda.

Asserting that there can only be one is also intentionally ignorant and dooms us to repeat 2024.

The single biggest mistake made this cycle might have been focusing too much on Trump and not enough on the issues. But again, that's just one of many, and the hyper-Trump-obsessed might never come to that realization.

[joshcryer]

97. Trumps oral mic story should have been the headlines for days.

If we had even remotely competent reporting in this country.

[ReRe]

98. Yep. That was the invisible

and final ingredient poured into this stew of madness in the melting pot.

We're cooked.

Michael Tomasky gets the prize.

I'll go one step farther. It was the MONEY that bought the final ingredient.

[diane in sf]

99. "Mainstream" corporate media deserves a good part of the blame, sane washing, non endorsements of Harris,

in spite of the unfitness of tRump and the Republican Party, suited their oligarch owners just fine.

[Ocelot II]

100. He's partly right; it's true that very little penetrates the right-wing media silo - BUT

the voters did see and hear with their very own eyes and ears the horrendous things Trump and his minions did and said over and over. They heard him insult Kamala personally; they heard him make outrageous and false claims about the Haitians in Springfield, they heard him call immigrants criminals and rapists and vermin; they heard him produce incoherent and bizarre word salads involving electric boats and sharks and Hannibal Lecter - ramblings that made no sense at all - and they saw him simulating fellatio on live tv. The media can't be blamed for people voting for the grotesque displays they saw and heard themselves. That was never hidden from them. They saw him, they saw he was nasty and awful and disturbed; they liked what they saw and voted for it.

[KPN]

109. And the MSM meekly responded if at all. In fact,

many more than a few times, the mainstream media seemed complicit.

[Stargleamer]

116. Propaganda hurts not only by lying and deceit but also

By ignoring/suppressing irrefutable truths.

28 women accused the POS of sexual assault/harassment/rape. This is an irrefutable truth that Fox News willfully ignores.

The POS was found guilty in a New York court of sexual assault. This is another irrefutable truth you won’t hear about to any significant extent on Fox News.

I think Kamala Harris should have run nonstop ads featuring both those truths in battleground states

[aka-chmeee]

119. They DO know...They don't care. Cretins are just as sick as he is. /nt

[Six117]

120. They heard exactly what they * wanted * to hear

Because * that * is who they are. I don't care what their reasons maybe. Turnip and the like have and will inflict a lot of harm. We all know this because they have done it before. No they are not "good people" who were misinformed. They are simply not good people.

[mzmolly]

122. We have to find a way to counter this hateful mess.

[4catsmom]

124. I still say vote tampering

Trump didn't even try to campaign in the last few months. He knew the fix was in

[PedroXimenez]

126. Dems should get off Fox News and Twitter

Including Buttiegieg. Everyone says how great he is on Fox but what good does it do? It only legitimizes them.

Look what came out in the lawsuits, in the depositions and leaked texts. What more evidence is needed they are 100% fake news?

Same with Twitter, that means you AOC. Get off Twitter and Fox, and bash them nonstop.

[uponit7771]

127. "The answer is the right-wing media." 👈🏾👈🏾👈🏾

[muriel_volestrangler]

128. "do something about it" - gee, thanks, Tomasky, that's a great help.

He doesn't bother saying what we could do about right-wing media being popular, and misleading. Are we meant to wave a wand and force them to be truthful and balanced? To force people to stop watching them?

I'd love to see what he would have done, given the First Amendment, to stop this.

[Martin Eden]

131. THIS

Is WHY

[Turbineguy]

137. They need to destroy the country for people to see it.

And burn the world.

[liberal N proud]

141. The media went easy on him and was tough on her

[TomCADem]

146. Really? MSNBC Was Pretty Harsh, Are They Not Media?

The fact that folks can’t distinguish between Fox and MSNBC is pretty baffling.

[TwilightZone]

166. People see what they want to see.

If MSNBC says something they don't like in the ten minutes they're watching, they're as bad as Fox. It's all binary, good or bad.

Back when Trump was president, WaPo documented every lie he publicly told - more than 30,000 - and people still insisted that "the media" never covers Trump negatively and never says anything bad about him. In this campaign, posters often insisted that no one was covering certain events and would stick to the claim even after being provided a dozen links to media articles about it.

It's all nonsense, but the myth will never, ever die. We're not immune to intentional ignorance.

[TomCADem]

178. Exactly. These broad brush attacks that treat News Max...

…as being no different than NPR or Pro Publica do far more harm than good. Indeed, Russian propaganda often tries to push this false equivalency to water down the impact of reporting on Trump misdeeds, yet many progressives sometimes take the bait and start to condemn a free press.

[angryxyouth]

145. That's a major part of it

One of the other major parts is that the few corporations who control our food supply created the feeling of a bad economy by jacking up the prices then the news outlets who are controlled by the same corporations just reported on the higher prices as simply inflation.

[SleeplessinSoCal]

147. Why do they want us all at the mercy of a malignant narcissist?

And a neo Nazi? Why are they out to destroy us? Because they're stupid? The smart ones seem gone.

[FDRFTW]

151. the billionaires control the message. It's Putin's press now.

[Straw Man]

159. As a retired educator, it pains me to say this ...

... but to a great extent the problem springs from the dumbing down of the American public. To put it plainly, the majority have sub-par language skills and lack the ability to think critically and analytically. The language and tropes of right-wing media (and politicians) target these very deficiencies, using a limited vocabulary and very rudimentary and fallacious logic. This is evident in the presentation of even supposedly objective news reporting, but becomes even more pronounced in any kind of discussion scenario.

I have some reservations about what I'm going to say here, but I feel that there is a need for a center-left counterpart to the Foxes and Newsmaxes of the world, one that speaks to the educationally deprived segments of the American public in a language that they can comprehend and feel comfortable with, avoiding academic jargon and other class-based signifiers. There are many simple and obvious truths that can be transmitted clearly and that have to do with creating a more equitable and inclusive society rather than one driven by hate, fear, greed, and resentment.

[oldsoftie]

161. As for the worst things he's said, I was told "Oh he doesnt really MEAN it"

SO many times I've been told this
So I ask; why are you voting for a guy who is promising a lot of things that YOU say he "doesnt really mean"?

[Attilatheblond]

162. Right wing media + racism, mysoginy, failed or programmed education, lack of critical thinking, failure to grow the f up

We have an awful lot of people who, whether by design or by self limitation, are still just big infants walking around with grown up 'rights'.

[LaMouffette]

163. EXACTLY! Thom Hartman echoed this truth last week. It's a trillion-dollar marketing campaign to destroy democracy

so that the Billionaire Boys Club can "do whatever they want," as Donnie Dementia would put it.

[onlyadream]

165. Right wing media vilified liberals and Democrats to the extent that

We should only run people as independents who will caucus with the Dems. This way we remove the whole. I hate Dems mindset and run on the issues which are more popular.

[DallasNE]

167. Abortion Was A Losing Issue For Harris

Men see abortion rights as losing control. That is at the heart of the gender gap. There are other reasons as well but this is at the top of the heap.

[MaineBlueBear]

168. I wholeheartedly agree

Why have people allowed themselves to be propogandized to? How do we talk to these people to break through their propaganda they love?

[residentcynic]

170. Why do people choose these?

You can blame right wing media but a deeper question is why do more people choose to watch and listen to it. They could choose MSNBC over Fox or liberal podcasts over Rogan but most don’t. The right wing has learned that people enjoy hating others while feeling superior. The right provides a source of information that tells people they should have righteous indignation. They don’t mind exaggerating or even outright lying about things. We liberals would say they don’t play fair, but it obviously works and they win. The question is, can liberals get down and fight in the mud to win? If we don’t, we will continue to lose - and it may already be too late.

[Littlered]

173. Nope.

Living in what I’d call a “liberal” red area (if there is such a thing). Here is a hard dose of reality. The policies of the party are wildly unpopular with the vast majority of every day Americans. Since I’m a low post count member I’m sure no one cares. But it’s the truth. I talk to hundreds if not thousands of people during the course of my work. If anyone truly cares about what I hear. I’ll be happy to expound.. But here is a short list of what people in middle are dead set against. Open borders, sanctuary cities, refugees that have no intention of assimilating, homeless encampments, rampant crime (not talking violent crime, talking juvenile crime that goes unpunished). Dei, student loan forgiveness, trans children, in sports and otherwise pushing parents out. Especially when it comes to basically criminalizing “dead naming etc.” And of course their pocketbooks. But from what I see, most around here are doing better than ever.

And one more thing, Harris. People had a negative opinion of her. And there just wasn’t anything that was going to change their minds in the short time she had to do so.

I can’t state this loudly enough. The student loan forgiveness program alone lost our party a million (or more) votes. Especially because Biden wouldn’t let it go. So it never left the news cycle. When inflation is running rampant and property taxes are increasing exponentially. The last thing people want to hear about, is a loan forgiveness program.

Earl G was spot on when he said they used algorithms to micro target these people. And the above are some of the issues they used against us.

So, in my humble opinion. People weren’t voting for Trump as much as they were rejecting the parties (real or imagined ) policies.

As for me. I’m working on a back up plan, and you should too. You can rest assured the next trump crash will make us wish for the last one.

[kentuck]

174. "slanted and distorted information"...

Intentionally slanted and distorted is disinformation and misinformation. They exclude anything that might reflect negatively on their political godfather. They distort and slant the information on his opponents. It is a sophisticated propaganda unlike any the world has ever seen.

Too late, I think we have failed to recognize the real enemy of this country.

[Hekate]

176. KnRnBk

[MomInTheCrowd]

177. RIGHT WING SPANISH LANGUAGE RADIO

Hidden in plain sight and growing. I’ve been saying this for years….