The Fourth Turning Is Here.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

Everyone here, everyone dismayed by the election results, every person who can read, needs to read this book. It's by Neil Howe, and in summary is about the four seasons of life as applied to humans and our societies. We are in the final, fourth season (or turning). Essentially things are going to get a lot worse before they suddenly, at the end of this turning, essentially everything will change and we'll all start a new and vastly better way of life.

Think of the period from the beginning of the Great Depression in 1929 to the end of World War II. It was a time of great despair and hardship, and at the end our culture was transformed.

Howe figures this won't end until the early or perhaps mid 2030s, so we all need to hang in there.

I'm 76, so although I'm in excellent health and have been semi-joking for years about plans for my 97th birthday (there's an eclipse right around then I want to see). I realize that I may or may not make it through this time.

So please, please read the book.

[LSparkle]

1. Is this the book Bannon has previously cited? Nt

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

4. I have no idea if Bannon cited it.

But it's utterly fascinating, and, despite the fact that it makes it crystal clear that things will get worse, a lot worse, at the end our society and culture will be transformed. And transformed for the better.

Really, everyone should read it.

[Ysabel]

3. I'll look it up...

I might not make it either but it will soon be 5 years since I quit smoking and I'm not dying of cancer yet so my chances have gone back up again (I think?)...

So I'll probably make it (I'm 65) - my grandfather smoked until he was 60 and he lived to be 93 and most of my great grandparents lived to over a 100 so I think I have a pretty good chance of being alive for a while longer...

I hope you get to celebrate that eclipse!

[EverHopeful]

5. Here's a 7 year old article (from the WP, sorry to all of us shunning the WP right now) that discusses the book

and Bannon's possible embrace of it.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/books/where-did-steve-bannon-get-his-worldview-from-my-book/2017/02/24/16937f38-f84a-11e6-9845-576c69081518_story.html

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

6. Bannon read a book that came out some years ago.

"The Fourth Turning is Here" has a copyright of 2023.

And the WP won't let me see that article.

[EverHopeful]

8. Sorry you couldn't see it. I clicked "Share" but apparently copying link didn't work.

The article does mention another book by the author called The Fourth Turning: An American Prophecy from 1997.

Tried a different way of sharing to get this link but it looks like the same link. Never had trouble sharing articles before and emailing it to myself worked, hope this does.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/books/where-did-steve-bannon-get-his-worldview-from-my-book/2017/02/24/16937f38-f84a-11e6-9845-576c69081518_story.html

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

10. That still didn't work.

Not to worry.

"The Fourth Turning Is Here" is essentially brand new. I'm learning and re-learning a lot in this reread.

[Deminpenn]

7. The original book is Generations

By Neil Howe and coauthor Strauss. It's fascinating. This is the book Bannon has cited, but he interprets incorrectly - quelle surprise.

When our Boomer generation (idealist) is completely the oldest generation, that is the best generational configuration for progress.

Keep the faith.

[Casandia]

9. I read "The Fourth Turning: An American Prophecy"

By William Strauss and Neil Howe about twenty years ago. I highly recommend reading this book too.

Thanks for letting us know about this new book!

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

11. I read that when it came out.

This new one is more than well worth the read, trust me.

[proud patriot]

12. I'll check it out

need a new book

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

13. Please do.

I wish every single person who is dismayed by the election results would read it.

I actually understand that things are going to get a whole lot worse before they get better. Imagine it is January, 1930. We have no idea that the Great Depression will go on and on, and then there will be a World War. We haven't a clue now, in 1930, that after that war ends things will be vastly better.

The same with what's happened now. Things are going to get a lot worse, but at the end, things *will* be vastly better.

[roamer65]

22. Very true.

They called it a recession in 1930. Little did they know what was in store.

[Zeitghost]

14. This is where the:

Hard times make strong people, strong people make good times, good times make weak people, weak people make bad times saying comes from right?

I've heard it from both left and right. The difference being the former believes we are at the beginning of the last stage and the later believes we are at the end of it.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

15. It's more complicated and subtle than that.

It involves four generations that repeat in order. Those from the right and left you're talking to are NOT understanding what Howe is saying. Actually, they haven't a clue.

Please, please, read the book.

[Jspur]

16. As an elder millennial whose 41 years old I'm very

skeptical about this book. I read this book way back in 2008 when I was 25 years old. I thought back then we were in the fourth turning. I remember even the author of the book back then said the fourth turning had started around that time. I just view this book as pseudo-science now.

I do agree with you we are in a Great Depression like era similar to what we were in about 100 years ago. The biggest issue right now is we don't have a FDR figure to save us. I don't see a Democrat that is a true progressive on economic issues like FDR out there right now that will come out of nowhere and take command of this situation in 2028. I hope I'm wrong and someone will emerge but I'm skeptical.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

17. You did NOT read the same book I'm talking about.

This one, "The Fourth Turning Is Here" came out last year. Read it.

And to be nit-picky, we are not currently in a Great Depression, which was less than 100 years ago. True, we don't currently have an FDR figure. Maybe we will get one, maybe things will play out without an FDR.

Again, please read this book.

[Jspur]

18. You are right I didn't read the current one that came out, but I read the original one called

the 4th turning. I also meant to say we are in a similar environment that led up to the great depression in the 1920's.

I bought into the 4th turning concept in '08 and heard plenty of interviews back then from Neil Howe about how the '08 Financial crisis was the start of it. I remember also hearing back then about how the Millennials were the Hero generation that was supposed to save the country and rebuild it during the 4th turning. I can say that has not happened yet maybe I will be wrong, and my generation will save the day but color me skeptical.

Now it seems like Howe according to you has changed the start date of the 4th Turning to this current crisis. I guess my questions is why wasn't the '08 Financial crisis the 4th turning like Howe said it was in '08 and now this current crisis is the start of the 4th turning?

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

19. Perhaps reading the new book would clarify it for you.

I'm only 130 pages into a 460 page book, so I can't answer that right now.

[Jspur]

20. Not sure if I want to waste money buying the book since

I wasted money back in '08 on the original book The fourth turning.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

21. Libraries are a good alternative.

Last edited Mon Nov 11, 2024, 01:05 AM - Edit history (1)

on edit:

I understand your reluctance to purchase a book you honestly don't think worth reading.

Personally, I read about 10 books a month, and I can't begin to afford to purchase all of them. Libraries are a god-send, and inter-library loan is another gift from the gods.

[soandso]

23. OP, this is fascinating

I'd heard of The Fourth Tuning, which was a pretty famous book. It interested me but I just never got to it. After reading the wiki - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strauss%E2%80%93Howe_generational_theory
I find it super interesting and it makes me wonder how the cycles they theorize fit into other cycles, such as the Hindu yugas and the longer cycles that they're a part of as well things like the Mayan calendars. I firmly believe that existence is made up of repeating cycles, with smaller/shorter cycles within those, just as the Hindus/Vedas/Puranas say. It's gears within gears and wheels within wheels and it's mind blowingly deep. This study of cycles could be a university major and discipline in itself. Generational history, cycles and forecasting. Heavy stuff!

The wiki does say Bannon is very into this as was Al Gore.

I'd love to see Mr Howe in a discussion with someone who is an authority on the Hindu stuff because they definitely dovetail or even the same subject. It's ultimately the study of TIME and the characteristics of all of the cycles, which repeat endlessly.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

24. The book goes into vast, enormous, and detailed descriptions

of many other similar theories. Including those you mentioned.

People who dismiss this upon reading only a brief summary, such as what I've posted here, completely miss the point.

Another extremely important point of the book is that how an individual is affected by what happens is completely dependent on which generation, which kind of generation they belong to: Prophet, Nomad, Hero, or Artist.

Again, read the book.

[soandso]

25. It's fractal

The seasons they refer to would also be impacted by what type of yuga age they occurred in. The yugas also have a high, middle and low point (deterioration) before moving from one to the next. The cycles are fractal in that they repeat but are different, as in history doesn't repeat but it rhymes. That brings to mind another book I have not read but has rave reviews, The Fractal Universe. You might enjoy that (and, me, too!).

I can see where where this topic doesn't resonate with everyone because it's very metaphysical.

[soandso]

26. Repeating cycles everywhere

seems to be the basis of reality (at least this one).

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