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CousinIT

(10,484 posts)
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 03:36 PM Dec 9

Eloon is on his platform LYING about Social Security to justify GUTTING it.

https://bsky.app/profile/socialsecurityworks.org/post/3lbryp3mdx22s

Elon Musk's chart is a LIE.

Social Security doesn't add a SINGLE PENNY to the debt.

But that won't stop Elon from trying to destroy it.

We will NEVER let that happen.



THE IMAGE Eloon used is from HERE - a website which ALSO incorrectly tags Social Security as part of the general budget that adds to the DEBT - but Social Security is FULLY FUNDED and PAID FOR by dedicated taxes, which are not part of the regular budget. It is 100% funded and does not add one damn cent to the debt. https://www.geekwire.com/2023/steve-ballmers-usafacts-releases-new-stats-on-american-crime-jobs-population-and-more/
61 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Eloon is on his platform LYING about Social Security to justify GUTTING it. (Original Post) CousinIT Dec 9 OP
Eloon has no idea what he is talking about. OLDMDDEM Dec 9 #1
WHERE are Democrats and the MEDIA pointing this out? CousinIT Dec 9 #2
Exactly!!! BeerBarrelPolka Dec 9 #6
If the Ds pointed out the stupidity of Eloon, they would be violating their code of go along in2herbs Dec 9 #12
I think he knows exactly what he is talking about. He is intentionally lying. Midnight Writer Dec 9 #29
He only cares about money, and he's addicted to and hoarding it. Initech Dec 9 #43
Are there comments from experts and others countering? hlthe2b Dec 9 #3
Look at the Economic Policy Institute. OLDMDDEM Dec 9 #4
I know the truth. I want them to counter it for others on "X" hlthe2b Dec 9 #7
Those that know are too afraid to counter Trump and his magats. OLDMDDEM Dec 9 #8
Largely, NO. You hear it from Bernie Sanders once or twice a YEAR. CousinIT Dec 9 #5
Eloon is the devil Meowmee Dec 9 #9
Who voted for this-------- Cherrycheeks Dec 9 #10
Who TF elected Elon??? SledDriver Dec 9 #11
They have to lie about it. It has been one of the most successful programs in history...nt Wounded Bear Dec 9 #13
That Fucked Fucker Better leave his GD Grubby Cha Dec 9 #14
If I Remember Correctly... GB_RN Dec 9 #15
In reality, Social Security is Over Funded ... aggiesal Dec 9 #16
This is why rich people are against SS MadameButterfly Dec 9 #24
I stopped paying into SS in June JustAnotherGen Dec 9 #28
Easy peasey... FalloutShelter Dec 9 #37
Good, sensible plan with no cuts. Which means MAGAts won't support it. CousinIT Dec 9 #30
The current shortage estimate for SS in 2032 airplaneman Dec 9 #31
I had not heard of the -13%, that is better than -25% ... aggiesal Dec 9 #34
SS is easy to fix but they don't want to fix it MadameButterfly Dec 10 #49
Who is this muskrat asshole. Can't we just deport his nasty ass. ??? Magoo48 Dec 9 #17
Lying is their first language. Marcuse Dec 9 #18
Is he even a citizen of the United Stares? Iris Dec 9 #19
Somewhere Dick Durbin is penning a letter of concern. Hassler Dec 9 #20
Simple solution: tax the billionaires! nt SunSeeker Dec 9 #21
The question that goes unasked and... GiqueCee Dec 9 #22
The reason they hate SS is simple moose65 Dec 9 #35
Is everybody ready for the multimillion walker march on Washington? Tweedy Dec 9 #23
Such a small, miserly and bitter man dlk Dec 9 #25
Maybe Democrats will correct Eloony Autumn Dec 9 #26
Slide your eyes to the left.... FormerOstrich Dec 9 #27
I agree, I've been saying that for years Dave says Dec 9 #39
Meanwhile, Eloon wants a "carve-out" or exemption... keep_left Dec 9 #32
A BIG NO, ELOON!! Dave says Dec 9 #40
Fuck MuskRat!! He's a lyin fool... we need to oppose him with everything we got!! InAbLuEsTaTe Dec 9 #33
Eloon doesn't want to pay his businesses' share of FICA. THAT is what this is all about and always was. valleyrogue Dec 9 #36
That says nothing about cutting Social Security soandso Dec 9 #38
Fix is easy. Strengthen the revenue side. Dave says Dec 9 #41
'Even Trump has said,' SamuelTheThird Dec 9 #42
True enough but he's said that for a long time soandso Dec 9 #46
They will call it "eliminating fraud and waste"... druidity33 Dec 10 #47
The agency mentioned full of fraud and abuse is the DoD soandso Dec 10 #50
Excuse me? druidity33 Dec 10 #57
And I'm telling you what they have said soandso Dec 10 #58
At least 3 House Rs druidity33 Dec 10 #59
You can suit yourself and choose to worry soandso Dec 11 #60
Trump isn't worried about being reelected anymore. Klarkashton Dec 10 #52
It takes congress to make changes to SS soandso Dec 10 #54
You can't take DT on anything he says one way or another Cosmocat Dec 11 #61
Did they ever pay back the IOU's that congress uses to fund projects? I beleive it started under Raygun. Hotler Dec 9 #44
for what it is worth state of stupid Dec 9 #45
K&R spanone Dec 10 #48
I really need one of those blessed "working class" voters Blue_Tires Dec 10 #51
These attacks are age discrimination and maybe elder abuse bucolic_frolic Dec 10 #53
It will DESTROY the US economy too. n/t CousinIT Dec 10 #56
What a fucking Grinch! Lunabell Dec 10 #55

BeerBarrelPolka

(1,439 posts)
6. Exactly!!!
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 03:47 PM
Dec 9

Where are they? We need to stop defending them. They need to be called out and do the job they were elected to do. Any of them who sits in silence, are just as guilty as Musk and Trump, etc. From now on, I will refer to these cowardly people as Mumps.

in2herbs

(3,227 posts)
12. If the Ds pointed out the stupidity of Eloon, they would be violating their code of go along
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 05:21 PM
Dec 9

to get along.

Midnight Writer

(23,126 posts)
29. I think he knows exactly what he is talking about. He is intentionally lying.
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 06:28 PM
Dec 9

As are all the other "deficit hawks" who cite Social Security and Medicare as drivers of the National Debt.

President Clinton gave us surpluses and a roadmap to completely erase our debt long before now. W Bush and the Republicans blew that all to hell immediately in order to give massive tax cuts to the already wealthy. Maybe "visionary" Musk could look at Clinton's playbook if he is serious about solving this problem.

Of course, Musk and Co. are not serious about solving anything for the country or its people. He just wants kill regulations and not pay taxes.

CousinIT

(10,484 posts)
5. Largely, NO. You hear it from Bernie Sanders once or twice a YEAR.
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 03:47 PM
Dec 9

That's it. The media NEVER mentions it, oddly. I'm confident they have orders from their billionaire owners to tell the same lies Eloon does instead.

As for other politicians and Democrats, .... never a peep from them countering these lies.

aggiesal

(9,525 posts)
16. In reality, Social Security is Over Funded ...
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 05:31 PM
Dec 9

When anyone says that Social Security will go bankrupt in 2032, that is not true.

The SS Trust Fund is supposed to be depleted by 2032, but this is by design. This is what they are referring to.

Social Security will continue to have money, but not enough to pay out at 100%.

When ever the Trust Fund is depleted, then only 75% of our Social Security Benefit can be paid, forever.
This is what we are trying to fix. Raise the Income Max to $400K would fix this is the short term.

Creating a doughnut hole from $400K to $1M, where anyone making income more then $1M would have
to start paying into Social Security starting at the $1,000,001 dollar.

So pay into SS up to income < $400K. Pay $0 from $400K to $1M, then start paying at $1M,
would fix Social Security funding for ever, maybe even increase the amount received.

MadameButterfly

(1,946 posts)
24. This is why rich people are against SS
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 06:16 PM
Dec 9

The solution is to make them pay. They don't want to pay, and their share of the benefits aren't worth it to them.
Besides that they're ok with other people's pain and suffering and too stupid to realize that old people destitute and on the streets instead of buying stuff is bad for their companies' bottom lines.

JustAnotherGen

(33,814 posts)
28. I stopped paying into SS in June
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 06:26 PM
Dec 9

I've been a broken record on this.

When you stop paying in halfway through the year - you DO NOT MISS THAT MONEY.

It's basic and simple - lift the cap.

CousinIT

(10,484 posts)
30. Good, sensible plan with no cuts. Which means MAGAts won't support it.
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 06:33 PM
Dec 9

The billionaires who own them and who they represent exclusively will hate it.

airplaneman

(1,286 posts)
31. The current shortage estimate for SS in 2032
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 06:40 PM
Dec 9

Is only -13% and not 25% due to higher wages and better employment. If T plan to not tax SS goes through then the 13% becomes 33% and 2032 becomes 2030. The fix for SS is extremely easy I like the donut plan you mention.
-Airplane

aggiesal

(9,525 posts)
34. I had not heard of the -13%, that is better than -25% ...
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 07:01 PM
Dec 9

Also, I personally think that not taxing SS is good thing because people get to keep more of the money.
But increasing the negative from 13% to 30%, makes sense why Pendejo45 is pushing it, to deplete the Trust Fund faster
and then tell people who don't really understand Social Security that SS is now bankrupt.

MadameButterfly

(1,946 posts)
49. SS is easy to fix but they don't want to fix it
Tue Dec 10, 2024, 10:28 AM
Dec 10

So they'll make it go broke faster. When will the Trump voters wake up? Most of them need SS.

I spoke to a supporter who said "I don't think they'll get away with cutting SS."
He didn't seem to mind that they are saying they want to, nor did he notice that the only people in power trying to stop them are the Dems he voted against. And with Kamala in the presidency, no one would have to fight to keep it. He doesn't like Kamala because she lies. Sigh.

GiqueCee

(1,512 posts)
22. The question that goes unasked and...
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 06:06 PM
Dec 9

... unanswered is, why do irredeemably rotten billionaires want to deprive those less fortunate of THEIR OWN FUCKIN' MONEY? What kind of people – and I use the term "people" VERY loosely when referring to the repulsively rich – even care? It's not their money; it's not the government's money, it is deferred wages held in trust. As was noted in an earlier reply, it doesn't add a penny to the deficit, nor will the malicious destruction of the government's most popular program reduce the deficit by a penny. So why the goddamned fuck don't they just shut up about it?
Republicans have been trying to do away with Social Security since 1935, for chrissakes! WHY?!!? It does them no harm, the greedy bags of pig excrement don't even pay anything into the SS Trust Fund past $160,000, which is probably less than the pocket change they spend on goldfish food!
There is simply no bottom to their fetid cesspool of depravity. I have an above average vocabulary, but I am at a loss for words to adequately describe how much I hate these fuckers. My sixty-plus years of hatred for the Republican Party has always burned hotter than the surface of the Sun, but now it's gone supernova.

moose65

(3,326 posts)
35. The reason they hate SS is simple
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 07:03 PM
Dec 9

Employers (I.e. rich people) are forced to match their employees’ SS contributions. If SS was more like a 401k or Roth IRA, where the worker would bear the total cost of contributions, they wouldn’t give a shit.

They absolutely hate having to contribute to their employees’ retirement system.

Tweedy

(1,220 posts)
23. Is everybody ready for the multimillion walker march on Washington?
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 06:06 PM
Dec 9

I do believe even Mr. Musk will be impressed should he continue to push this fresh horse manure on us.

Social security is a highly successful government program with little administrative overhead. Medicare treats the sickest cohort of our population more effectively and cheaply than any other program public or private of any other country.

So, of course somebody who seems intent on looting our country into bankruptcy hates it.

Who are the dangerous immigrants again?

dlk

(12,468 posts)
25. Such a small, miserly and bitter man
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 06:22 PM
Dec 9

All of his riches aren’t giving him sufficient joy and peace of mind, so he needs to go after seniors and the disabled. Pathetic.

Autumn

(46,660 posts)
26. Maybe Democrats will correct Eloony
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 06:24 PM
Dec 9

I'm sure Donna Brazile with be on the talk show on Sunday.

FormerOstrich

(2,753 posts)
27. Slide your eyes to the left....
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 06:25 PM
Dec 9

and look at that tiny slice of Corporate Income Tax. I'm thinking that should be much more proportionate to the individual income tax slice than it is. Corporations are people, too....doncha know?

Dave says

(4,974 posts)
39. I agree, I've been saying that for years
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 07:35 PM
Dec 9

Corporations are people, too. Why can’t they pay at the EXACT SAME RATES of most people! That would solve many many problems.

keep_left

(2,525 posts)
32. Meanwhile, Eloon wants a "carve-out" or exemption...
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 06:47 PM
Dec 9

...for "defense" contractors like himself from the radical fiscal austerity that his ridiculous "DOGE" agency will impose on the rest of us. He's said as much on his X platform.

https://democraticunderground.com/100219789614#post6
https://democraticunderground.com/100219779335#post4
https://democraticunderground.com/100219749918#post16
https://democraticunderground.com/100219744877#post31

valleyrogue

(1,191 posts)
36. Eloon doesn't want to pay his businesses' share of FICA. THAT is what this is all about and always was.
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 07:05 PM
Dec 9

Charles Koch was and is the same way. They literally make shit up about Social Security in order not to pay anything into the system.

 

soandso

(1,631 posts)
38. That says nothing about cutting Social Security
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 07:06 PM
Dec 9

It's simply a chart showing what's coming in and what's going out.

This constant drumbeat about how Social Security is going to be gutted is only scaring people and there's no evidence that's going to happen. Even Trump has said, numerous times, including recently, it will not be touched and everyone will continue to get what they have been getting. I wish it would increase but that's another matter. Anyway, this is wrong to keep trying to get the most vulnerable into a state of panic and it doesn't help anything. We've got enough to be concerned about with making shit up.

The federal debt and deficit need to be dealt with to PROTECT SS and Medicare/Medicaid, though it seems like some people don't like math and the idea of cutting anything. 36+ trillion of debt is not sustainable but SS and Medicare/Medicaid are so whatever needs to be done to ensure they remain safe, fucking do it!

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

Dave says

(4,974 posts)
41. Fix is easy. Strengthen the revenue side.
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 07:39 PM
Dec 9

Tax multi-billionaires into non-existence! Let them leave the country and renounce their citizenship, it would help soooo much of these leeches would just go!

We need a significant wealth tax now.

 

soandso

(1,631 posts)
46. True enough but he's said that for a long time
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 08:25 PM
Dec 9

Messing with SS is also political suicide. Virtually no one in congress would support it.

druidity33

(6,596 posts)
47. They will call it "eliminating fraud and waste"...
Tue Dec 10, 2024, 07:50 AM
Dec 10

in fact they are already using those words. Guess what? MAGA folk will fall for it.



 

soandso

(1,631 posts)
50. The agency mentioned full of fraud and abuse is the DoD
Tue Dec 10, 2024, 04:41 PM
Dec 10

TRILLIONS have just "disappeared there and they have failed years of audits. You don't think that needs to be addressed?

 

soandso

(1,631 posts)
58. And I'm telling you what they have said
Tue Dec 10, 2024, 06:59 PM
Dec 10

not what they will say, which is speculation. Musk specifically addressed the DoD and Bernie Sanders and Ro Khanna agreed with him.

druidity33

(6,596 posts)
59. At least 3 House Rs
Tue Dec 10, 2024, 08:45 PM
Dec 10

have used those phrases openly. Oh and "inefficiency", that's another one. So no. It's not speculation.

"But that, of course, comes as his allies in Congress privately discuss offsetting the cost of extending his 2017 tax cuts with “reforms” targeting Medicaid and food stamps, and as he appoints the supremely unqualified TV doctor Mehmet Oz to head up the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid in his new administration, with vows to “cut waste and fraud within our Country’s most expensive Government Agency.”

As TPM has been reporting, it’s a familiar rhetorical dance for Republicans as they seek to slash social safety net programs that provide invaluable assistance to America’s most vulnerable, couched in the language of “reforms.” While there has been some veiled language tossed around about cutting out “waste” and “fraud” as Trump and his allies salivate about the possible ways to deploy the Elon Musk-Vivek Ramaswamy “efficiency” department, other House Republicans are being explicit about using the cover provided by the unit to make substantial cuts to entitlements. "

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/where-things-stand/another-house-republican-is-being-loud-and-clear-about-plans-to-slash-medicare

Be sure and read the whole thing...plenty more examples there.

Here's another:
“And so we’ve got to right the ship, and it’s going to mean cuts. It’s going to mean cuts to the 24 percent of the discretionary spending that we have, and it’s also going to mean looking long-term at the front end of some programs like Social Security and Medicare,” he continued. “… There is some waste, abuse and fraud in Medicare that we can take those numbers back and add to our general coffers and our treasury.”

“And on the front end on Social Security, I think there’s a way, when people are living longer, they’re retiring later, then on the front end we can move that retirement age back a little bit,” he said.

that's Missouri Republican Rep. Mark Alford btw



 

soandso

(1,631 posts)
60. You can suit yourself and choose to worry
Wed Dec 11, 2024, 05:36 AM
Dec 11

and it sucks that people are trying to get other people distressed. It's not going to get cut and TFG just reiterated, again, that retirement ago will not be moved up, along with no cuts to anyone's benefits.

As for waste and fraud in something like Medicare, it needs to be addressed to protect Medicare. You don't want fraud and theft endangering it's solvency, do you? Anyone stealing from us needs to be discovered and prosecuted.

Klarkashton

(2,285 posts)
52. Trump isn't worried about being reelected anymore.
Tue Dec 10, 2024, 04:47 PM
Dec 10

He is a stupid man that does stupid things.

 

soandso

(1,631 posts)
54. It takes congress to make changes to SS
Tue Dec 10, 2024, 04:50 PM
Dec 10

or "gut it" as the repeated claims being made say. That's not going to happen.

Cosmocat

(15,053 posts)
61. You can't take DT on anything he says one way or another
Wed Dec 11, 2024, 07:41 AM
Dec 11

Seriously.

They are 100% coming for it.

Hotler

(12,388 posts)
44. Did they ever pay back the IOU's that congress uses to fund projects? I beleive it started under Raygun.
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 07:46 PM
Dec 9

Maybe Eloon could show some service to his country and pay them all off and then maybe we can talk cuts.

state of stupid

(29 posts)
45. for what it is worth
Mon Dec 9, 2024, 08:24 PM
Dec 9

The chart and not understanding how it works are the problem. It is caused by the unified budget act of
1968 when it was decided that it would be easier to look at one chart rather than the two. As is pointed
out Social Security and Medicare are separate taxes considered mandatory spending. The income tax
you file on your 1040 tax form is for discretionary spending. A misunderstood part is when it is said that
Social Security and Medicare do not add to the debt. Technically they do by design. The money that is
paid into Social Security and Medicare goes to the Treasury Dept. They do not write an IOU. They issue
bonds and securities that pay interest that goes into Social Security and Medicare trust funds. Because
they earn interest that is paid for out of the discretionary budget, technically they do add to the debt but
that is by design. I have always and will always be for going back to two separate budgets because it
is actually easier to understand. It is two separate problems requiring two different solutions. It is no
different than the household budget we live by. There are the bills that come every month rain or shine
that have to be paid mortgage, electric and such (mandatory spending) and things we want discretionary
which we have to figure out how to work into the budget or do without. Rather than going around the
mountain again for eternity I think I am going to start writing my congress critters to start pushing to do
away with the unified budget for the sake of others who never try to understand how it works and just
listen to what other people tell them and take it as gospel. Rant over, what the hell do I know anyhow.

Blue_Tires

(56,730 posts)
51. I really need one of those blessed "working class" voters
Tue Dec 10, 2024, 04:46 PM
Dec 10

To explain to me how a political party with Melon Fucking Husk as it's mascot is going to make the lives of ordinary Americans better...

bucolic_frolic

(47,578 posts)
53. These attacks are age discrimination and maybe elder abuse
Tue Dec 10, 2024, 04:48 PM
Dec 10

Let's get real. If Eloon does gut SS, old folks will be forced to spend down. That will decimate if not eliminate the inheritance of all young people who don't have Trust Fund parents. So youngsters will be left with reduced Social Security, a trickly of inheritance, hollowed out family homes, and deciminated health care. Hobbes told us, life is "solitary, poor, nasty, brutish, and short."

This vivisection of society to suit Eloon's Ego Trip will be fought by everyone in civilized society. Congress is in for an earful.

Lunabell

(7,064 posts)
55. What a fucking Grinch!
Tue Dec 10, 2024, 05:57 PM
Dec 10

So mean spirited and hateful. Too bad Luigi targeted the wrong rich guy.

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