Here's the thing about the UHC murder. There will be no changes to our insurance or healthcare system.

[OrlandoDem2]

Actually, any change I see now involves Trump declaring that Obamacare is a failure and therefore should be abolished. He will make things worse.

I keep seeing politicians declare that they understand people are frustrated with insurance. Gov Shapiro was just on a press conference saying he understands people’s frustrations. I don’t think he really does. I know he’s on my political side but I simply can’t say he “gets” it.

Mangione will be charged. He will be tried. I can’t say I support vigilantism, but I don’t have a lot of sympathy for too many CEOs of multibillion dollar corporations, especially health insurance.

The only way the situation changes is through massive reform to healthcare. I am so tired of spending so much money and getting little in return. People in European countries and Canada have so much better healthcare than we do but our leaders do nothing!

[Sneederbunk]

1. Here's the thing about the UHC murder.

The CEO is still dead.

[LeftInTX]

12. A clone will replace him.

[Hellbound Hellhound]

41. So if a clone replaces the dead one, is it murder? I'd argue not. Luigi should get off scott free. n/t

[ck4829]

2. Why we need to normalize "not paying"

As in "I'm not paying these medical bills that you don't see in other countries in the G7"

[Lunabell]

3. Back a few years ago, the medical office I worked for quit taking United.

Because they would never pay claims that were legit. They were awful!

[onecaliberal]

4. NONE of these people get it. They've never been denied. Made disabled or bankrupted.

And they never will be.
They didn’t watch their patent/child/spouse die of cancer because denial of care, etc.
I will not be mansplained to by anyone. My family lived it. How dare these people.

[Autumn]

5. I have no sympathy for a CEO of UnitedHealth who was in the hot seat for alleged fraud

and illegal insider trading facing up to $5 million in penalties and 20 years of prison time if convicted. the shooter may have done him a favor.

[AdamGG]

19. The shooter didn't do him a favor

Corporate criminals rarely do hard time and he probably had some golden parachutes stashed away.

[OrlandoDem2]

6. We need Medicare for All. Or I'd take some sort of hybrid system.

But we need universal healthcare.

[Silent Type]

10. Yeah. But Congress has had 6 decades to do something and failed. Not suggesting shooting them in back,

but maybe primary them before mid-terms.

And insurers under ACA, Medicare and Medicaid could be disciplined by CMS if they chose to.

[bamagal62]

16. When we lived in Singapore,

They had a hybrid system that seemed to work well. But, that was years ago. Not sure if it’s still the same.

[Skittles]

22. HELLO

we are moving AWAY from Medicare for all

when enough seniors are on the "Advantage" scams, MEDICARE WILL CEASE TO EXIST

OVER HALF OF SENIORS ARE ON ADVANTAGE PLANS NOW, and Project 2025 will make MA scams THE DEFAULT for people new to Medicare.

"Medicare for all" is NOT going to happen.......

[SamuelTheThird]

7. Look into the history of the labor movement

If you think we have any labor rights at all solely due to peaceful means, you will get a wake-up call.

[OrlandoDem2]

8. Oh yes. That is definitely correct.

Many of our rights came as a result of physical struggles.

[hatrack]

14. See also: Ludlow, Homestead, Matewan, Little Steel, Bay View, Pattonsville, Thibodaux . . . .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_worker_deaths_in_United_States_labor_disputes

[Kaleva]

23. Are you advocating we here at DU get violent?

[Voltaire2]

30. nice try

[SamuelTheThird]

39. It's now considered advocating violence to point out historical facts

[Kaleva]

42. That isn't an answer.

Do you think we should use peaceful means in the effort to achieve our goals or should we use violence?

[The Wandering Harper]

43. there's not enough solidarity in this country for either to be effective

I'd like to not believe that but I'm seeing too much evidence to the contrary

[Kaleva]

44. Interesting. You may be right

Neither methods may be effective because there isn't enough support.

[SamuelTheThird]

45. Who is we?

Im not using violence. But, considering the complexities of life, Im not going to just say 'the shooter is an evil person, violence is ALWAYS wrong, and that ends the discussion.'

[Kaleva]

46. So you support we here at DU to use murder and other violence?

You yourself won't use violence but you are ok with others here doing it.

Or do you condemn the use of violence by anyone here at DU?

[SamuelTheThird]

48. How about this

I'm not 'ok' with violence, but the insurance company is magnitudes worse than what the shooter did.

[Scrivener7]

54. Please indicate where you feel the poster advocated

that we here at DU get violent.

I think some feel that dragging out moronic strawmen on this subject makes some kind of a point.

It doesnt.

[Johonny]

9. Im not insurance companies want ACA gone

The system they know is easy the grift. The system to come is likely to be a more state based and a great unknown. The unknown is not exciting for business. ACA slightly deregulated . . . That they would go for.

[Trenzalore]

11. Here is the issue

What i say is in no way an endorsement of what the kid did. This kid is going to have a fan club. In about 2 weeks someone entrepreneurial will be selling t-shirts with his face on it. There will be posters in college dorm rooms. A generation of young disaffected males are going to get a message. We are a society that has prioritized easy access to firearms over everything else. It isn't going to be pretty from there.

[OrlandoDem2]

13. I had never even heard of a ghost gun until today.

You are correct that some kids will get a message out of this.

This is not good at all.

[Stargazer99]

28. Don't you know the wealthy are more valuable people than your public school children?

that is how this sick nation is- treating the most vulnerable in this society, children, I have no sympathy for CEO and his family. Sometimes when you get a taste of your own medicine it educates you and quit the damn whining about it, poor babies these wealthy. The common man is a sacrificial animal to them and they don't give a damn about you lower classes

[Skittles]

53. KID? WTF, THAT GUN HUMPING MURDERER IS 26 YEARS OLD

by that age I had served four years in the military and was established in a career

and FUCK ANYONE who is a fan of executions with no due process, FUCK THAT

[Think. Again.]

15. Bu isn't this widespread discussion about corporate abuses of Americans great!!!

[Ron Green]

17. One risk pool is a health care system. Multiple risk pools is an investment scheme.

We have enough investment schemes in this country; we need a health care system.

The ACA is a massive giveaway to insurers, because that’s the only sort of thing bought lawmakers will vote for.

[AKwannabe]

18. Well. One thing changed...

Those corporate fuckers are SCARED! now

I kinda like it. Wish they would’ve had to sweat a little longer.

[leftieNanner]

21. Yes, but

They won't change their ways. They'll just pay for personal security.

[Cattledog]

51. All their security can't diminish the psychological fear they have

of being a target because it will always be on their minds.

[Meowmee]

20. None of them practically get it

They are mostly fairly well off and or have much better insurance... and they are largely, even many d, BEHOLDEN to the insurance and pharma companies. The insurers etc. like their huge profits, they like to deny as much as possible etc. they like being able to get away with the deaths they directly cause because for the most part no one cares. I call it murder, they know what they are doing. In addition, what they do is fraudulent, denying valid claims when people have paid them vast sums of money for years in many cases. They need to be strictly regulated and all costs need to be controlled.

I know though it will never happen here.

It is not just about huge premium costs, as if that weren't enough, it is about them being able to do whatever they please at any time as well. For instance changing a copay on a med from $25 to $757! And the control of insulin per month cost making insulin no more than $35 per month was not what most think it was, first, it was only for people on medicare, and second, it only covers specific insulins, if you are taking one that is not covered it will still cost a fortune or whatever pharma wants to charge. In addition there are millions on insulin who are not on medicare. It costs very little to make a vial of insulin around $3-6 for novolog.


Mangione's murder of BT shone a spotlight on it briefly for whatever reasons, now it will just go back to the usual again with no one discussing it much if at all.

[berksdem]

24. I work in the industry and this

will do NOTHING to get insurance companies to listen. Once the craziness of this story settles it will be the same old policies as ever. These companies could care less about what their paying members want or need. It is all about growing the earnings per share for investors. Meanwhile, insurance companies are laying off thousands due to Medicaid redeterminations without the media even touching the subject. The company I would for is setting record profits but laying off thousands of employees.

It is corporate greed. People need to understand the corporate elites could care less. This will not change anything.

[OrlandoDem2]

33. Everyone should read this!

[Initech]

25. I saw a headline today: "Health insurance companies worried about protecting top execs".

They learned nothing. Nothing about what needs to be changed. All they care about is their stupid fucking money.

[Klarkashton]

26. Reform of healthcare is just another "thoughts and prayers"

Thing. Put it on the pile along with "vote them out" and "non violent marches"

[brush]

27. Right. The big wigs will just get 24/7 bodyguards.

[Voltaire2]

29. Well at the least it has surfaced widespread discontent, and another national discussion about how shitty

our system is. This is an opportunity for the opposition party to stand against the system rather than perpetually standing with the system.

[OrlandoDem2]

34. Well, we have national discussions of our shitty gun laws and nothing changes!

How many days before another tragic mass shooting?

[Voltaire2]

36. There is a huge difference in this event.

both left and right working class people vocalized support for or sympathy with the shooter. With gun control the issue is entirely polarized within the working class.

The point is that the democratic party could exploit this as a wedge issue to regain support among workers. If only we had candidates with the foresight to foreground this issue in their national campaigns.

[OrlandoDem2]

37. You're not wrong. I still have little faith this'll change anything.

[Voltaire2]

38. Oh sure, most likely everything will continue to get worse.

On that we agree. My only point is that this opportunity exists.

[Irish_Dem]

31. Rates will go up to cover the fat cats' security teams.

This is the reality of how the insurance scams work.

[KT2000]

32. The story now will be

how insane he is.
The healthcare issue will die away and be forgotten.

[Blue_Roses]

35. Big Corporations will never see it

the way we do, because they don't walk in our shoes. They can't see or feel what they've never known. The fear of losing someone they love, because their claim has been denied is not something the Fat Cats have to worry about. But, WE--the "little"people--do!

If they're only concerned with making money for their investors then that's a tough wall to tear down.

[scipan]

40. I see a lot of posts from people in Europe in threads

asking us why we put up with it. Apparently they think we have the power to change it, which is ironic given the last election. But... If thousands and thousands of people took to the streets protesting this, could it possibly change things?

I once read a post from someone in Europe that said, in my country, the politicians are afraid of us while in the USA we are afraid of our politicians.

[LudwigPastorius]

47. You are correct, there will be no change.

Not until Democrats control the White House, Senate, and House again.

The last time that happened, it was for only 72 days, but we got the Affordable Care Act. (...which wasn't what we really wanted, but it did improve the lives of millions) If the majorities in Congress had been larger, Obama might have been able to do better, but pragmatically, he got the best law he could at the time.

Democrats have shown a willingness to make changes, but Republicans NEVER will.

[GoodRaisin]

49. Nope. It's just one less corrupt asshole who profited off the misery of others.

The next corrupt asshole will step right up in his place. Murder won’t make it go away.

[JI7]

50. The problem comes down to voters themselves

people say they support certain things. But once the right wing runs ads about how some"illegal" or transgender" person will get something out of it they will oppose it.

[usonian]

52. Costs will go up, benefits down, to pay for the Musk and Zuck sized armies of bodyguards.