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T_i_B

(14,800 posts)
Wed Jul 10, 2019, 12:44 AM Jul 2019

I told you these people are batshit insane.....

My first hand experience of Conservative party grassroots has made me very aware of how dreadful they are, but they keep plumbing new lows in their drift into full on extreme nationalism.

The grassroots tories interviewed are sadly not unrepresentative of that parties activists at all. And now they have Boris Johnson telling them what they want to hear, and they will lap it up no matter how blatantly untrue it is or how badly their representatives behave.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-boris-johnson-jeremy-hunt-tory-leadership-elections-romford-a8991441.html

"We are crying out for a strong person. It is their strength that we are seeking. Boris offers that. We want someone strong. We haven’t had a strong leader since Margaret Thatcher. Boris is the nearest and the best. He is a strong man. He is a heavyweight.”

Linda Owen, who is 81, says these words while framed by a proscenium arch of Margaret Thatcher photographs on the wall beside her. She is sitting inside Margaret Thatcher House, as Romford MP Andrew Rosindell has renamed his constituency office in what is technically east London but spiritually very much Essex. Linda is one of roughly 160,000 people who, over the next two weeks, will exercise their right to choose the country’s next prime minister. She has brought her voting slip with her. It is fair to say the weight of the decision, between the two names on the paper, has not borne down very heavily upon her. The same is true for Sue Connolly, 71, the Romford Association secretary and Mr Rosindell’s constituency secretary. There is little point asking who she intends to vote for. She has a “Back Boris” badge on her top, and she’s just finished handing out three more to everybody else in the office, one of whose work overalls and branded polo shirt intimate he is there in a maintenance, rather than political, capacity.

“Oh I’ll be voting Boris. Big time. Big time. Jeremy Hunt’s a Remainer. You can’t vote for a Remainer. We’ve already had one, and Hunt’s just Theresa May in trousers. We can’t have all that again,” she says. Sue sees Brexit as the first domino in the EU’s eventual collapse, an outcome that can’t come soon enough. “Once we go, all the others that want out will follow,” she says. “That’s why they’ve made it so difficult. Once we’re out it starts the roll. The whole thing is a shambles, it’ll all break up.”

And getting out, on 31 October, is all that matters. The spending commitments, the other policies, of either candidate, do not weigh a feather in the balance.
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mr_lebowski

(33,643 posts)
1. Everyone wants to devolve into tribes ... even if they won't say, people see cataclysms are coming
Wed Jul 10, 2019, 02:33 AM
Jul 2019

foisted upon this world (ultimately due to overpopulation) ... climate change, resource depletion, water wars, massive social upheaval, wars, refugees ... people are scared to their core, and seeking the comfort of the familiar, gathering people around them they think they can count on.

It's not as unreasonable as I wish it was. It's fun to think all these people are just batshit crazy, but ... some real shit is going to be coming down, sadly. I don't agree with their 'responses', I think they're mostly going to make shit worse ... but I kinda understand it at the same time.

Deep down, they think when the chips are down, they can only trust 'their own', whatever their perception of 'their own' actually is. So they're trying to dig in with 'their people' for the shitstorm.

I think it's animal instinct, and it's going to be very hard to overcome.

TreasonousBastard

(43,049 posts)
6. Tribalism is in our DNA-- it goes back to where...
Wed Jul 10, 2019, 04:43 AM
Jul 2019

our ancestors had to watch out for the scumbags in Cave #46 who would steal our food and women. It's a pervasion of the "Fight or Flight" mechanism we are born with.

Chimpanzees will often murder an outsider who stumbles upon the troop.

We are no better, although we are much more sophisticated about it.

LeftishBrit

(41,303 posts)
2. The worship of 'strong leaders' is one of the more dangerous aspects of politics
Wed Jul 10, 2019, 02:44 AM
Jul 2019

Especially when combined with nostalgia and the desire to Make (insert country) Great Again.

As a friend once put it: 'You can have a strong horse, and it can still pull you off the edge of a cliff.'

That some rather elderly Conservative party members hold such views is not terribly surprising. What shocks me more is that the MP would call his constituency office 'Margaret Thatcher House' and adorn it with photographs of his late heroine. Surely a constituency office should be for use by all constituents, not just those who voted for the MP's party. It's not identical with party headquarters!

T_i_B

(14,800 posts)
3. The MP in question is Andrew Rosindell
Wed Jul 10, 2019, 03:19 AM
Jul 2019

So I would not be in any way surprised if I were you. He's extremely partisan and extremely nationalist.

The worship of "strong" leaders is one thing, but the idea that Boris Johnson will be a strong leader is laughable tripe. Even more so than it was for Theresa May. Bombastic bullshit does not mean strong leadership.

LeftishBrit

(41,303 posts)
7. 'Strong leader' is often confused with 'aggressive attitude'
Thu Jul 11, 2019, 02:44 AM
Jul 2019

I suppose by these standards, some people would regard an uncontrolled toddler as a strong leader...Well, when you think of who is in the White House....

T_i_B

(14,800 posts)
8. Many political terms and phrases have been abused to the point of meaninglessness
Thu Jul 11, 2019, 12:57 PM
Jul 2019

Last edited Fri Jul 12, 2019, 01:23 AM - Edit history (2)

"Strong Leader" is just such a term. You would think that the Conservatives would have learnt their lesson on this point from Theresa May posing as a strong leader before being exposed as being nothing of the sort. Instead they are doubling down on the worst errors of recent years.

Strong leaders can tell uncomfortable truths to their own side. No leader of the Conservative party has done that since John Major.

Soph0571

(9,685 posts)
4. Boris Johnson is a strong leader?!?!
Wed Jul 10, 2019, 03:35 AM
Jul 2019

Excuse me while I go and wipe the tears of laughter from eyes... although ti not really that funny I suppose - in the post truth era perception is everything.

Kablooie

(18,775 posts)
5. They are yearning for their own Hitler to take control .
Wed Jul 10, 2019, 03:49 AM
Jul 2019

That's what they are basically saying.
They want a monster because they think that he will become their monster.
They don't have the intelligence to see that a monster lives only for himself, not for the people.

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