I had an epiphany ...

[1StrongBlackMan]

during a discussion with Progressive friend that has been highly critical of President Obama using the same "arguments" I see here at DU ... &quot President) Obama has, and is misusing his, bully pulpit" ... &quot President) Obama just needs to channel FDR" ... &quot President) Obama just needs to grow a pair" ... &quot President) Obama has no (Democratic) principles that he is willing to fight for hard enough move the gop."

It gave him pause and I believe it'll stall the arguments here ... Well ... every argument coming from anyone with a modicum of intellectual honesty/self-awareness.

I asked my friend:

What amount of bully pulpit usage, or emotional/intellectual argument, or intellectual or even physical force from a republican, would cause you to turn your back on Medicare or SS or Medicaid or any other deeply held tradition?

Nothing ... right?

Then what makes you think that President Obama can use any of those tools on this extremist brand of gop ... All he can do cut the best deal out there, while attempting to flip enough moderate republicans; in order to govern this nation ... you know, that luxury that you do not have to worry about.

My friend opened his mouth to respond ... then, closed it in thought ... then, paid for lunch.

[freshwest]

1. You really have changed a lot of hearts and minds, sir. Thanks for using you wisdom this way.

[1StrongBlackMan]

2. Well ...

I changed one person's mind.

He recognized that there was nothing the gop could do to change his position ... But more importantly, he recognized that he had the luxury of pontificating, without the burden of having to govern.

... But then again, my friend is both self-aware and intellectually honest.

[freshwest]

3. He sounds like a good friend to have.

[Cha]

6. Lucky you, having a friend who is self-aware and intellectually honest.

That's a treasure!

Recognizing, his luxury of soapboxing with the burden of the job? Unheard of!

[IrishAyes]

17. Did you by any chance mean 'without' the burden of the job?

If so, it describes my lifelong position in general. That's why I can gleefully support someone whose governance happens to be somewhat less radical than my own beliefs, because it won't do anyone a bit of good to hold our noses when we don't get everything we want in total, immediately if not sooner. So long as someone can push the nation in the correct direction, leftward of any particular present, I'll have their back.

After all, that's how you eat an elephant - one chunk at a time.

Another point: Listening to President Obama at any stage of development, trying to gauge his true heart, I've always felt him not only to be a man of character and honor, but quite possibly more leftward than it's currently possible to govern just now. I mean, comparing the electorate to a horse in a race (as opposed to a real race horse), you can kick it in the ribs only so hard and so long before it drops dead under you and you still won't wind up any closer to the finish (goal) line.

Now it's time for me to control myself and resume limiting my summer online time in order to do justice to other pressing matters. I've decided to give myself Saturday evenings or perhaps Sunday mornings to swing by and try to keep up on the reading; but it appears the only way to control my overt participation will be to unplug the keyboard after I log on, or at least after I respond to one thread only. Otherwise I'll continue over-indulging myself at the expense of other obligations. Let's hope that effort at self control will work. Sometimes I have to set up roadblocks which can't actually stop me but might slow me down enough for embarrassment to finish the job.

[freshwest]

21. Thanks for taking time to make that good comment.

[IrishAyes]

25. And I meant it with the greatest respect and affection, which are highly deserved.

[Cha]

22. Yes! Thanks for catching my mistake after all this time, IrishAyes.

I had reread it before I saw your post and it still didn't dawn on me.

"Recognizing, his luxury of soapboxing withOUT the burden of the job?"

Now, to what you have to say.. Well said, IrishAyes.

PBO is a pragmatic leader and a man of honor, who is accomplishing the art of the possible. While dealing with irrational people, who have been sent to congress to thwart his every move.

A man with patience, fortitude, and a vision for building a stronger America at its very Foundation. I consider America Lucky to have him at this time in History.

I know what you mean about having to ration your time on the internet.. I'm doing a bit of that myself these days. It's addictive to type our thoughts out and interact with people from all over who share a hope for our country and Planet's future.

Good Luck, IrishAyes!

[Warpy]

4. I respectfully disagree

You are correct that televised press conferences and speeches are not going to reach Tea Party Republicans. That's really not the point.

Obama's underuse of the bully pulpit has led to his presidency and policies being defined 100% by corporate media. To say that many Democrats are wondering why they bother to vote is a great understatement. Obama needs to get out there for his own party. We know theirs is hopeless.

There is an election coming up that will decide what kind of Congress he will face during his final two years in office. We could use his help in rallying the party to make sure that Congress is no longer a GOP Clown Congress.

And that's why he needs to make better use of the bully pulpit.

[1StrongBlackMan]

7. Yes ...

we can do that (respectfully disagree).

Witness the Gun Control Issue: President Obama was just about as far out there for his party, and more imortantly, the American people, as one man can get AND he had the help of Biden and Clinton and Gifford AND the corporate media did not define the message ...

And what was the result?

Bottomline ... America supports winners and there is NO winning in this environment, unless he/we can pile off enough sane republicans (and the polling indicates that they ARE out there) to get something done.

President Obama will never please the far Left or the tea party republicans; but the former doesn't have to worry about actually getting anything done (i.e., governing) and the latter has no interest in governing.

[IrishAyes]

18. You're totally correct in large,

though I ask (not just you but also) everyone to remember quietly (I'll try not to keep repeating myself) that the Far Left is no more monolithic than most other groups. We have a strong pro-Obama faction as well. The Far Right appears indeed to be united in their crazed opposition, that I concede.

But I gave my promise to participate in keeping a prayer cover over Our Man and I certainly do. There are very few people on earth for whom I'd be willing to take a bullet (as I might indeed be forced to do eventually here in RedNeckLand), but it would be the greatest honor imaginable whether I appreciated the occasion or not. With any luck I might even get the chance somehow to continue to badger conservatives from beyond the grave. It would make a strong argument for reincarnation or at least haunting. I'll stop fighting those bastards when and only if I cease to exist on any plane.

[1StrongBlackMan]

20. Believe me ...

I know that no group is monolithic; but I have not seen/heard of the pro-President Obama faction of the FAR left.

[IrishAyes]

23. Perhaps it's because I don't represent a formally recognized/organized group of good lefties?

You've not seen or heard of us, other than my protestations, because we are doubtless a minority and no one can know everything about anything. Even if I appear to be a voice crying in the wilderness, I know I'm not alone. Whether we are many or few, I have friends in wide circles even if not a highly visible, widely known, formal FAR left organization to validate me. Which I don't need for my own purposes anyway. I know OFA doesn't fall into that category, but it will have to do as my best known group.

I just can't accept seeing the entire left field smeared with the tar brush that I agree so many if not most deserve on occasion. Neither will I allow another to cancel my card any more than I seek outside validation. As Popeye (the sailor, not the Gene Hackman narc) used to say, I yam what I yam, and that's all I yam.

[truebluegreen]

27. How do you define "far left",

pro-Obama or otherwise?

I haven't seen any "far leftys" in decades.

[IrishAyes]

28. I'm sorry you've missed so much fun.

W/o listing all specifications, which may or may not trigger a useless argument - it usually does - suffice it to say for now, left of Kucinich and Wellstone. Right of Marx.

[truebluegreen]

30. "Missed so much fun"?

Maybe I'm just grumpy today but that doesn't track...

Ever visited this site? www.politicalcompass.org I am about a -8.4 on economic issues, and -7.3 on social. Which puts me well to the left of Kucinich on economic issues and much more libertarian on social ones (don't have data on Wellstone).

My point is that with rare exceptions, I have seen very few lefties in public life, the vast majority having been marginalized, ostracized or worse for decades.

BTW, on that site, which goes by actions and not speeches, Obama is +6.0 / +6.0...

But by all means, keep whacking away at those trolls.

[IrishAyes]

31. Just because you don't understand something doesn't necessarily mean it doesn't 'track'

Otherwise we'd find ourselves in a situation where I require outside validation, something that really doesn't 'track' with me!

Regardless, perhaps we can agree that too few publicly prominent lefties support President Obama to the degree he deserves. That apparent fact has no bearing on what I am or am not personally. Although it's a mere construct, I'm stipulating for discussion that Marx represents one end of the political spectrum and perhaps Larouche and company the other. Wellstone was at least close to Kucinich, btw.

My own self assessment - remember I know myself better than anyone else does and therefore might provide the closest mark - reads lifelong ardent ultra-socialist. Make of that whatever you wish. To the teabaggers here in RedNeckLand, I'm a threat to everything they hold dear.

I certainly hope so. It would make a fine epitaph.

[truebluegreen]

32. The only thing that doesn't track is your reference to "fun".

But whatever.

My point is that there aren't any publicly prominent lefties, and haven't been for decades. As I said before. I consider Kucinich and Wellstone solid Democrats from days gone by. Check out the website I sent you. I doubt you will learn something about yourself, but you might learn some other things.

[IrishAyes]

33. After a hairy week

I'm saving that website for later when I can give it my full attention.

Meanwhile, by 'fun' I meant I enjoy my life's work more than mere idle amusements.

But what, dear heart, did you mean about doubting I'd learn anything about myself?
(1) You don't know jack about who I might really be in 'real life' or what I've done
(2) Are you saying I'm dense or slow? Maybe I am since I don't follow you any better than you do me. Maybe it works both ways.

[truebluegreen]

34. Are we a little sensitive, or something?

I was agreeing that it seemed you already knew yourself well, but possibly did not know as much about our leaders as you might.

Have a nice evening.

[TheMadMonk]

5. Not sure it's relevant when there's a lot more flipping happening in the blue camp.

Cut deals? FFS, he begins a bargaining session by offering more than the other side ever dared asked for, and WE express surprise when the Republicans then cross their arms and ask "What else have you got?"

He is not governing a nation, he's steering it down the gurgler.

While he "compromises" with extremists, he fucking well legitimises those very same extremists by simple virtue of his office.

He should as used his office as it was bloody well intended when the constituiton was written. To put a brake on such extremism, or force it to come right out into the open, to be embraced or rejected by the nation as a whole.

[1StrongBlackMan]

8. Stop with the "failed negotiator" madness ...

It is completely disengenuous, or uninformed, to argue "he begins a bargaining session by offering more than the other side ever dared asked for."

He should as used his office as it was bloody well intended when the constituiton was written. To put a brake on such extremism, or force it to come right out into the open, to be embraced or rejected by the nation as a whole.

What do you think he is/has been doing? And guess what ... a majority of the American electorate, including a clear plurality of independent voters and a clear plurality of republican voters see it.

The only ones missing it are the "Progressives" and the "Left" here on DU.

[TheMadMonk]

13. Your idea of progressive/lefty in the US, qualifies as roughly centre,...

...bordering on right of centre in pretty much all of the rest of the Western World.

It does not take many seatbelt, helmet, mobile phone, similar "I'm not hurting anybody" threads to see just how libertarian even progressive champions can be in the US.

What he/his administration has been doing to date is: Making permanent and expanding upon Bush/Cheney's temporary, emergency powers;
Made permanent the TEMPORARY Bush tax cuts;
Expanded enormously upon the USA's extra-judicial/legal program of targetted killings;
Rather than punish the banks, he allowed them to be compensated at the FURTHER EXPENSE of their victims and taxpayers in general;
Cracking down on whistleblowers;
Using selective enforcement of federal drug laws in states that have legalised marijuana to intimidate;
Overseeing the comercialisation of free public schooling;
Stood aside while Red States (and not a few blue) gutted labour laws;
Refused time and time again to prosecute proven malfeasance;


He is like the bullied kid who keeps going back, time and time again, to the bullies, in the ludicrous hope that if he eats enough shit, they'll one day make him their friend.

[Cha]

14. You've already been asked nicely to take your comments to

GD. Now I'm saying you're not welcome here.

It's clear from your bullshit post that you have no idea what President Obama has in mind with his negotiation style.

[sheshe2]

15. I posted it nicely.

You didn't listen.

Bye!

[IrishAyes]

24. We need a 'Kicked to the Curb' smilie with the character in this position <

and stars emanating from his behind.

[sheshe2]

26. Good one, IrishAyes!

[sheshe2]

10. May I remind you,

That you are posting on the Barrack Obama Group. This is for a Group that supports This President.

This is a group, not a forum. Groups often serve as safe havens for members who share similar interests and viewpoints. Individuals who post messages contrary to a particular group's stated purpose can be excluded from posting in that group. For detailed information about this group and its purpose

Please take your comments to GD.

[elleng]

9. THANKS, Man!

[sheshe2]

11. One down~

Now we move to the next one, then the next!

Thank you, 1StrongBlackMan!

[grantcart]

12. interesting but I simly have never had any friend in

Real life pose any of those statements or sentiments. This are people who spend lots of hours canvassing and club work.

[IrishAyes]

19. Good riddance to the troll invasion. Thanks to all who rapped their knuckles good.

[LeftInTX]

29. Good work on your part!