Question about the use of VPNs

[Baitball Blogger]

I already googled it and it basically says it's legal, except for where it's not. That's the short notes.

As I understand it, VPNs allow you to access a streaming service from a country, not your own. In doing so, it allows you to access shows that the streaming service has the rights to for that country. So, let's say, with my Netflix account I can use the VPN service to log into a Japan Netflix streaming service in order to see the show Goblin. Which is my intention, assuming this is all on the level.

If there is any reason where this fails the stink test, I can access the show through viki.com, which just means dealing with a lot of nuisance commercials. No biggie in the long run.

Anyone have more information on the subject?

[Ohiya]

1. I tried to watch a show on UK Netflix

Some how Netflex could tell I was using a VPN and would not allow me to watch it. I have watched sports on Australian TV and I watched a lot of the last Olympics on Canadian TV without any problems.

[Baitball Blogger]

2. I'll research it somemore. Thanks for the info.

[JustAnotherGen]

3. I used it while out of the USA

For three weeks over the winter holidays.
Amazon was wonky but Hulu and Netflix were fine.


I have to look into this viki.

[Hugh_Lebowski]

4. When you network through a VPN service, say in another country

You are essentially disguising 'where you are physically located'. The IP address of the VPN service becomes 'all that the world sees' in terms of routing traffic to you.

However, it's a mistake to think NECESSARILY that "VPNs allow you to access a streaming service from a country, not your own".

The hitch in the plan comes in because there are streaming services (and even just regular websites) that track down and blacklist the IP addresses of known VPN servers. They just basically determine you're on a VPN, and some will just say 'so fuck you, we assume you're not really here'.

It's not that they actually know where YOU are, but they know their traffic is being routed to a VPN server because they've ID'd the addresses of VPN servers in the area that are being used to 'spoof'. And they can just be like 'no, we won't route to that IP address'.

I guarantee you there's not one real-money gambling site in the USA where you're going to get away with placing bets through a VPN by faking the house out and making them think you're actually in NV when you're in another state, using a VPN. But then they are likely more diligent and thorough because we're talking state laws here.

So yeah, it MIGHT work, but then again it might not, is what I'm trying to say.

[Baitball Blogger]

7. Thank you for the information.

I am not 100% convinced that this is a kosher way to see a foreign show, so I am sticking to the foreign streaming service that offers it for free, as long as you are okay with the nuisance commercials.

But, yeah, crazy to accept gambling debts through a VPN connection.

[Hugh_Lebowski]

8. I don't know that it's strictly speaking a shady thing to do

If you're in the US you aren't in a legal jeopardy by trying to use a VPN in this way (not true in every country ... China for example, but it is true here).

You just have to go in with the understanding that it may or may not work depending on what you're trying to do.

And what I explained is the basic mechanism involved in 'why it may not work'

[Baitball Blogger]

11. I might give it a shot.

On a cursory search I discovered that free VPNs are not really free. Sounds like you have to give them a credit card with a subscription for a 30 day trial period. The Viki program I am using might do the same thing in the long run. But, hopefully, the Korean shows I want to see after this latest one I'm watching will be available on the seven other streaming services we're subscribed to. It really is a lot of nonsense to keep up with it all.

Thanks again!

[lapfog_1]

9. that said, if YOU create a server

that is in, say Nevada, and you create your own VPN from your laptop to the server in Nevada, I challenge them to determine that your data is actually coming from Kansas or someplace.

There are many "open source" code VPN software out on the internet... however setting this up is likely beyond the technical expertise of most people.

The only sure way to know that someone is using a VPN is to time RT traffic from the remote user... and compare that to the RT traffic of the VPN endpoint address ( our NV located server ). If the RT time is substantially different, you have located a VPN user.

There might be a way to fool even this detection measure... but that would take even more elaborate VPN technology than what is found in the open source world.

[Hugh_Lebowski]

10. Sure. But the big streaming providers monitor the 'big' VPN service providers

IOW the type an average person is likely to come across an advertisement for and avail themselves of the VPN service for ... and then have the ability to just say ... we won't route to their IP addresses because we can't confirm where the end-user actually is, and then you're thwarted. They don't have to know you're in KS specifically they can just be like 'we won't do VPNs that we know are VPNs'

That's their simplest line of defense, and it's probably a pretty effective one.

Also they could block you during authentication by saying 'this license is for Netflix USA ONLY' for example, and then denying you entry if you 'show up' to log in on an IP that's in ... say ... Tokyo.

[intrepidity]

12. So what do VPNs with blacklisted IPs do then?

And how long does it take to rehabilitate an IP, or is it forever tarnished?

I use Surfshark and there are plenty of occasions where a host won't serve me, so I know it's an issue. But what do the VPNs do to counter, to maintain their business?

It's a cointoss with the streaming services. Hulu definitely does not let me use one; Netflix and Prime are inconsistent. In fact, was watching Prime awhile ago, and when I finished one show, then got a message saying to turn off the VPN.

[lapfog_1]

6. A VPN or virtual private tunnel creates an encrypted packet switched network

between two points. It is analogous to you sending a letter to your cousin using USPS versus sending the same letter to a location near you ( again using USPS ), then that place bundles your letter with a bunch of other letters and puts them all in a Manila envelope and sending that package via FedEx to someplace near your cousin. At the destination, somebody opens the manila envelope and takes your letter and drops it in a mailbox using USPS to deliver it to your cousin. The postmark on the envelope "appears" to be from the destination person that opened the manila envelope. That's all that the USPS knows about the letter.

That said, someone could possibly look at the TIME it took for the letter from you (the sender) to some destination ( say Netflix ) and decide that yours took too long compared to where your letter was postmarked ( the destination of the VPN where the letter was removed from the manila envelope and dropped into the USPS ).

The Internet is essentially doing the same thing. All IP packets have a wrapper around the actual message which have things like address of sender/receiver, postmarks, etc. A VPN takes that entire message ( your data plus the wrapper data ), encrypts it, and puts a new wrapper around the encrypted message and then sends THAT message to their destination... where it is decrypted and unwrappered... and then sends the original message to the destination you intended.

This is why it is called a "tunnel". It makes it appear (except for the time it takes for the message) as if you are really at the tunnel end point instead of being at the tunnel origination point ( your location ).

There are even more ways to detect this ( using a commercial VPN service allows them to flag all such services because of their fixed addresses in the various cities that have their "endpoints", for example ).


this is a ip traffic traceroute from my laptop to DU.

Tracing route to www.democraticunderground.com.cdn.cloudflare.net [104.21.6.48]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 1 ms 1 ms 1 ms NANO-ROUTER [10.0.0.1]
2 1 ms 1 ms 1 ms 192.210.25.113
3 3 ms 2 ms 2 ms 192.210.25.45
4 3 ms 4 ms 75 ms 10gigabitethernet5-9.core2.fmt2.he.net [216.218.193.29]
5 4 ms 2 ms 3 ms 100ge10-1.core3.fmt2.he.net [72.52.92.29]
6 * * * Request timed out.
7 5 ms 12 ms 4 ms equinix-sanjose.as13335.net [206.223.116.237]
8 5 ms 17 ms 5 ms 172.69.132.2
9 4 ms 3 ms 3 ms 104.21.6.48

Trace complete.

This is with NordVPN (same laptop)

Tracing route to www.democraticunderground.com.cdn.cloudflare.net [104.21.6.48]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 55 ms 53 ms 52 ms 10.5.0.1
2 58 ms 58 ms 53 ms 185.187.168.125
3 62 ms 56 ms 56 ms vl204.sjc-eq10-core-2.cdn77.com [185.229.188.118]
4 53 ms 55 ms 66 ms sjo-b23-link.ip.twelve99.net [62.115.40.17]
5 56 ms 88 ms 83 ms cloudflare-ic-363853.ip.twelve99-cust.net [213.248.79.53]
6 61 ms 57 ms 54 ms 172.71.156.4
7 64 ms 60 ms 65 ms 104.21.6.48

Trace complete.