I know it can't just be me..

[JHan]

All these beautiful desperately-trying-to-understand pieces about white angst and anger and I'm here sitting like.. really?

All my grandparents have ever known is holding their noses when they vote, same with my parents. We're accustomed to weighing our options and figuring out who will seek our interests, and in some cases constantly disappointed.

Time you point out black angst though, the commentary switches to "black anger" and BLM are often as framed as "terrorists"

I mean really ask yourself how Trump gets away with having a white nationalist as his top adviser while Obama was excoriated for his friendship with jeremiah wright.

The hypocrisy and double standard stinks to high heaven.

[MFM008]

1. It isn't just you

And I'm not a person of color.

[Raster]

65. Agreed!

Make America GREAT Again! = Make America WHITE Again!

[Merlot]

79. Exactly.

I'm sick of hearing about these poor mis-understood people: the minority who's rule we now live under. I'm supposed to worry about understanding them? to me, their message was pretty loud and clear, no mystery.

And have you ever heard what some of those people say about democrats - their fellow citizens?

[Nonhlanhla]

2. I agree with you

I'm white, but it bothers me that (after an election in which the KKK's favorite candidate won with a message of racial hatred, when racial/ethnic minorities are rightfully worried about what will happen to them under this new regime), all eyes are turned to white people's angst. I mean, I get it, since it played a role in the win. But I tend to want to reserve my concern for those who are adversely affected by all that white angst.

On edit: I hope it's OK that I posted here. I did not realize the post was in the African American group until after I posted. The thread had shown up on the front page. But I still want to say, it's not just you.

[JHan]

26. The thing is..

I think even his supporters know it, and his enablers in the media know it -

"Since it played a role in the win" - and literally it was all about winning to show "those people" , and no further inquiry necessary, no further questioning of why so many scapegoat other groups, it's just accepted as fact. Like Tweety on Election Night saying "I didn't hear Clinton talk about immigration" - and I Thought to myself : Well Chris, I didn't hear you examining whether any of Trump's claims about immigration were bogus or not. Tweety, like so many others in the media, took everything at face value. So what Democratic politicians needed to do was lie to them, sit with them and pretend, even join in, "say something about immigration" , it doesn't matter what the truth is, no evidence is required, we were to treat with their assumptions as though their world view was truth, and we must develop a unique language to talk directly to them..

Nothing wrong with addressing the specific concerns of groups but what language do I use to engage with someone who thinks Mexicans are to blame for their problems and the Muslims are trying to take over??.

[mercuryblues]

34. spot on

The only thing is that if the Democrats lied like the Republiklans did, they would be called out on it.

I think it was politifact that examined Clinton vs TRUssia statements. The conclusion was TRUssia lied 76% of the time and Clinton told the truth 72% of the time. TRUssia, with the help of the media, labeled Clinton the liar.

[Nonhlanhla]

42. We are in agreement on this

The media largely offers a white conservative gaze on the country's issues, which is why they mostly ignore the threat that Trump poses to minorities, immigrants, etc. THAT should be our focus in the aftermath of his "election." We should be focused on the real life consequences of this election for those who are scapegoated by Trump's rhetoric and potential actions. NOT on white angst. At least not this extent.

[JustAnotherGen]

3. ITA

Suck it up buttercups. These special "oh woe is me I'm a victim people" are cry babies.

[mrsv]

4. I feel ya...

Racism runs so deep in this country that America has elected a man who could potentially destroy our country if not the world.

[Afromania]

5. not just you

It's amazing how they insist that we (black folk) should get over their (the racist/the bigoted) slights and now they cry, whine and trash with the shoe dangling off the other foot. We have all these think pieces about calling these folks racist with commenters who "no longer care about your plight" because you call their Trump voting friends and family "racist". I mean, did I miss something or has calling racist white folk racist become their false equivalent to us being called the n-word? If not, then they are sure as hell acting like it is and if so then, well, hey. Welcome to our world feel free to pull up a chair and have a real "dialog" about it.

[JustAnotherGen]

8. They better get used to it

Everything Trump Co does to them - Fox will tell them that we personally did it to them. The stupid little fucks will believe it - so I don't want to be their "friend".

They are just as vile as their leaders.

[Eliot Rosewater]

56. This is the serious problem we face. The republican party is about to

rip terror and hell on earth into the lives of all Americans including each and every one of them who voted for them.

The damage will be limitless and yet the rank and file conservative is going to blame Obama and the liberals.

It is a beautiful situation when you think about it, they have created endless sources of fake news or false news like Fox and Breitbart so nothing that is actually true will ever penetrate their world.

Sadly, I must report to you this is the exact scenario that makes it an almost certainty we will become a dictatorship and it is going to happen in months, not years.

[kjones]

69. Their bubble is practically flawless.

[plimsoll]

35. Not you alone.

Here’s my problem.

I know there are decent non-racist white folks in the rural US. I’m sure they keep their opinions to themselves, and I’m sure black people understand the risks of bucking an entrenched system of racism. Honestly are you going to call your racists neighbor a racist knowing that he’s armed and may decide that liberal <racist slur> lovers shouldn’t be killed first? I’ll admit to cowardice on that front. After all you can’t call racist white extremist groups racist let alone terrorists. (I feel a snort about political correctness there.)

So our answer to dealing with white racists is to be more understanding of them? Haven’t we been trying that since Nov 1980? As far as I can tell placating hate groups just emboldens them. We should be trying to figure out how to not smear and protect the rural voters who aren’t racist. They will be extinct (literally?) if we don’t.

(BTW sorry about posting here as a white person.)

[Afromania]

36. howdy

Nothing to be sorry about, thanks for your insight.

[JHan]

86. Thanks for sharing your experience. I've been reading articles on Redneck Revolt:

and I'll share some of it with you - there are many articles on the way the white elite have divided the poor.

Immediately after the election, right wingers - and unfortunately some liberals - conflated these divide and rule tactics with the brand of "identity politics" practiced by liberals. A very common RW attack, but Identity politics , or addressing the particular needs of groups, has often arisen in response to the machinations of Rich White Men,

It is all part of the American Story:

"

Up until the 1680’s little distinction was made in the status of Blacks and English and other Europeans held in involuntary servitude. Contrary to common belief, the status of Blacks in the first seventy years of the Virginia colony was not that of racial, lifelong, hereditary slavery, and the majority of the whites who came were not "free”. Black and white servants intermarried, escaped together, and rebelled together.

There were a series of servile rebellions that threatened the plantation system in the period preceding the transition to racially designated chattel slavery and white supremacy. In 1661 Black and Irish servants joined in an insurrectionary plot in Bermuda. In 1663, in Virginia, there was an insurrection for the common freedom of Blacks, whites and Indian servants. In the next 20 years, there were no fewer than ten popular and servile revolts and plots in Virginia. Also many Black and white servants successfully escaped (to Indian territories) and established free societies.

The 20 year period of servile rebellions made the issue of social control urgent for the plantation owners, at the same time as they economically needed to move to a system of perpetual slavery. The purpose of creating a basic White/Black division was in order to have one section of labor police and control the other. As Allen says, “The non-slavery of white labor was the indispensable condition for the slavery of black labor”.

A series of laws were passed and practices imposed that forged a qualitative distinction between white and Black labor. In 1661 a Virginia law imposed twice the penalty time for escaped English bond-servants who ran away in the company of an African life-time bond-servant. Heavy penalties were imposed on white women servants who bore children fathered by Africans. One of the very first white slave privileges was the exemption of white servant women from work in the fields and the requirements through taxes to force Black children to go to work at twelve, while white servant children were excused until they were fourteen. In 1680, Negroes were forbidden to carry arms, defensive or offensive. At the same time, it was made legal to kill a Negro fugitive bond-servant who resisted recapture.

What followed 1680 was a 25 year period of laws that systematically drew the color line as the limit on various economic, social, and political rights. By 1705, “the distinction between white servants and Black slavery were fixed: Black slaves were to be held in life long hereditary slavery and whites for five years, with many rights and protections afforded to them by law.”

We can infer from these series of laws that white laborers were not “innately racist” before the material and social distinctions were drawn. This is evidenced by the rulers’ need to impose very harsh penalties against white servants who escaped with Blacks or who bore them children. As historian Philip Bruce observed of this period, many white servants “...had only recently arrived from England, and were therefore comparatively free from... race prejudice.”

The white bond-servants now could achieve freedom after 5 years service: the white women and children, at least, were freed from the most arduous labor. The white bond servant, once freed, had the prospect of the right to vote and to own land (at the Indians’ expense).

These privileges did not come from the kindness of the planters’ hearts nor from some form of racial solidarity. (Scottish coal miners were held in slavery in the same period of time.) Quite simply, the poor whites were needed and used as a force to suppress the main labor force: the African chattel slaves. The poor white men constituted the rank and file of the militias and later (beginning in 1727) the slave patrols. They were given added benefits, such as tax exemptions to do so. By 1705, after Blacks had been stripped of the legal right to self-defense, the white bond servant was given a musket upon completion of servitude. There was such a clear and conscious strategy that by 1698 there were even “deficiency laws” that required the plantation owners to maintain a certain ratio of white to African servants. The English Parliament, in 1717, passed a law making transportation to bond-servitude in the plantation colonies a legal punishment for crime. Another example of this conscious design is revealed in the Council of Trade and Plantation report to the King in 1721 saying that in South Carolina “Black slaves have lately attempted and were very nearly succeeding in a new revolution – and therefore, it may be necessary to propose some new law for encouraging the entertainment of more white servants in the future."

Worth noting is that in places like Brazil, the opposite was the case - among the poorer classes there's more unity among whites and blacks , but the further up the social ladder you go, the more segregated the society becomes.

When people say "Slavery happened so long ago get over it" , they're really ignoring how the transatlantic slave trade and the system of slavery made up the bedrock of our economic system where Rich White Men enjoy privilege - and because of that privilege, disadvantaged groups seek "whiteness" or acceptance, and become tools to implement the same divisiveness among communities - for profit.

The failure of resentful whites to recognize the con in Donald's rhetoric will hurt them because he is yet another Rich White Man who doesn't care about them and will exploit the conditions that made them resentful- indeed he will continue to feed on their resentment, their resentment gives him power.

http://www.redneckrevolt.org/single-post/2016/07/24/LOOKING-AT-THE-WHITE-WORKING-CLASS-HISTORICALLY

[nil desperandum]

6. Indeed....

Dave Chappelle's SNL piece on this very issue was funny, and bittersweet because it speaks to exactly your words.

Far too many Americans don't realize that there isn't just one America where we all experience the same things in the same way, nothing about this nation is as simple as that. Sometimes it seems the double standard is the only standard we know.

[JHan]

20. We hear any version of this:

Democrats didn't win because Democrats didn't listen to the "heartland of america" , "real america", "average americans" -

It don't matter if you're struggling , and working 2-3 jobs in NY and trying to make ends meet, and studying - you aren't really "american" . Ted Cruz and his "New York Values" and all the coded BS they get away with, a "Salt of the earth people" "real people" .. They can miss me with the BS.

[nil desperandum]

24. That language always pisses me off

"real" Americans...what does that even mean really?

Just the white christians in the rural areas? Those folks that you mention in NY with the 2-3 jobs and a college schedule know more about hard work and scratching it out to get by than anyone in the nation, and are doing so in a system not designed to really help them find a strong economic solution for their lives. They have to find that on their own, in spite of the rhetoric to the contrary.

I always found that term "Salt of the earth" interesting because if you salt the earth nothing grows, just like the attitudes and realities of many of those who consider themselves "Salt of the earth" narrow minded non-growth oriented individuals.

[pangaia]

41. When I hear that 'real Americans,' I could spit.

I am on the board of directors of our Townhouse HOA, in a small town, 20,000, about 30 minutes from a city in Up-State NY.. The town leans maybe 60-65% republican but the mayor is a democrat, etc... so it is not insane totally here... too much...

The first meeting after the election I could not attend because no way could I sit in the same room with some of them, who I am 110% sure voted for the shit face. I told the president of the board, who thinks the way I do. He said he barely got through it..

I went to the December meeting, promising to keep my trap shut. But as soon as one of them said the first word about you know what, I let that group of self-righteous fucks have it with both barrels! 12 on the board.. 5 on 'our' side, and 7 "real Americans." The room was silent...
The fat old fart in whose place the meeting was has had a trump sign in the window of his Silverado. We, and his dumb wife, haven't spoken since. :&gt )))

I was so pissed I was almost shaking.

Later, 'our' guys thanked me.

Whew!

[JHan]

73. I've read your post 5 times..

Do you remember any of what you said? Lol

And they say Dems are snowflakes!

[pangaia]

74. What did I say? My god if I could remember, I would go on tour !!

And charge it to the DNC.

I can't really do stuff like this. I can barely express my thoughts HERE on DU, as many surely know. HA !

I was in another realm of awareness and brilliance that I do not really inhabit. LOL!

A discussion of the election had started-----
I finally had enough....
These are mostly older people. I'm 73 but .. not really... ages on the board,, mostly 50-75 with a few 30 somethings...all varying shades of pasty white, me too.( God, how boring !!)
Although my second wife was Chinese. So maybe I get a couple extra points.. Of course she still IS Chinese, but we're divorced.

I picked out everything I could think of that that mentally disturbed fuck wad has said,
- his threats to everyone who disagrees with him- private citizens, media, politicians, countries, and the threats to freedom of the press and freedom of speech they represented.
- his constant lies-- and why they are lies---like HE WON the popular vote !!! Even a couple people there thought he won ! JEEZZE !!
- his misogyny -- I asked that slobbering blubbery fucker with the Silverado if he would ever announce that he liked to grab women by the pussy? ( please forgive me about the blubbery thing BUT that is what I called him to his face.)-- I asked his wife how she would feel if her husband went around grabbing hot young women by the pussy? The look on her face was priceless) OH !!!!! OH !! MY !!
- I asked if they wanted an administration full of racists and that was supported by the Klu Klux Klan. "Oh there is no more KKK?" ME, ""YOU BET YOUR WHITE ASS THERE IS A KKK, you dumb, ignorant moron" Maybe since I'm white, although I do want to point out-- Hungarian white,-- that sounded a little strange.

- "Do you all want to have your Medicare taken away and your Social Security sold to the highest bidder?" " Oh, Donald said he would protect our Medicare and social security. And since it was the republicans who started it I believe him?"
This from the nice little frail old lady with the oxygen tank."ME-- Look, lady, (I forgot her name in the heat of the moment) medicare was started by Lyndon Baines Johnson and social security was signed into law by Franklin fucking Delano Rooooosevelt, who were BOTH fucking Democrats !!! republicans have never done ANYTHING to help you.. Nothing.. EVER! She was sitting next to me. I leaned over and grabbed her oxygen leads as if to pull them out of her nose......"Look here granny, THIS is what is about to happen to you." He eyes BUGGED OUT WIDE WIDE WIDE !!!!

"trump is a narcissistic,"megalomaniac. Do you know what narcissistic means? No? well look it up. Look up brown shirts, look up Mussolini and black shirts, look up Waffen SS because that is what trump's 'personal private body guard' is.

Oh, yeah-----one of them said that... oh now trump was making friends with and easing tensions with Putin. I explained that Putin was playing trump like a wooden puppet and the russians are getting ready to invade Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania. The Finns and Swede are scared shitless. And here comes your idiot savior ready to dismember NATO..

I asked, "Do you know about the US military storage caves in Trondheim, Norway?" he said, Oh come on, how do you know about storage caves in Norway?" "Because, buster, I have BEEN to Trondheim, Norway! At the Norwegian Fucking Air Force Academy! TWICE! Where the fuck have you been? Buffalo? Do you know they serve smoked salmon at every meal in the mess?"
He didn't believe me.. Heh heh BIG mistake.. So I whipped out my Samsung S6 Galaxy 'smarter than me" super duper mobile phone, and showed him pictures of me at the Norwegian Fucking Air Force Academy. In the gym, in my room in the dorms., in the MESS putting smoked salmon on my plate, and INCLUDING, one of me and a friend, an officer, standing in front of the US made jet mounted on a stand in front of the dorms.


Anyway, that's the idea.. I ad libbed a bit here cause I don't remember it all.. but that's the jist... I went on for a bit over objections. A couple of the good guys,..gals, actually, were chuckling..

You can bet your ass I am going to hold out for new multi-toned gray shingles at the next meeting !!

Can't wait to read the minutes in my email INBOX.


Sorry if this is too long, JHAN, but you asked...

[JHan]

75. I enjoyed that! and every word you said was absolutely right.

[pangaia]

76. Great! Thanks.

it took forever.

[smirkymonkey]

78. I think it's complete bullshit and I'm white.

I don't have one shred of pity for these pathetic whiners.

[Nay]

7. It's not just you.

I'm whiter than white and I feel the exact same way.

[we can do it]

9. I fully agree.

It's bullshit.

[DK504]

39. Spot on.

This is one of the first elections I haven't had to hold my nose and vote. God Almighty, how is it we can not be a country of the best ideas rather than the circus fiasco it has all become.

[secondwind]

10. I AM WITH YOU ON THIS... 110% K&R

[ananda]

11. Totally agree.

I'm sick and tired of all emotional handwringing and badgering.

We either fight back or we don't.

So far -- we don't for the most part.

We just handwring or snipe at each other,
and talk or post a helluvalot.

The only answer is in organized action on a
consistent basis without giving up.

[Coolest Ranger]

12. Trump

actually said he was happy that a lot of our people did not go out to vote and that made me angry enough to bitch slap them to the ground

[Afromania]

13. aye

The real question is will it going to make the apathetic angry enough to vote in the midterms.

[WhiteTara]

51. It won't matter.

The pukes have gerrymandered the districts so effectively that we won't have a voice.

[JHan]

17. Yes. He's shameless with it, and he gets away with it, it's all a joke..

and he set it up months before the election by claiming that "Those people" in urban areas would try to vote 10 times. That we are electoral fraudsters when historically every effort has been made to disenfranchise us

[BumRushDaShow]

14. Exactly

See... LBJ, who once lived among them (before "marrying up&quot , famously said the following over 55 years ago, per the below article from Bill Moyers -

WHAT A REAL PRESIDENT WAS LIKE
By Bill D. Moyers November 13, 1988

WHILE Lyndon Baines Johnson was a man of time and place, he felt the bitter paradox of both. I was a young man on his staff in 1960 when he gave me a vivid account of that southern schizophrenia he understood and feared. We were in Tennessee. During the motorcade, he spotted some ugly racial epithets scrawled on signs. Late that night in the hotel, when the local dignitaries had finished the last bottles of bourbon and branch water and departed, he started talking about those signs.

"I'll tell you what's at the bottom of it," he said. "If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you."

<...>

https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/opinions/1988/11/13/what-a-real-president-was-like/d483c1be-d0da-43b7-bde6-04e10106ff6c/

[JHan]

18. Yep.

That sums up this year and it's why Trump was able to corral so many with his anti-immigration rhetoric.

It was politically problematic but Hillary pointing out that just a percentage of Trump voters were racist and misogynistic got her raked over the coals in the media as well - and she didn't say all - she said half, we can quibble about whether it's really half or a quarter. We're not allowed to point it out. Excuses are made.

Trump knows he can blatantly and shameless twist the truth to push his false narratives - he does what he does on twitter because he gets away with it.

[Paladin]

15. Very well stated.

I keep waiting for the "liberal" media to pounce on this oh-so-obvious hypocrisy, and so far...crickets.

[JHan]

19. Some have, but it's not highlighted much in Cable News Media

It's just another thing Trump gets away with among a zillion other things.

And you're right, the media isn't "liberal" , it's corporatist. And the new status quo is Trump. So Trump gets a pass.

[Lulu KC]

16. Yes!

I noticed this in the New York Times piece that has been circulating about how we all have post-election PTSD. There was no mention of generational trauma centuries long for many of our citizens, and the illustration had only pink people in it. It's an unbelievable blindness.

[JHan]

21. Ta-Nehisi Coates hit it on the nail:

Indeed, what Breitbart understood, what his spiritual heir Donald Trump has banked on, what Hillary Clinton’s recent pillorying has clarified, is that white grievance, no matter how ill-founded, can never be humiliating nor disqualifying. On the contrary, it is a right to be respected at every level of American society from the beer-hall to the penthouse to the newsroom.

[kjones]

70. It's fitting that the King of Entitlement would surf to power on those grievances...

I'm thankful that the Democratic party didn't completely succumb to our version of it,
the whole white, liberal know-it-all type of thing. Sometimes, that "grievance" comment applies
to them too...and it's sad because they talk about awareness but don't even see their
own entitlement attitude. "What? Now you care?!"
The ones who were screaming for it all to burn down were the ones that knew they could
afford it. I think there are probably a couple 'prophecies' in this group that have shown themselves
to be true in regards to all that.

[JHan]

71. I've had to bite my tongue about that..

but it's true.

For so many people I know this election was a life and death situation. A "we better not fk this up" situation. It wasn't lost on me who most of the anarchists on the left were, the ones who could risk everything blowing up. As I said in the op, *we* are used to making tough choices. If their entitlement didn't affect millions, I'd be bored of the noise.

[Martin Eden]

22. Understanding all voters and their concerns is a key to winning elections

But first and foremost we must understand what we hope to accomplish in terms of government policies, moving our country forward with economic & social justice in a more sustainable future on this environmentally vulnerable Earth we inhabit.

Understanding the deplorables does not mean we cater to their bigotry or compromise on civil rights. Some voters are irredeemable, but there is a segment who voted for Obama twice then voted for Trump or stayed home in this election. Ignoring them and their economic concerns helps the rethuglicans.

The Democratic Party needs to genuinely represent the interests of the 99% with policies not influenced by the oligarchy and we need a strong, clear, consistent message that leaves no doubt what we stand for and whose interests we serve.

There must be no double standard, and we also have to acknowledge our educational, economic, and justice systems have not been applied equally and fairly to people of color. Corrective action is required.

[JHan]

31. Thanks Martin..

I'm still very bitter.

My bitterness led me to joining this site.

yes we need to reach out but every policy on the table this year screamed that we understood. And I want to know whether we will ever hold voters accountable for their own myopia and foolishness? It can't just be up to politicians, we also have responsibilities as citizens to understand the circumstances we find ourselves in - so I find it very difficult to give them a pass or understand.

If I hear the message, if it registered with me, why not them? If you , and I and others who understand the value of political engagement understand this, on a fundamental level, why can't they?

[Martin Eden]

46. How can voters be held accountable for their own myopia and foolishness?

Elected officials can be held accountable by voting them out of office and corporations can be held accountable with boycotts of their products or service, but how are voters held accountable -- what type of action do you suggest we take against them?

Myopic and foolish voters will suffer (along with the rest of us) from the consequences of electing politicians who do not serve our interests. Along with the policy agenda and message I described in my previous post, we also need to be very clear about the consequences of bad policies and politicians.

[JHan]

52. Voters suffer the consequences through collective inaction..

which results in exactly what you describe - bad policies.

We have to be involved, we have to care enough to be involved , we have to care enough to understand policy and the power of our votes. No politician can "make us care", and we shouldn't need a politician to make us care. Part of living is caring - and we should care enough about what's happening around us to work on improving our communities.

Somehow many feel their votes don't matter and politics is bad - which means they opt out and leave a vacuum for those who do understand power to step in and control the narrative and the status quo. I've no idea how to correct this: Maybe a greater emphasis on civics in schools, but not just ordinary civics class but contextualizing civic action as means through which voters make their power play.

As for Democrats, the first thing we can do is dismantle efforts to suppress enthusiasm to vote through grassroots activism and recapturing state legislatures. We've gotten enough warnings from Republicans of their intent to suppress and disenfranchise voters- but all talk will be for naught if democrats and liberals don't show up for these elections - like we didn't show up in 2010, and 2012, and 2014 - and then complain about it*. Maybe it takes a Trump presidency to wake people out of their complacency, a complacency *they have to own* and if it doesn't, they have only themselves to blame.

[BumRushDaShow]

43. We still keep hearing the assertion about former Obama voters voting for Trump

and I have yet to see any proof of this. And repeating it verbatum appears to be deliberate because it not only fits a pervasive anti-Clinton narrative, but is done to completely marginalize the fact that this country was founded and built on the backs of marginalized people - i.e., those who were not white, land-owning straight Christian males.

If anything, you may have had former Obama voters go 3rd-party or sit home, but there was apparently an enhanced turnout of first-time or occasional voters who voted for Trump - you can see that through the tight margins in certain states that were previously not in dispute, and where statewide higher-office races actually went to Democrats, like here in PA, where the federal races with 2 women (President & Senator) went R but AG and other offices went D.

I.e., in any general contested election, there are about 40% of eligible and/or registered voters who do not vote or are kept from voting. But the potential is there for various combinations and permutations of voters out of that 40%, who finally decide to vote, trading places with some from the 60% who voted in previous elections, but sat it out this go-around.

[JHan]

44. Exactly, this was the first year without the Voting Rights Act in place..

And yet many persist ignoring how pervasive voter suppression tactics were, on top of the cross checking debacle, and the gerrymandering.

It feels like Democrats are hijacked to hold onto a specific narrative which ignores institutional failures this time around and possible malfeasance.

[BumRushDaShow]

47. I would not be surprised if some of those insisting on that narrative

were Nixon (anti-LBJ) and/or Reagan (anti-Carter) "Democrats" who tend towards a tunnel-vision worldview, fixating or latching onto single issues without evaluating the nuances and interconnections of other things on those issues. I.e., the potential disparate impact on certain groups due to the fact that we are not all on the same or on a level playing field as they believe.

In essence, they would push for self-destruction of the party to force it to go their way or no way.

[JHan]

53. Definitely.

Echos of Democrats who left the party in the 60's and 70's when brown people were filling the rank and file in greater numbers and when Democrats engaged in "Evil Identity Politics" or whatever

[Martin Eden]

49. Regarding Obama voters switching to Trump

I've heard it from multiple sources, including from the mouths of voters themselves. It may very well be the number of these voters has been deliberately overstated. My intent is not to spread what might be a false meme but rather to point out the Democratic policy agenda and message should be loud and clear, appealing to all voters whose economic and social issues will be served.

As for the rest of your post, I absolutely concur.

[BumRushDaShow]

50. "Democratic policy agenda and message should be loud and clear"

There will be no "loud and clear" until liberals/progressives/the left BUY some media, maintain it 24/7 for a significant time (preferably decades), and be willing to operate it at a financial "loss" (although it should be considered a "donation to the cause&quot . In the meantime, since we don't own it and wouldn't even support what Al Franken tried to create with Air America, then it becomes a moot point to keep excoriating the party about a lack of a "message".

The appropriate message has been crafted but there is no megaphone to spread it far and wide above the constant noise of the RW lunatics. And so the hand-wringing continues about a "message" that is there but no one hears because we tend to spend our money on actually helping others rather than being messengers and owning the transmission of it.

[AirmensMom]

23. Not just you.

I've been SMDH for a while now. It's sickening.

[eppur_se_muova]

25. It's not just you, and it's not just POC.

A certain segment of our population has been able to live in an isolated bubble which shuts out all the progress of the 20th century. They expect the world to stay in their version of "the good old days" and don't care that it wasn't good for everyone else -- in fact, they don't think the "else" count, at all. Slowly, it's getting harder and harder to maintain that bubble, but the GOP and a compliant, unquestioning media have persisted in their indulgence of this privileged population. Many of us thought that with the election of BHO it had finally popped and the USA was ready to catch up with the more progressive societies of the world. The backlash was truly a surprise for many whites; I sheepishly recognize it was apparently not such a surprise to POC. It is bitterly disappointing to realize that this "populist" (a "populism" which excludes much of the populace ??) course correction will probably not be negated until after I have reached retirement age, if then. I had hoped to see a better country within my lifetime, to overcome the wrong turn it took under Reagan, when I was just entering adult life. Then we took another wrong turn under Bush the Lesser, and that dream was postponed again. Now, it seems we have taken the ultimate wrong turn, and the imminent chaos will either destroy the country, or destroy that privileged bubble at last.

[JHan]

28. well said...

the appeal to nostalgia was strong. All the Candidates indulged in it a bit but not in the way Trump did: "We want our country back" "make america great again" - the most toxic slogans for a campaign ever conceived in living memory.

I realised how sickeningly effective it was when one of Trump's surrogates - a Latino dude - said "we're (latinos) are taking over and it has to stop, soon there will be taco trucks on every corner" -*Blink*

Trump has managed to tap into every fear imaginable , even fear among some non-white groups of never being "accepted". America consists of many Americas and what better way to attack this by targeting multiculturalism as the source of our problems: And Bannon's American Nationalism fits so well - which leaves the question: who gets to decide what American Identity should be? This is like the last clarion call for sicko conservatives who are still angry about the culture wars.

[eppur_se_muova]

30. It's a very peculiar nostalgia ...

[TonyPDX]

38. It's okay with me if they take it. The sooner, the better.

[JHan]

45. Yep. But they can't stop demographic shift. It's going to happen when they like it or not.

[Maven]

57. This should be its own OP.

Brilliantly stated.

[Wounded Bear]

27. It may feel like it, but you are not alone....

It's pretty disgusting, actually.

[Mike Nelson]

29. Not just you...

... great question you raise, "...how Trump gets away with having a white nationalist as his top adviser while Obama was excoriated for his friendship with jeremiah wright." All the media wants to know is "What was wrong with Hillary's message?" (inclusion, which won) and all praise Trump's message (bigotry).

[Mike Niendorff]

32. Exactly This.

Staggering double-standard.


MDN

[radical noodle]

33. With you 100%

[iluvtennis]

37. You're right.., great point nt

[barbtries]

40. it sure does.

very republican.

[Starry Messenger]

48. I'm with you.

I'll resist any effort to try to reorient our politics to coddle white fragility. (I'm white.) In my world, my allies are the smart ones who will do anything to save their own ass and the asses of all the people around them and don't play Russian Roulette with life-changing elections.

I also vote for people I can't stand, just to keep the GOP at bay. I don't understand snowflakes who require something aspirational in order to vote. I can count on one hand the amount of people and measures I've voted for with actual joy.

I am very bitter about the sad white people genre in the narrative this month. I don't vote for Trump and I've never made more than $30k, and my health care is Obamacare. My retirement plan is SS. As far as I can tell, selfish older white people just got their final revenge on the rest of us. I can't feel sorry for any suffering coming their way too.

[JHan]

66. The Social Safety Net is our upcoming battle..

And where Dems must be unwavering

"I also vote for people I can't stand, just to keep the GOP at bay. I don't understand snowflakes who require something aspirational in order to vote. " - neither do I- policies and ideas excite me,

many of my peers ( millennials) want to be inspired but for me , personally, I know inspiration can be an act - I can distinguish political performance from the individual , talk vis a vis action.

Even though there are particular and unique struggles among groups, ensuring everyone gets a fair share helps lift everyone. Trump played the old divide and rule game, and yet Democrats get criticized for the divisiveness of "identity politics" - which is why moving forward we need to hold on to the things we got right and not feed ourselves on false narratives that only hurt our agenda.

[Warpy]

54. I think some of them have got to be very young

I know I've had to hold my nose and vote for the lesser of two weasels all my life and I've had to see the ones who actually managed to get into office persecuted across the board because they were Democrats and the party of The Big Grudge was still in a colossal snit over what happened to their boy Nixon.

[rivegauche]

55. White angst? What about white rage.

I'm a white woman who is so fucking angry and I don't know what do with with this rage.

I HATE that a despicable racist misogynist was elected (by fraud).
I HATE that all the sub-human racist scum are gloating and emboldened by the "win".
I HATE that we are losing the best POTUS and FLOTUS we've ever had in 240 years.
I HATE that their legacies are going to be destroyed by scum not worthy to shine their shoes.
I HATE that women's rights and voting rights are going to be trampled and laughed about as irrelevant.
I HATE every goddamned thing about that orange trainwreck and his entire criminal, scumbag family. And I hope someone kills him. I fucking do.

I'm a white woman and I stand with every single person of color, Jew, Muslim, decent American who is against Trump. The country I used to think was a decent, if flawed, work in progress has turned into Germany 1933. That is not acceptable to me and it NEVER WILL BE.

[handmade34]

59. "I don't know what do with with this rage"

anger is all I've got right now... I hate to hate, but right now I am filled with it towards people who will dismiss or destroy everything I love about this Country

[rivegauche]

60. I hope we are not alone.

Sometimes it feels like it, I have to say. People deciding it's too much to fight and resist and just lying down while the Panzers roll in. I'm exhausted as it is, but this has got to be fought against.

[JHan]

64. I think a Trump presidency will crystallize priorities for many, but the price to pay is still high.

And the pain accompanying this awareness will hit the most vulnerable hard which was completely unecessary. Gingrich spoke recently about undoing all of FDR's policies, they are talking as if they won this election in a landslide - which will be their undoing.

[coco22]

58. kicked&recommended..

[TygrBright]

61. eeeee-YUP. Had someone tell me sincerely that "we could win again" if...

...we'd just go back to our "core constituency" of working/middle class union people.

uh-huh.

The Union guys who did their damndest to pull the ladder up behind them in the '50s, '60s, '70s?

The working/middle class dudes who came up with so MANY creative ways to keep PoC away from "their" jobs and "their" schools and "their" neighborhoods?

THAT "core constituency?"

I'm a life-long straight-party-ticket Democrat but I have zero illusions about what that means in terms of our Party's ability to honestly and wholeheartedly pitch the big tent that is truly needed in this country.

Sometimes I think demographics and time for them to work are our only real hope.

sadly,
Bright

[asuhornets]

62. THANK YOU!!!! nt

[mountain grammy]

63. It's not just you, it does stink.

[rogue emissary]

67. K & R!

[Missn-Hitch]

68. It is not just you.

[lordsummerisle]

72. K&R n/t

[BlancheSplanchnik]

77. Not just you.

The media is corporate propaganda. And I mean corporate in all senses, including the commoditized govt. (mostly pukes fit in that category = bought and paid for)

But other than knowing that, I don't know anything else.
I've never not known anything as badly as I don't know anything now.

[liberalmuse]

80. I have zero sympathy for these people.

And I don't want to see another damn fluff piece on these ignoramuses.

I've been pretty damn poor, but my mom raised me to not be a racist piece of shit who blames others for my problems. Fuck white angst. Minorities in this country have been through hell and back and these pathetic whiners are upset because they don't get everything handed to them. You know, because they are melanin-deficient.

I've worked with these people. So many of them are duplicitous and want everyone to think they are good people, but they make racist jokes and say ugly things about hispanics and other minorities. They whisper about other coworkers and will stab you in the back to get ahead. They whine about people on benefits but are the first in line when they need them.

Just fuck these people. Yes, I'm in an ugly mood today as our democracy just got handed to a cabal of traitorous bastards.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

81. The ones that really irritate me are the ones who use the term "working class" as a slam.

[brewens]

82. Black people get the same treatment the Republicans gave the religious right for years.

I remember Gary Bauer on with Bob Novak back after Newt and his gang took over the House. Bob was like telling him, just settle down Gary, let us get some more tax cuts and a Republican President elected, then maybe we'll get to your agenda. Kind of like, thanks for the votes sucker!

Trump really exposes that racism is alive and well. I had a 26 year old woman use the term "Jigaboo" in front of me at work a couple of months ago. Not just once but three times! Previously she had read aloud something off her phone about Obama being a Kenyan. Plus both were in front of our crew "lead" (lowest level boss). This 56 year old white dude wrote both of them up for it. I let it sit for a week or so first to make sure our so-called "lead" couldn't claim she was going to bring it to our supervisor. When I took it to my supervisor, I made it clear she shouldn't have been hearing it from me, our "lead" should have busted her. Both of them are Trump loving half-wit racists as far as I'm concerned.

Jigaboo? Jesus! What does she have like some 90 year old ex Grand Dragon great uncle or something like that? Even though we both live in Idaho, I had completely forgotten about that one! I probably hadn't hear that since the 70's.

[JHan]

85. I've seen racist Alt-Right memes with some antiquated racist slurs..

even "jigaboo" really doesn't surprise me. #MakeAmericaGreatAgain = #MakeAmerica1925Again

[gwheezie]

83. They don't want to change

Someone is trying to make them change & they don't like it. The someone is all the people they hate. If you try to talk about anything with them that is factual & indisputable it is somehow an attack on them personally.
I got into an argument with one of them about racism and tried to calmly discuss why a white person no matter what their circumstance can make a giant leap towards eliminating racism by simply acknowledging if a black person says something is racist go ahead & make that shift in your thinking it is tscist rather than try to defend you personally are not a racist.
I tried to point out that as a white person if Everytime racism is discussed you take the position of denying it by bringing up your own hardships it makes you sound like a racist. It's like saying racism doesn't exist because you can't get a job or couldn't buy a house. They don't even know they do this.
The phrase black lives matter drives them crazy. But I keep slogging away at them. I would prefer to ignore them but I'm white and white folks are the problem.

[raven mad]

84. LOL! I'm sitting here at 18 below wondering where I'm going to be able to find the bucks for heat.

My neighbors are black, white, Alaska Native, a couple of neat guys from Singapore, and a really cool Jamaican dude who plays the best music, good and loud.

That's my worry. My neighbors and I band together and get a fuel truck in occasionally.

[Garrett78]

87. Especially when you consider that nothing Jeremiah Wright said was all that outlandish.

A white backlash has been building for 8 years. That so many on DU can't grasp that is highly disappointing.

I started a thread that I think has a very obvious answer: http://www.democraticunderground.com/12512665585

[JHan]

88. G is a winner there, every time....

For his most passionate supporters.

[Garrett78]

89. Most would overlook A-F or blame Democrats.

As I wrote elsewhere, Trump won't lose support even if he doesn't bring jobs back from overseas, even if he continues to align himself with Wall Street and establishment types (which everyone with a working brain knew he was going to do), even if he leads an effort to privatize Social Security and Medicare, and even if he takes away Medicaid from a lot of people. His supporters, for the most part, will either blame Democrats or just ignore those things. Same with not destroying ISIS, not withdrawing from the Iran nuclear deal, not withdrawing from the Paris Agreement, etc.

The one deal-breaker would be if he made a reversal on civil rights (support of Black Lives Matter, support of LGBTQ rights, kicking out the likes of Bannon, etc.). That's the one thing Trump (and Republicans as a whole) simply cannot afford to do and won't do, because the Republican Party would collapse. Bigotry, particularly racism, is the tie that binds.

That there are so many Democrats who don't recognize that reality is heartbreaking.