The far left is still out of touch with black voters.

[pnwmom]

***Posted to the African American group***

https://theestablishment.co/the-far-left-is-still-out-of-touch-with-black-voters-90194cfddba6

Black people can see this, they aren’t stupid. They see that the political fringe on the left and most of the right hates Obama for some of the same reasons. So when the far left comes out and says that the first Black President should be held to a different standard than Presidents before him — that he doesn’t deserve to get paid for his post-Presidential work or shouldn’t be compensated — the Black community feels that one of its largest symbols of success is under attack from an overwhelmingly white political movement.

Why does the far left believe the first Black president should be held to a standard of making less money? Why does the far left believe that the first Black president doesn’t deserve to be compensated for his work? These are the issues that resonate with the black community.

The rebuttal will be, well, the money is corporate, the money is from Wall Street. Well, nobody in the far left was coming for Sanders when he invested his money on Wall Street. Nobody on the far left was coming for The Young Turks when they took $4 million from Republicans. There are a plethora of organizations and publications on the far left that take big money from corporate donors, Republicans, and Wall Street investment bankers. But they are not viciously attacked for making money or taking in millions in donations. Why do they hold the first Black President to a standard they don’t hold themselves to? They haven’t just come for Obama either. They’ve heavily criticized activist DeRay and the Black women behind Safety Pin Box for making money for their work, accusing them of being beholden to corporate interests.

When Obama, DeRay, or Safety Pin Box is making money, all of a sudden the far left has a problem with it. But when their own organizations and publications are taking Wall Street or corporate donations, there is no anger, no criticism, no vitriol.

SNIP

[David__77]

1. Generalizations.

African American people are integral participants in leftist political organizations. This "far left" stuff sounds McCarthyite to me.

[bettyellen]

9. Mc Carthyite? Well we are talking about people demonizing capitalism in ALL it's forms...

It's a fringe group. Some hope for total destruction of our government, so yeah.... fuck that.

[David__77]

10. Which groups and people are these?

Groups that identify the US an a colonialist entity? The Communist Party USA, which endorsed Hillary Clinton for president? Just curious.

[JI7]

11. ones who claim no difference if trump or hillary is president or that trump would be better

[David__77]

14. I suppose there are some of those.

I doubt most Communists in the US fall into that category. I doubt most socialists in the US fall into that category. There are some groups that abstain from electoral politics for which this might apply.

[JI7]

16. The ones I'm talking about are not concerned with actual socialism and equality

[emulatorloo]

21. The groups you mention aren't binary-thinking ideologues.

By the way pretty much everyone on DU is on the left.

I don't like the term "far left" because I don't think it is a good term to describe these ideologues.

[Eliot Rosewater]

61. Exactly, because I can assure you I am far left, much further left than almost ANYONE here

and those who are referred to as "far left" are nothing like me.

[bettyellen]

12. Idiots like Susan Sarandon, Glen Greenwald and fringe lefties - fake ones that

Worked for RT and Sputnik last year and pretended to like liberal policies but in reality actually have to go back 40-50 years to name a Dem president they like. Fake ass liberals who flooded FB and Twitter for the past two years with phony hyped up scandals fed to them by Julian Assange and the GOP. They don't have their own group because then they'd be obvious. They pretend to be supporters of x y and z to spread their poison. Now they want Dems to hate on Obama. Idiots.

[David__77]

19. Jane Fonda too?

Sounds like a Hollywood thing and not a broader political phenomenon.

[bettyellen]

20. Did you miss the names of journalists and pundits for some reason?

Haven't heard a peep from Fonda in years- have YOU? Or are you just yanking my chain? Because none of what I referenced happened in Hollywood- and you already know that.

[David__77]

23. I'm not familiar with Greenwald.

Honestly. And I mentioned Fonda because she is someone who certainly opposed capitalism. I don't know what her position was on the last election.

[pnwmom]

24. Greenwald is a major figure for you not to be aware of. Interesting.

Does that mean you don't know who Edward Snowden is, either?

Or Jill Stein?

[David__77]

25. I have heard of them.

...

[pnwmom]

28. You're not from the US then, right? n/t

[David__77]

30. I'm from the US.

I've been posting on this board since 2001. That said, not so much in recent years. Some areas are more of interest to me than others. I'm sure there are a lot of people in this country who have not heard of Glenn Greenwald.

[pnwmom]

32. You didn't know about Greenwald and you seem vague about Snowden and Stein.

Posting here since 2001 doesn't mean much.

[David__77]

34. Ok.

...

[bettyellen]

35. I think a lot of people repeated the crap he wrote vaguely "knowing" it was being shared

By "lefties" when he was actually as anti Dem - and pro-Russia as you can get. And russia had, of course, nothing to do with red baiting or socialism.... although I'm not sure everyone knows that either.

[David__77]

36. I think there's definitely an "anti-US" faction.

A group that opposes NATO and Israel and almost reflexively supports whatever the US says it's against. I don't necessarily equate that with leftism. Russia is headed by a quite conservative government.

[bettyellen]

37. I think what we saw was a loose group of people - many who were nothing more than HRC haters....

look around for others to give them reasons or a focus for it that wasn't obviously coming from the GOP. But guess what- the bulk of it started with the GOP, and it looked palatable because it was Greenwald and Assange. Now we see the connections even clearer.

[bettyellen]

26. Why would you bring up Fonda's ancient activism now, LOL?

[David__77]

29. It was misplaced.

...

[brush]

57. Pls, quit while you're behind.

[emulatorloo]

22. So silly!

Thanks for the laugh 😂

[RandySF]

39. Jane Fonda supported Hillary.

[LanternWaste]

65. After this, therefore because of this?

"Sounds like a Hollywood thing and not a broader political phenomenon..."

After this, therefore because of this? Sounds like a logical fallacy (post hoc ergo prompter hoc) and a broader or even valid point.

[JustAnotherGen]

48. One individual

I've encountered at DU seems upset the Obamas got a $65 million dollar book advance on top of the $400K.

Instead of loving the big fuck you that is to the Trumpettes - upset Obama made a buck as a private citizen.

It's starting to look like jealousy.

[JHan]

2. oh the ID politics spiel told us all we needed to know.

the absurd economic vs social false dichotomy also tells us all we need to know.

[Sculpin Beauregard]

3. The far left are more similar to the far right than they are to the vast majority of Dems.

Extremism is extremism, no matter who's flying its flag.

They are not the majority.

[Zen Democrat]

64. Except if you look at the polls of where Americans stand on the issues ....

The population supports the issues championed by the Left. Including Far Left. People want free tuition for state colleges. People want Medicare for All. People want clean water and air, and for action to be taken to combat extreme climate change. The overall population supports a $15 minimum wage. The same people often vote Republican because they are ignoramuses (ignorami?).

Bernie and Liz are waking people up!

[Boxerfan]

4. MMMMMM-divisive issue for no real reason....

Other than to be divisive...

Live it up to your own examples or try to at least post your own thoughts-not cut & paste for your amusement when an argument occurs.

[bettyellen]

7. People post articles all the time here.... get over it.

[pnwmom]

8. Attacking Obama for something all the modern Presidents have done is certainly divisive. n/t

[emulatorloo]

17. Posting news stories and editorials is what fuels DU n/t

[LanternWaste]

66. That's quite the creative and unsupported allegation.

"for no real reason Other than to be divisive... "

That's quite the creative and unsupported allegation. You'll of course, provide us with support for your little accusation, yes?

[bettyellen]

5. And they love worship $FDR$ without a smidge of thought.

Some people deserve their money, it seems.

[pnwmom]

13. He inherited his fortune so of course that's more deserving than someone who has to work for it.

[bettyellen]

18. I've started to think that hard work means nothing to some people....

All the demonization of people and organizations that have been fighting for us for decades... it's easy for some. Give me people with experience and a real work history, not some fly by night person who is "suddenly inspired" to primary someone or flips parties and wants to advise them (some ex GOP pundit on Twitter- trashing BO of course). I'm done with this outsiders are better crap. Half of them were half baked opportunists. Fuck that. I want people with bonafides to lead.

[fleabiscuit]

45. +1 And the bonafides should add up to something fairly significant before elected POTUS.

[bettyellen]

46. Yes! When I hear people float names like Zuckerberg or Cuban for fucks sake...

I'm deeply disturbed by people perpetuating this "they're all the same/ corrupt" crap. That's what got us where we are.

[delisen]

77. So true. Inherited wealth is often worshipped on the far left

film/rock star wealth is acceptable but wealth building by others is is treated like an unfair windfall.

Not all money is equal.

[Zen Democrat]

33. FDR in many ways WAS an extremist - because extreme measures were required in 1933.

FDR selected a Socialist as his vice president. He wanted to keep Henry Wallace on the ticket in 1944, but was too weak to fight the capitalists who knew FDR was dying and maneuvered a naive Harry Truman into position. Truman became president and used nuclear weapons. FDR never would have. Truman created the FBI. FDR never would have. The military-industrial complex thereafter guided Harry straight into the Cold War. Nobody in the modern era can be as bold as FDR until there's no longer a ruling military-industrial complex.

[LanternWaste]

67. That's a great example of the fractious thinking I simply cannot wrap my brain around.

That's a great example of the fractious thinking I simply cannot wrap my brain around.

The criticisms of Obama's speech and his recompense seem to be nothing more than holding two different standards to the same like action, the critical difference being.... male? Nope. President? Nope. Democrat? Nope.

Hmmm.... what could that critical difference be, I do wonder.

[JI7]

6. yup. another example is michael moore

Did he put a limit to how much he would profit ?

[pnwmom]

15. A few years ago in his divorce proceeding his wealth came out -- more than $50 million then.

It would probably be even more now, if he hadn't had to fork some over to the ex.

[Zen Democrat]

27. I'm a leftie, and confused over the criticism of Obama being well-paid for speeches.

Who gives a better speech than Barack Obama? I mean, in the whole world! These big-orgs pay that kind of money for celebrities and politicians to speak at their seminars and conferences in order to attract the cashbags to their conferences, seminars, etc. Obama has earned the right to charge whatever amount he chooses for people to hear his wise words - and be in the same room with him - and maybe shake his hand.

I don't have a clue about the criticism. It's totally out of line.

[pnwmom]

31. Exactly. In a world where Hilary Duff can command $500 K for a speech,

this furor over Obama's $400k is nuts.

[mdbl]

52. thanks, I was beginning to worry about what a leftie is

the post said "far left". Who is the far left? People who like clean air and water? People who don't like being sold out? I don't care how much money Obama makes as long as he doesn't use it to hurt others. Easy enough?

[RandySF]

38. Bernie is the only figure on the left I've seen criticize Obama for this.

The rest have been on the right and their apologists in the beltway press.

[JI7]

41. elizabeth warren has also and the usual young turks and similar types

[Eliot Rosewater]

62. MAkes sense given I believe Bernie has an agenda that if known would shock the hell

out of most here.

[WellDarn]

42. I see no reason to criticise Obama

He is not running for office, either officially or unofficially. He is making his speech in public where all can see what he says, not at some private soiree with nary a transcript on sight. When he sits down after speaking every American will know that he stood for them AND HOW.

He is, DOING DEMOCRAT RIGHT.

The greatest of all time.

[kimbutgar]

43. Another divide and conquer post

Really, we need to be united during these times? As a black person I see the threat chump is posing and the increased racism. Really??? Do we need this now?

[pnwmom]

44. Don't you think criticizing Obama needlessly is divide and conquer? n/t

[JustAnotherGen]

49. Yep and I it's not divide and conquer

How does this article divide?

All of the pleas to go get Trump voters.

Can we not have any articles, ideas, thoughts that might speak to some black Americans?

[JI7]

47. So Trump Voters who voted for an openly racist , bigoted piece of shit are not Racists

but obama getting paid for a speech IS giving in to wallstreet even though he didn't as president and he will not run in the future ?


the contrast is amazing in how they excuse certain people for certain things and accuse certain people for certain things even though they excuse the one with evidence and accuse hte one without.

[JustAnotherGen]

50. Yep

That's it in a nutshell.

To me - Trump voters should be manipulated - not embraced.

[Quayblue]

68. My thoughts as well nt

[Number23]

70. + a billion

[lunasun]

78. +1 So you noticed that ?

[JustAnotherGen]

51. This right here

In late 2016, nearly 9 out of 10 Black voters approved of President Obama. To many Black voters, he is the symbol of success for Black America. You might not agree with everything he has done, and I certainly haven’t agreed with everything, but you have to respect him for what he means to Black Americans — making it to the height of American politics and withstanding eight years of racist attacks. Sanders and his movement see Obama as symbolic of evil neoliberal corporate interests. Therein lies the disconnect. The far right holds disdain for Obama for some of the same reasons that the far left does: They see him as beholden to special interests instead of “those of the people.”

I can't wrap my head around their inability to see this.

There have been 43 white guys they can be angry about - don't attack the black guy. You will alienate us.

And - Trump voters hate us. They do.

Ain't no takesy backsey on that.

So they can go beg and plead them to get smart about their checking accounts all they want.

Just don't think they can come here and ask me to do it. Why should I? I've always dismissed bigots.

I'm not changing for them. Fuck That Shit.

[pnwmom]

53. He not only withstood those attacks, he withstood them with GRACE

and he got stuff DONE.

People forget so quickly how dire things were when Obama took office -- we were staring into the jaws of another Depression. And we were still stuck in Iraq and Afghanistan. Obama extricated us from the financial crisis and the wars, and still managed to get a major health care bill passed, the Lily Ledbetter bill, and others.

He didn't just withstand attacks. History will remember him as one of the great Presidents. That's why the Rethugs hate him. He was so effective.

[brush]

58. Well said. I especially like: "Ain't no takesy backsey on that."

[Eliot Rosewater]

63. OMG do they hate you, and even me for not hating you.

[IndianaDave]

54. I'm pretty damned far left --

and I'm baffled why anyone would care if President Obama makes some money in a perfectly legitimate way. He served our country with immense competence, enormous grace and profound dignity. As an older White guy, I wish him every success. He deserves every dollar he can earn, and he absolutely has every right to pursue the American dream for his future and the benefit of his family. He is no corporate shill. He is a true scholar and one of the very best Presidents our country has ever had. Give him the respect and honor that he deserves. Let's get beyond the idiotic negativity.

[pnwmom]

55. +1000. nt

[brush]

59. YES!

[lapucelle]

56. Trump is in the White House

because of double standards and "troubling optics".

We need to call this out , and shut this down.

[Gothmog]

60. The far left is also out of touch with other groups in the base

Jewish voters are also not comfortable with some of the positions of the far left. Clinton won the Jewish voter by a good margin

[Number23]

69. The far left and the far right are cut from the same cloth. They both hate any improvements to

any group of which they are not members. They perceive that they have lost too many privileges in the effort to improve the lives of many others, many of whom so happen to have melanin. White conservatives love to scream about welfare and affirmative action for exactly the same reason that white "lefties" love to scream about globalization.

Too many on both sides want us all to go back to the time when white men could have a fifth grade education but still have a home, a car and food on the table every night, most likely because people far smarter and more qualified than them were automatically shut out of opportunities just for being the wrong color or gender or at the expense of people who had the misfortune of being born not only the wrong color, but in the wrong country.

[JustAnotherGen]

71. Boom!

There it is!

While the rest of us were told we would have to work twice as hard to get 1/2 as far - the expectations of those groups remained the same.

Now they can't find their cheese and are pissed off about it.

[bettyellen]

72. Ah the globalization canard, yes! I've been reading a Reddit group called NeoLiberals and it's

Hilarious. They fundraise for the global poor and talk smack about the dumbing down of the electorate and how it's effected both extremes w their magical policy promises. They cycle through periods where they shit post goofy stuff and try to raise awareness and expand, then they get down to it and host thoughtful discussions about policy, and their numbers shrink a bit. Then they repeat the cycle. I think that's labeled on their preferred model of economic growth but I'm just learning. It's funny to just slap the label on myself. Fuck it.

[YoungDemCA]

73. I want to be in a time in which *everyone* - regardless of race, gender, education, or anything else

can have a home and food on the table every night, and don't have to live in fear or want, at the very least.

I don't think the far left and the far right are equivalent (the latter have a lot more power, for one thing). Though I do agree with you that there's too often overlap.

[Number23]

75. I may have spoken a bit harshly but it is hard not to see the similarities between the two groups

I do believe that the far left is a lot less odious than the far right and are much more concerned with others than those on the right, but I'd be lying through my teeth that when I hear the endless carping about moderates and the "let everything burn so that we can start all over again" crap from the lefties, that I think it's easier for them to say that as they have not been shut out of the political and economic systems for 200+ years.

To me, when they start making that asinine, dangerous argument, it's clear that their capacity for concern is not that much greater than their counterparts on the right.

[heaven05]

74. the truth of the matter is:

President Obama was held to a stricter standard of judgement than any POTUS ever and definitely stricter than even this POS called king dung we have today, as a potus....it was seen in king dungs acceptance by the MSM and 60 million white supremacists/racists as 'savior' of white ameriKKKa vs "where's your birth certificate n*****".....

One hill to climb for the Caucasian male, usually...two hills to climb and more usually for the AA to reach the same goal and in ameriKKKa, it has been this way ALWAYS .....go President Obama!!!! Best POTUS we've had since forever.....
betcha he doesn't give a fuck what his naysayers are spouting from their obsessively racist minds through their shit filled pieholes and lives.......

[sharedvalues]

76. Dems are a bunch of different groups. The right is unified behind tax cuts for the rich.

Democrats are in touch with black voters. (and realistically so is Bernie. Bernie's economic issues are key issues for african americans).

[Voltaire2]

79. The attack's complaint that Obama was held to a

different standard is patent bullshit.

If you will recall Sanders made the same criticism of Clinton. Yes she was not an ex president but that is not really relevant.

The unseemlyness of huge speaking fees from dubious sources and criticism of it goes back at least as far as Reagan, and I'm pretty sure he was not african American.