Question related to use of the terms "squaw" and "pale face":
Last edited Mon Sep 16, 2013, 11:59 AM - Edit history (1)
I was just on a jury for an alert on this reply in a thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023675850#post13
I'm really interested in different cultures and I know that a compliment in one can be an insult in another, so I voted not to hide the reply but now I'm curious. Does anyone have experience with usage of these terms and an opinion of whether or not they are used innocently, as insults, or other opinions?
I was born in parts of the country near Tuscarora and I travel extensively, and I'm always charmed by people I meet, including this summer some members of the Jemez Pueblo near Albuquerque on my way to Farmington, with a stop in Chaco Canyon (how about that?).
My question is this: Your reply was alerted upon for your use of the term "squaw" and one of the jurors found your use of the term "pale face" to be offensive, too.
I'm of a different, more tolerant mind, and willing to imagine that different cultures have different standards, and that we need to be respectful and give the benefit of the doubt.
It's quite possible that "squaw" is, in your circles, not an insult and might even be a term of endearment.
It's also possible that "pale face" is so commonly used that it doesn't offend anyone in your circles, including caucasians.
If you have time, please discuss use of these words with me, feel free to send a PM if you like, or even post in our Native American forum, here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=forum&id=1191
Thanks in advance.
ON EDIT: I found a discussion about the word "squaw" at another site: http://www.nativeweb.org/pages/legal/squaw.html
I'm not surprised that some seem to want to reclaim the word in it's original context and not let the people who came here tell them what is and is not acceptable when speaking amongst themselves.
But I'm not certain of any of this.
Curiously,
NYC_SKP
= new reply since forum marked as read
...if it's a native term the had absolutely no negative connotation.
And then Europeans came, took over, misused that word and others in ways that changed it's common usage and tone (no thanks to the originators of the word).
And then, to add insult to injury, the same culture that displaced these people decide that it's not an acceptable term.
That act, or series of acts, if accurate, would be the most offensive thing.
I go to Hawaii for work every year, Molokai this past May and Oahu in November, and have several friends including native Hawaiians.
My personal experience agrees with the Wikipedia entry, that it can be used as a racial eptithet but also finds usage in casual and friendly ways.
In some searching of the word "squaw" I learned that there have been efforts, some successful, to rename places in response to complaints about the word.
http://tucsoncitizen.com/morgue2/2003/05/07/125330-napolitano-won-t-rush-to-rename-sites-with-squaw-names/
I think that's probably a sad thing, but I'm still not sure.
Thanks for the reply!
Since it came from that other thread.
I am saddened that people don't think things through with more sensitivity and reason.
i personally don't use the term "squaw". it does seem derogatory. and i only rarely use "paleface" with close friends who i can joke around with. Insteads of "paleface" i call them "boat people". 
again, just between friends...
And "boat people" is hilarious!
We need to lighten up when we can, IMO.
A long time ago in the early 1900s after the Cherokee and the Choctaw had been removed from Arkansas to Oklahoma (yes, another removal), there were two young Indian women on the reservation in Oklahoma. They were on their own; ages 12 and 15.
Along came two brothers, two white men looking for some "action" so to speak.
So, they spied the two young Indian women and one brother said to the other, "Ah look, two squaws, one for me and one for you!".
So they took these two "squaws" and took them into what is known as concubine. They lived with these men bearing no children ( 
as to why ...) and eventually managed to escape these horrible men that raped and beat them for many years until they manged to finally escape. One ended up in Texas; the other in Nevada .
This is a true story, I'm sad to say this really; relatives in fact. Now how sad is this? It sets the stage for a myriad of horrible dysfunctionalism ranging from violence and physical abuse to severe and deadly drug/alcohol problems.
As for the term squaw, where I live, the local indigenous people had an area where they live that was named "Squaw Valley" by the white man that came here.
Squaw = to the word vagina in these parts or in other words that aren't so blunt, a slave-girl for sexual service.
Because this horrific offense was brought to light and made an issue by the tribal chairwoman for the region where the tribe originally lived, she was able to get that name changed to something else. This happened about 10+ years ago I'd say.
However, I never knew it had actually been "changed" until one day about 10+ years ago I received a letter from my mother.
In that letter contained the newspaper article about the change of the name from Squaw Valley to what it is now.
My mother was at this time about 75 years old and sent this to me immediately for the woman I mention above, the older of the two sisters was indeed her foster mother.
She was really glad to know the name had been changed needless to say for it was she that witnessed this whole tragic thing at a different time in different places.
As for my late father, it was he who knew the old story of the abduction from the reservation in Oklahoma. Seems he was quite drunk one night with the old codger that did this and he bragged to my father about it and my father was disgusted as well. He was the one that told me about it, not my mother (who I'm sure knew).
It is so very sad the way Indian women have been treated in America -- an absolute disgrace. 
She knew about this too and I was telling her about the way they got the name changed. I did not know that they had this same name being used within the Navajo Nation, I thought she had perhaps heard something about it.
I was telling her about the situation here where we live and about the tribal chairwoman here taking the responsibility to have this changed.
It is a different place, not located in Arizona.
I suppose this gives credence to the fact that using the term "squaw" is indeed an inflammatory term.
What goes on with the Navajo Nation holds true for the part of California where this former "Squaw Valley" is located.
Thanks for letting me know about this. I'll mention it to my friend the next time I talk to her. She is an elder (78 years old and was born and raised on the reservation in Arizona and her mother and family were relocated to San Francisco in the 1950s when they were moving Indian people around as to properly "assimilate" them into Western culture .... 
).
Sad at best.