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De Leonist

(225 posts)
Thu Jun 12, 2014, 11:24 AM Jun 2014

I'm sorry but...

I've got to get this off my chest. I've been doing traditional crafts as a hobby off and on for about 14 years now. My personal focus is on Pre-Christian Northern European Themes and symbols. Usually Scandanavian and Germanic along with some Celtic. However in my time more than once I've been accused of misappropriating what can be sacred Native American symbols or garments. Sometimes by other white folks who are well-meaning. Others time by Native American Artisans. Both of whom seemed to not realize that White People have an ancestral heritage that consists of more than just Genocide, Colonialism, and Racism. Please excuse me if this seems reactionary on my part. As someone absolutely in love with my own Cultural, Familial, and Ancestral Legacies I do understand that Native Americans have seen a great deal of exploitation and misuse of their own traditions and cultures. So as a general rule I try not to get upset when people misinterpret my reasons for doing this sort of hobby.

However I've gotten this more times than I wish think about. In fact this happened to me recently. I was looking for some elk or whitetail antlers that I could use on a project that was inspired by the Depictions of the man on the Gundestrup Cauldron who has Antlers on his head. Probably some form of headdress. Here's a link to the wiki article on it http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gundestrup_Cauldron.

Now it is of Gaulish and Thracian origin. But depictions of male figures with Antlers are not unknown in Northern and Western Europe. Now some of you make ask why I was looking for Elk or Whitetail Antlers. Because they are far easier to get hold of than the various types of antlers on from their European Cousins for me. Anyway long story short one of the Hunters I occasionally get my animal parts from gave me the number of a local Native Gentlemen who apparently has the same hobby. I called him and after a few minutes of introductions and other niceties when I asked if he had any spare antlers he was willing to part with and if he did how much he might ask for them. He than asked what was my intent with them. I told him about my intentions to make an antler headdress.

I than received a lecture on how I need to stop misappropriating Native Culture and get a life. Than before I could explain the origin of my idea he hung up on me. I'm tired of this happening and I'm tired of what in my experience is a often kneejerk assumption. I am not some Kevin Costner Dances with Wolves wannabe. But I am an American of Northern and Western European Descent who has a strong passion for the more hands on side of history of his own ancestral origins. Nor am I only White person in this hobby who has this problem. We are not trying to misappropriate anyone's culture or traditions but rather learn about our own with what resources we have available to us.

Please understand I am not here to troll or start a fight. Nor to deny that Native Americans have every right and need to protect and preserve their heritage. But to say to the Native Artisans on here that though I and others like me might use similar materials in the things we make we are not trying to misappropriate anything. It's just that getting the animal bits we need to be completely Authentic is not always possible for us. Either because of geographical Location or because of money. Don't get me wrong if I can I will but it's just not always possible.

Again my apologies, it's just that I'm tired of having and seeing an accusation like this thrown at me and other white people who share this hobby when quite frankly it's not true and seems to come out of a kneejerk assumption. Again however I don't deny that it does originate out of legitimate need to protect and preserve what has survived the centuries of constant physical, cultural, and economic assault that Native Americans have had to endure. But I love what I do and just wish some Native Artisans did not jump to conclusions like this.

8 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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I'm sorry but... (Original Post) De Leonist Jun 2014 OP
It's too bad he just hung up on you Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jun 2014 #1
I recognize that De Leonist Jun 2014 #2
make 'em read Manly P. Hall MisterP Jun 2014 #3
You are a rarity Al Carroll Jun 2014 #4
look for copies of hopemountain Jul 2014 #5
It is art. littlemissmartypants Aug 2014 #6
I don't sell my stuff De Leonist Aug 2014 #7
Nobody has a monopoly on art Major Nikon Nov 2014 #8

Erich Bloodaxe BSN

(14,733 posts)
1. It's too bad he just hung up on you
Thu Jun 12, 2014, 11:31 AM
Jun 2014

before you could explain, but I'd suggest in the future, maybe you make it plain that you're working on projects from your own heritage before you say exactly what you're working on. If you'd started out by telling him about the Gundestrop Cauldron before simply saying 'antler headdress', he might have reacted far differently.

Sometimes you've simply got to take more care when you're dealing to people who are used to dealing with people who ARE doing cultural appropriation, to make sure they don't simply assume you're one of many.

Better luck with the next person you talk to.

De Leonist

(225 posts)
2. I recognize that
Thu Jun 12, 2014, 11:36 AM
Jun 2014

You are correct in your recommendation. I certainly do sometimes forget to explain myself first.

Al Carroll

(113 posts)
4. You are a rarity
Mon Jun 16, 2014, 08:56 PM
Jun 2014

9/10 or more of the ones out there doing something similar are New Age types, or white pagans who don't know much about their own heritage who think faux Native is "close enough."

Like the other poster said, explaining yourself first is a must to avoid this happening again.

Good luck, I know from experience that those pagans who are not the "close enough" variety often make very good allies to Native people.

hopemountain

(3,919 posts)
5. look for copies of
Wed Jul 2, 2014, 01:17 AM
Jul 2014

james churchward's "the sacred sympols of mu"
and the addendum to his "the lost continent of mu"

he provides a wonderful connection between sacred symbols from major groups of people on all of the continents to support his belief/theory that key sacred symbols origins are connected to one another.

also, if you sell from a booth or a website, you might link photos of scandanavian ceremonial symbols and the time period they are associated with. pictures really help.

understandably, folks can be very touchy about the copying of american indian art, regalia, etc.

if you can demonstrate the historical connection and just the fact that elk and bear and wolves exist all over the northern hemisphere, and have been hunted by many different walks of peoples, they may acknowledge the common ground.

try to not be defensive. instead be proud for being connected to your heritage.

my late husband was of scandinavian and sammi descent. when we first met his need to know everything about my heritage and ancestor's culture was annoying - until i encouraged him to learn more about his own heritage. his family had a pair of beautifully beaded reindeer skin tobacco bags and other items that had been kept in the family and brought over when they immigrated to america in 1900.

littlemissmartypants

(25,632 posts)
6. It is art.
Sat Aug 16, 2014, 03:27 PM
Aug 2014

You're an artist. You create, leave it to the viewer and buyer to love and interpret your work.

I would put a brief explanation in writing. Frame it. Send it out to your buyers. Post it on your itsy or wherever.

If they want to question or argue... let them.

Then refer them to your written statement, move on and make more art.

Love, Peace and Shelter. ~ Lmsp

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