Exclusive poll: Most Americans say religion will live on

[guillaumeb]

From the article:

Almost three-quarters of Americans say they expect organized religion to live on well into the future — including 64% of 18-34 year olds, despite the decline in religious practice among millennials, according to an Axios poll conducted by SurveyMonkey for "Axios on HBO."

To read more:

https://www.axios.com/millennials-organized-religion-generation-ac6a43d5-2f14-4092-bc67-0032d071e8cf.html

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

1. It's really scary to think that many people

are so delusional. Helps explain things like Trump and climate change denying, doesn't it?

[guillaumeb]

2. Some feel that theism is a problem.

A majority of Chinese citizens are atheists. So how does that influence their behavior?

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

3. The article is about Americans.

Why are you bringing up Chinese atheists in this context?

And yeah, believing in irrational things is a problem.

[guillaumeb]

4. You are describing theists as delusional.

By implication, non-theists must be realists.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

5. Please do not impute something I did not say.

[guillaumeb]

6. When you said, in the context of this post:

It's really scary to think that many people

are so delusional. Helps explain things like Trump and climate change denying, doesn't it?

I made the connection that you were describing theists as delusional. Feel free to elaborate on what you said.

[Eko]

10. Was that a poll of Chinese people?

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

18. As always, you distort what is said.

Which is why you are singularly unpopular here.

[guillaumeb]

27. Dod you intend this to be an ad hominem attack?

You were given the chance to clarify what appears to be an attack on theists.

You chose to resort to ad hominem.


So, what does that say?

[MineralMan]

28. No. You misframed it, Guy!

You did what you're always accusing others of doing. We can all see the posts, you know.

[guillaumeb]

29. Thank you, official spokesperson for the group.

[MineralMan]

32. I speak only for myself, Guy.

For whom do you speak?

[guillaumeb]

33. No, you answered for another.

Read the thread again.

[MineralMan]

34. ..

[guillaumeb]

35. Much better. eom

[MineralMan]

38. No, I spoke directly to you, dear.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

36. As Mineral Man pointed out,

you reframed what I said and misstated it.

If it's an ad hominen attack to point out what you do all the time, I guess it's an ad hominem attack.

[guillaumeb]

37. And as I poonted out,

you said:

It's really scary to think that many people

are so delusional. Helps explain things like Trump and climate change denying, doesn't it?

I gave my interpretation, and you denied what I read, and refused to clarify what you meant.

So I did not reframe, I pasted your exact words.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

39. No, you did reframe it when

you changed my statement that many people are delusional to theists are delusional. That's imputing something I did not say. If my statement isn't clear to you, then it's your reading comprehension that's at fault.

[guillaumeb]

40. Given the post itself,

and that this is the religion group,
and you talked about delusional people,
forgive me for interpreting the many people as referring to theists.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

41. No. You are not forgiven.

You deliberately made my statement into something it was not.

[Mariana]

7. It does help explain it.

Look at the famous and very influential preachers who publicly support Trump. They wouldn't do it if they were losing followers because of it. If anything, their enthusiastic cheerleading has made them even more popular - and wealthier - than they were before.

Climate change denial makes perfect sense, too. If people believe God is in control of that kind of thing, of course they are going to laugh at the idea that the activities of human beings can have any effect.

Right now, it seems impossible that the influence of religion on our political process will decrease any time soon. However, I remember when it seemed that same sex marriage would never be permitted, and that marijuana would always be illegal. Things can and do change, sometimes for the better.

[marylandblue]

8. The majority of people throughout history have been religious

Last edited Thu Nov 29, 2018, 10:26 AM - Edit history (1)

Whatever forces made that so in the past are still at work today, and are likely to continue for the foreseeable future.

[MineralMan]

9. Who did the poll exclude, Guy?

[MineralMan]

11. A good example of the ad populum fallacy, Guy.

Thanks.

[trotsky]

22. It's probably his favorite, given how much he uses it. n/t

[MineralMan]

23. Well, I love polls about things that are unrelated

to public opinion. Science, for example. Polls about beliefs regarding, say the theory of evolution, are common. Some attempt to use such polls to argue against evolution, as though people's opinions about it have something to do with whether the theory is accurate or not.

For example, someone might quote a poll like this:

Does God Exist?

Polls show that 75% of people believe that there is a deity.

Someone might believe that such polls have some relevance to the question. They do not, of course. If someone argues that they do, they are illogical and have fallen prey to the ad populum fallacy.

We see such sophistry frequently presented here by some participants in this Group. When the fallacy is explained, they reject the argument. Odd, that.

[edhopper]

12. Do we really want to base things on

"what people think".
I would prefer rational and scientific thought as a basis.

[guillaumeb]

13. This is the dabate ground in the theism vs atheism issue.

And when polls suggest that fewer people are formally religious, those are praised by some few as being "proof" that people are turning away from religion.

[edhopper]

14. People are turning away from religion

but birthrates will keep the supply of religious going.

I don't think religion is going away either.

Of course asking Americas what they think about the future is a fools errand.

[guillaumeb]

15. The future is as close as tomorrow.

[edhopper]

16. Is that from

a fortune cookie?

[guillaumeb]

25. It could be, but I thought it while reading your post.

Perhaps I could have a new career?

[edhopper]

30. What's my

lucky number?

[guillaumeb]

31. I just thought of it.

Listen with your mind's ear.

[edhopper]

43. That don't work!

[guillaumeb]

44. I will think of it again.

There, I did it. Play that number tomorrow.

[Major Nikon]

17. That's not what the poll is asking

[MineralMan]

20. Please try not to confuse the original poster.

Thank you for your cooperation.

[Major Nikon]

21. I don't think he needs help

[Voltaire2]

19. The result you posted was not about being religious

it was about the future existence of organized religion.

[Lordquinton]

24. What is your interpretation of this?

It's interesting to see, but really doesn't tell us anything aside from what people think. It's like asking people if they think climate change is a problem. Their answer is meaningless aside from what the public perception is.

As you say, belief isn't based in facts.

[trotsky]

26. Hell, I'm cheering on the decline of religion as much as anyone...

but even I would respond to this survey saying that religion will never go away.

I mean, I know why guillaumeb is excited by this and felt the need to post it - he doesn't understand what it really means, and just jumped to the conclusion that it supports his beliefs. As he has done so many times, humiliating himself in the process.

[Lordquinton]

42. What he posts often doesn't actually say what he claims

I pointed out that an article he posted actually says the opposite of what he claims and have endured a whole subthread of baseless abuse because of it. It's nothing new really.