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Behind the Aegis

(54,852 posts)
Tue Aug 22, 2023, 02:40 PM Aug 2023

(Jewish Group) Kissinger at 100: 'If it were not for the accident of my birth, I would be antisemitic.'

How readers may choose to commemorate the birthday of Henry Kissinger, who turns 100 on May 27, may well depend on their previous readings about the former Secretary of State and National Security adviser.

Those who appreciated Niall Ferguson’s hagiographical two-volume biography will applaud Kissinger’s role as the first Jewish secretary of state and his success in helping to achieve détente with Communist China and the Soviet Union.

By contrast, political writers Seymour Hersh and especially Christopher Hitchens have pointed to a series of alleged war crimes by Kissinger in Vietnam, Bangladesh, Chile, Cyprus and East Timor marked by decisions made with apparent blithe unconcern for human suffering and loss of life.

Law experts insist there is scant chance that Kissinger will ever be tried as a war criminal, although some of his close political associates, including the Chilean dictator General Augusto Pinochet, did undergo that experience. Kissinger’s policies were, after all, concocted in the White House, and the historic legal immunity of that building for myriad crimes has become familiar to Americans over the past four years.

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Sadly, I think his quote is true of too many Jews today, with some not even allowing their being Jewish to halt their anti-Semitism. Such is the power of gaslighting, privilege, and internalized anti-Semitism, and overall culture.

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(Jewish Group) Kissinger at 100: 'If it were not for the accident of my birth, I would be antisemitic.' (Original Post) Behind the Aegis Aug 2023 OP
Sadly, there is no prohibition against internecine bigotry in religion getagrip_already Aug 2023 #1
IMO, I doubt your mother's experience was anti-Semitic from other Jews. Though it could have been. Behind the Aegis Aug 2023 #2
That's possible.. getagrip_already Aug 2023 #4
Decades ago, I argued with my father, no_hypocrisy Aug 2023 #3
There are a number of self-hating Jews, and it looks like Kissinger is one of them JohnSJ Aug 2023 #5
My Jewish mother mountain grammy Aug 2023 #6
Henry Kissinger is responsible for over 3 million civilian deaths... AlGorerhythm Aug 2023 #7

getagrip_already

(17,432 posts)
1. Sadly, there is no prohibition against internecine bigotry in religion
Tue Aug 22, 2023, 02:53 PM
Aug 2023

It is rampant in all sects.

Biden isn't catholic enough. Blah, blah, blah.

My mother in law, who escaped hitlers Germany in 1937 as a young Jewish girl, describes how the most severe discrimination she felt came from upper class jaws already settled in America.

So yeah, there is nothing magical about being a member of a discriminated minority. There can always be someone who rose up, became successful, and established themselves as an asshole.

Behind the Aegis

(54,852 posts)
2. IMO, I doubt your mother's experience was anti-Semitic from other Jews. Though it could have been.
Tue Aug 22, 2023, 03:02 PM
Aug 2023

It was more than likely class discrimination and immigrant discrimination. Her experience was similar to Jews from the Pale when they went to Germany, France, England, and Italy prior to WWII. It is also similar to the intercultural bigotry experienced by African-Americans from the South when they moved to northern cities.

With that asshole, Kissinger, I think that is more internalized anti-Semitism, and, as I said, I think there are way more than a few Jews who are anti-Semitic toward other Jews because they are Jews, and less so because of issues of immigration status and class, as was all too common in the past.

getagrip_already

(17,432 posts)
4. That's possible..
Tue Aug 22, 2023, 03:13 PM
Aug 2023

But it can be a very tight knot to untangle. Is someone hateful because you are a jew, because you are the wrong kind of jew, a jew from the wrong country, of the wrong class, or with the wrong physical characteristics?

So many reasons for hate Sadly. And kissinger is just a pig with a rotten soul.

no_hypocrisy

(48,778 posts)
3. Decades ago, I argued with my father,
Tue Aug 22, 2023, 03:03 PM
Aug 2023

contending Jews could be antisemitic. I don’t mean the stereotypical self-hating Jew. Dad disagreed.

But he was one of them. No Jewish identity, save for an errant visit to a kosher deli.

He was “allowed” to join the Mecca of WASP golf clubs that had previously excluded Jews. He aligned himself with their culture. He eschewed all vestiges of Jewish culture.

I found him to be an unbearable hypocrite.

 

AlGorerhythm

(52 posts)
7. Henry Kissinger is responsible for over 3 million civilian deaths...
Tue Aug 22, 2023, 05:23 PM
Aug 2023

Laos, Cambodia, Vietnam and he fomented violent, deadly coups resulting in barbaric dictatorships in Africa. Hank killed enough people without going after Jews...in fact he seems to have drawn the line at killing white people.

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