So you voted for Stein or Johnson? What did you get for your vote?

[stevebreeze]

It's clear that third party voting did not cause Trump to loose the election. He "won" kinda sorta.

It's far less clear that Hillary Clinton lost due to erosion from third parties. We know that neither Gary Johnson or Jill Stein makes the claim that they are to blame for Clinton's loss. In fact both Jill Stein and Gary Johnson deny they are the cause of Hilary's loss.
Neither third party received the 5% needed for federal funding of their party 4 years from now. Johnson 3.8% Stein less then 1%.
So neither third party is going to have a windfall for party building. Third party's will return to their normal also ran status in four years. Nothing accomplished on this front.

Then you have to ask yourself why aren't Stein and Johnson claiming the messed up the election for Clinton? This is the best outcome either of them could have rationally have hoped for. The BEST! The argument then is one of the large parties should lean toward their stances and so not risk having their election screwed up next time. This isn't happening either.

No third party candidate has ever won in the history of the United States. This leads me to one other factor, the enormous waste of time arguing for third parties on this board and elsewhere. so thanks for that.

If you voted third party you should feel like the right wing played you for a chump, because they did and you were.

Can we at least learn for 2 years from now? I hope so!

[LisaL]

1. The problem is, people never learn.

[JI7]

2. they got to feel cool

[stevebreeze]

6. I would say the stroked their own ego...

[La Lioness Priyanka]

3. They defeated Clinton and you can't deny them that glory

Lol

[stevebreeze]

7. Both Stein and Johnson have said for the record that they didn't change the outcome.

and I would not deny them their glory, while there were of course other factors they are to blame as well.

[still_one]

4. If they didn't learn in 2000, they will never learn

[SidDithers]

5. ...

Sid

[HassleCat]

8. For president

No third party candidate has won the presidency. Third party candidates win frequently at the state and local levels.

[stevebreeze]

14. I would say they occasionally win. The vast majority of state and local election go to Democrats or Rs

The deck is stacked in many ways in most states. Things like higher number of signatures for ballot access.

[Cha]

9. They won't be on this board.. this is for DEMs who voted for

Hillary.

What they got was a climate change denier who hates pot.

[JCanete]

10. that is actually a good question. It is funky terrain. You want to matter, but not to be

scapegoated and vilified by a media that would love the opportunity, and will probably do their share of it anyway. Making 3rd parties into bitter attention-seeking spoilers is a national past-time.

So they are fighting against that, but arguably whether they admit to an effect or not, its not like the DNC or RNC doesn't have to take notice of what pulled voters away.

Regardless, almost nobody voted for Stein, and I would be very surprised if anybody on these boards voted for Johnson. I don't think anything about his platform aligns with democrats or liberals.

But while we're talking about how worthless 3rd parties are, we should be establishing terms, since there are plenty on this board that would have liked to bar sanders from running within the democratic party. Doing both suggests such a walled garden approach to who gets to run for president, its hardly democratic. Some sort of run-off voting would be the answer I think, where people are allowed to vote for first and second choices. Unfortunately, we have two established parties that will NEVER push for this. It only undermines their choke-hold on the system to do so.

[stevebreeze]

11. I think run off voting would be great.

but that is not part of the world that is. I would be surprised if some on this board did not vote for Johnson. More then a few Bernie people in the primary went for Johnson.Exit polling confirms this. Don't ask me why.

[MichMan]

12. Dont think Stein attracted votes from RW

I not thinking too many RW voted for Stein

[LP2K12]

13. First let me say, I voted for Clinton.

Then let me say, it depends on WHERE they voted for their candidate.

For example, Johnson took enough of the vote in my home state of Michigan that the Libertarian party is now state-funded and recognized for primary voting and debates.

So, yeah they earned him and the party something on the state level, but the federal level was futile.

Either way, it sucks.

[JI7]

15. most of the Obama votes that didn't go to Hillary went to Johnson

These were originally ron paul supporters.