Would it really be that terrible to make our 2020 message something like THIS:

[Ken Burch]

"We stand against social oppression AND economic oppression. We seek a world with justice for all, where the wounds of the far past, the near past AND the present will be healed, where the Earth that sustains us shall be sustained, and where war will be a thing of the past".

Could anybody here NOT live with that as a basic statement of what we should be about?

[MADem]

1. "Here" as in DU, or "here" as in USA?

Here, in USA, there are people who believe that those of us who are not white males should be relegated to the back of the bus, that we are less deserving, less worthy, less entitled to the promise of this nation than the people with less melanin and a US birth certificate.

I don't think they'll be convinced, and I don't care to expend any effort to convince them. I'd as soon crush them, to be honest, by persuading those who already feel the way we do to get out and vote, and to help those who need ID in onerous states to get ID. Hell, we'd do well to force legislation that reduces prices on ID for poorer people, and even set up agencies that help people get thirty or fifty bucks to pay for the ID--either through loans or grants.

[NoGoodNamesLeft]

2. Unfortunately, war will never be a thing of the past...but saying it should be the LAST resort

is the right policy while being realistic. There are times when armed conflict is the only right option. World War II to get rid of Hitler is a perfect example of why isolationism is bad. Had the US stepped in sooner a massive amount of lives could have been saved.

[Maven]

3. "Standing against oppression" is not a message that will motivate the middle of this country

That's framing the issue from the standpoint of victimhood, not strength. It's just not a workable message for a national campaign. For a Brooklyn Food Coop maybe. But not the US of A. This past election demonstrated that a huge swath of this country is just dandy with oppression -- so long as they're the ones doing the oppressing.

Yes we should emphasize making the economy fairer but we have to figure out how to do that from a position of strength. It has to be about taking back control from the 1%. Crunchy notions of restoring justice and combatting oppression won't sell.

[Ken Burch]

6. Thanks for the response. n/t.

[oberliner]

4. That won't appeal to the Fox News crowd

They don't believe in any of that.

[el_bryanto]

10. well I see no set of circumstances in which we would get the Fox News Crowd anyway

Without totally changing our principals.

I guess the question is how many people who, say, voted for Trump, aren't committed conservatives are there, and could be brought to our side of the fence.

Bryant

[oberliner]

14. Good point

I guess it's got to be about turning out the base.

[realmirage]

5. That will be our message. Right now a lot of people here

are apparently still too traumatized by the loss that they can't think in terms of what needs to be done to win next time. But they will, hopefully

[DemocraticWing]

7. Maybe more people will get on board in 3 or 4 years.

The people who bash this message aren't interested in winning, nor are they interested in standing up for the victims of Trump's administration. They just want to sit around and blame people for losing in 2016. Blame Hillary, Blame Bernie, blame the government, blame the media, blame the voters, blame poor people, blame black people, blame Russia, blame blame blame. That's all anybody has now isn't it?

We are heading for even worse losses in the future, and I don't think people realize what we're up against. Business is usual isn't going to fix things. It's not nearly enough. It's laughably, insanely inadequate to battle Trump.

[demon in basement]

8. 2020?

If Trump isn't prevented from becoming POTUS, none of us will see 2020.

[Demsrule86]

9. Depends if we want to win or not...a message like that will not be a winning won.

People want to know about their bottom line mostly.

[Dream Girl]

11. More navel gazing

[Dream Girl]

12. You figure it out and get back to us if we're still here

[Dream Girl]

13. You are actually coming up with positioning statements for the Dem party?

You do know what happened don't you? Are you completely oblivious or just pretending? Sheesh...

[Ken Burch]

17. I agree that the election results were dirty...but what are we supposed to do?

Nothing I'm saying here is disloyal or disrespectful to our 2016 nominee. And none of it threatens the chances of Hillary getting in via a "Hamilton Electors" scenario(assuming you still think that is a possibility).

What is it about what I posted in the OP that's so offensive to you? THIS campaign is over. Pretending it's still going on doesn't help anything.

[Dream Girl]

20. What I'm reacting to is the assumption that our lose was due to strategy.

Yes, we can always evolve and improve, but at the end of the day she lost because it was stolen. No amount of analysis, course correcting, repositioning and yes navel gazing is going to make one iota of difference in 2018, 2020 or ever. Our focus should be on election integrity, because the interference, gerrymandering and yes possible hacking will not ever be overcome by fine tuning our message because we won this election.

[brer cat]

24. *This*

You nailed it, Dream Girl.

[Ken Burch]

27. I think it was a combination of bad strategy AND theft

Strategic mistakes(which were the same mistakes our party USUALLY makes in the fall, and for which I don't the nominee) kept the contest close enough for theft to be possible.

And I don't see any contradiction between believing that our strategy could have been better and could be better in the future and ALSO believing that we were cheated out of victory by nefarious forces.

It's not binary.

[That Guy 888]

29. The GOP tried to steal it from Obama, and did steal it from Gore and Kerry.

Barrack Obama won because of his charisma and his message of Hope and Change. He should have pushed election reform instead of a modified version of the Heritage Foundation's insurance corporation rescue program.

If the Democratic Party doesn't change it's going to keep losing. The most important change is to fight against election theft. Since 2000 the Party's position has been to pretend it doesn't exist.

Chasing "moderate Republicans" doesn't help either.

[NCTraveler]

15. Terrible. Terrible I tell you.

Shit, everyone likes a good drum circle.

[Ken Burch]

16. I was just looking for a unifying thing.

We can't win by saying anything Republicans would say.

[NCTraveler]

19. "We can't win by saying anything Republicans would say."

We wouldn't want to. Not sure where that comes from.

[Ken Burch]

28. You wouldn't...but some would.

It's my belief that PART of the opposition to making economic justice a stronger part of our program is being orchestrated by the corporate wing of the party, and that people from that wing are stirring up fears that changing the message would have to mean the abandonment of historically oppressed communities. The corporate wing is trading on this because they see spreading such fears as a way of making sure nothing anti-corporate gets incorporated in to the party program at the next election, and, if possible, of moving the party further RIGHT on economic issues between now and 2020.

Again, that isn't aimed at you, but that has to be part of the reason why any mention of the "e word" somehow gets characterized as a call for the party to throw various components of the party base "under the bus".

[andym]

18. People just want to hear that you will help make their lives and those of their neighbors better

that's the basic message. The fine tuning comes with the "how." That was the point of "hope and change" for example.

[pstokely]

21. It has to be a simple one sentence message

Last edited Mon Dec 12, 2016, 08:50 PM - Edit history (1)

whatever it is

[JustAnotherGen]

22. You should run on that!

[George II]

23. Sounds like a John Lennon song.

[brer cat]

25. lol

[bowens43]

26. We could live with that but at least half the country could not.....

Much of the country would call it 'moon bat' stuff

[SunSeeker]

30. Too many words, dude. Remember who your audience is: the American voter.

And way too specific. People can't make that fit all of their very varied desires. Obama's winning message was just one very adaptable word: Hope.