Gun Logic 101: "As a touchstone, let's change the subject and see how stupid it sounds".

[stone space]

Ok, so I ran across this post in an OP about Zimmerman's being allowed to keep his gun, and his attempt to auction it off to the highest racist gunhumping bidder.

Now, being that this OP was started in the gungeon, and given the high level of support that Zimmerman has in that particular DU group, it is hardly surprising that Zimmerman found some support for his murder of Trayvon Martin over there in that thread.

But that is not what this OP is about.

This OP is about a much more mundane comment that just happened to appear in that thread, and one that we have all seen on countless occasions in multiple threads relating to guns, and which seems by its repetition to be a fundamental part of Gun Logic 101.

And it has to do with how stupid many reasonable sounding comments about guns seem when you change the subject to something else.

And how stupid many reasonable sounding comments about other stuff seems when you change the topic to guns.

OK, as a touchstone, let's replace activities about guns with voting, or using free speech.

How acceptable are your proposals then?

That's what I thought. Since each are Constitutional rights, this could be problematic.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1172193683#post38

Ok, how does this work?

First, one takes a perfectly reasonable sounding statement about Gun Rites, such as this one:

"Zimmerman should be in jail for gunstalking and murdering Trayvon Martin, and, failing that, he should certainly have his guns taken away."

Then one performs the Magical Gun Logic Transformation to the statement, and constructs a similar statement, not about guns, but about free speech instead:

"Zimmerman should be in jail for having a conversation with Trayvon Martin, and, failing that, he should certainly have his mouth taped shut and not be allowed to speak any more."

Note how stupid the statement seems after the Magical Gun Logic Transformation has been applied to turn the statement about guns into a statement about free speech.

After all, It was just a conversation. And Trayvon is still alive. So what's the big deal?

The Magical Gun Logic Transformation can also be used in the opposite direction to turn perfectly reasonable sounding statements about other stuff into rather stupid sounding statements about guns.

For example, consider the following perfectly reasonable sounding statement regarding the Right to Vote:

"George Zimmerman should be allowed to vote for the candidate of his choice from his prison cell, since the right to vote is a basic and fundamental human and civil right".

A simple application of the Magical Gun Logic Transformation turns this reasonable sounding statement about the Right to Vote into the following absurdity about Gun Rites:

"George Zimmerman should be allowed the semi-automatic weapon of his choice in his prison cell, since the right to guns is a basic and fundamental human and civil right".

Remember, when folks say reasonable stuff about guns, the Magical Gun Logic Transformation can be used to change the subject to something else and make their statements appear stupid in the new contest.

And it can be used to take perfectly reasonable statements about other stuff and change the topic to guns to make the statement sound stupid in the new context.

[Squinch]

1. Great post, and yes, those arguments are only for the very stupid of brain. But, well, ya know.

[AllyCat]

2. He murdered another human being.

He should be in jail. Felons have their guns and voting rights taken away.

[stone space]

3. I agree with taking away their guns.

Felons have their guns and voting rights taken away.

I also support the Right to Vote Amendment that would respect the right of every adult citizen of this nation to vote. (I would also lower the voting age to 16, btw.)

Eugene Debs ran for President, and gained a million votes, from his prison cell.

Due to felony disenfranchisement, Debs was not allowed to vote for himself in that election, because the qualifications for running for President were less stringent than the qualifications of voting for that same office.

Pocan and Ellison Announce Right to Vote Amendment

The text of the amendment is below:

SECTION 1: Every citizen of the United States, who is of legal voting age, shall have the fundamental right to vote in any public election held in the jurisdiction in which the citizen resides.

SECTION 2: Congress shall have the power to enforce and implement this article by appropriate legislation.

http://pocan.house.gov/media-center/press-releases/pocan-and-ellison-announce-right-to-vote-amendment

[Mustellus]

4. You are trampling on my Second Amendment Rights, Stone Space!!!!!

The Second Amendment (all bow.... ) doesn't say GUNS, it says ARMS.

Our Founding Fathers (who saw all of the future... ) let Daniel Boone have a cannon to use on injuns, and let New England sea captains have their entire broadside battery.

And here you are supporting Big Government in taking away our RIGHTS to private ownership of nuclear weapons.

That's right, the Government has already confiscated all the privately owned nuclear weapons, in direct contravention of the Second Amendment. And you apparently support this, Stone Space! How can I keep my family protected? How can I stand my ground?

</Snark Off?>

[flamin lib]

5. If Practiced freedom of speech the way they practice the second

amendment I'd follow them around with a bull horn shouting obscenities at them where ever they go. Restaurants, church, schools, every where.

[stone space]

6. I wonder if Freedom of the Press includes the right to print off guns on 3D Printers?

Surely, our Founding Fathers (who art in heaven, hallowed be thy names!) had 3D Printers in mind when they wrote the First Amendment.

Just as they had modern semi-automatic weapons in mind when they wrote the Second Amendment.

[billh58]

7. K & R n/t

[stone space]

8. Oh, this is rich!

Just yesterday, in response to an article about the NRA's opposition to the Right to Vote, with this sentence singled out and quoted:

Former inmates who lost their voting rights, many of them for non-violent drug offenses, have told ThinkProgress they feel like “less than a citizen” and “less than human.”

Just imagine just how stupid they would sound if they were talking about the Right to Pack Heat rather than the Right to Vote:

Oh this is rich. Just imagine the absolute fun you'd be having with this, if those former inmates had said the same thing about a constitutionally protected right - gun rights.

They'd go from being the poor disenfranchised former felons, to the "ammosexuals" whos decisions and judgment can't be trusted, all with a switch of the topic.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1172193876#post2



Yeah, a little switch in topic can sometimes have a huge impact on just how stupid something sounds.