My 93 year old Alzheimer's father pulled a pistol on his caregiver:

[nightscanner59]

Last edited Fri Mar 29, 2013, 07:12 AM - Edit history (3)

Adult Protective Services and local Police Dept have removed remaining firearm from the home. Caregiver has quit. (yeah, big surprise there.) I'm being forced to abandon my position, home, all here and go care for him to avoid the approx $5000 a month nursing home cost, impossible for my family to cover. An avid Fox Nooze patriot, (excuse me while I barf) I'd just as well eat several cans of cat food.
Upon replying to several of the gun nuts on Sodahead who know nothing of this, I ask them if it's the "goddamn elitist liberals coming to take my guns" include the well armed elitist liberals or just the mamby-pamby ones is met with deafening, dumbfounded silence.
My Father's Hestonesque noneloquence notwithstanding I lose my own as follows:
fuck, fuckify, fuckification, totally fucked, fucked up, fucked over, o.k. I'll stop there.

Post note and clarification edit: Situation is tenatively under control. Thank you to all responders here for helpful links and suggestions. This post serves as warning for those in similar circumstance that there may be clandestine firearms in residences of those prone to developing dementia. Suspect the leftover pistol was in dad's bedroom safe. Its a wonder he managed to access it in his current state, according to brother. Hunting rifle rack, ammo drawer was removed from residence over a year ago when suspected developing condition was discussed by family. Inconvenient, financially and personally for me, but anticipated and prepared to do this for over a year now.
Caregiver will be compensated and is a family friend, holds no grudge, just doesn't want to continue and can't blame him. Hes every bit as gay as me. That is the other ironic twist here, but I digress... that's a whole other story...
I do hope someone is well aware of my own problems when the time comes, someone will have the heart to heart with me.
Yes, I do own guns, and hunt with them. None of them will go with me, are in highly secured location over 600 miles from parent's residence, and are strictly hunting rifles.
I will have a house for rent when both parents are in pine boxes. No details here, this is an uncannily timely post for discussion.

And now for something lighter and completely different: http://www.democraticunderground.com/1011591

[idwiyo]

1. I am sorry. Really sorry. (((Hugs)))

[NYC_SKP]

2. Needless to say, your dad shouldn't have had any firearms whatsoever.

I feel your pain with an aging parent, regardless of the pistol problem.

My dad suffered from dementia for several years and died last month, I brought my mom back home from the long term care they were in together after he died.

I hid a lot of things over the years that I didn't want him to lose or screw up, but they had no guns.

Nonetheless, I wouldn't have been surprised if he'd pulled a knife one day on the helpers to whom we was so abusive.

Which is why they went to a home.

In any event, don't let all this make you crazy.

It's not easy, and I hope you have help with it all.

[wordpix]

36. mom has Alzheimer's & used to threaten, we hid all knives

now she's more mellow with age and the progression of the disease

[BainsBane]

3. I'm so sorry

That sounds like such a lot to deal with.

[elleng]

4. VERY sorry.

[Mika]

5. How uniquely American.

Very sorry for your situation.

[nightscanner59]

6. I will have to remembeer to bring restraints for showing him the latest Jim Carrey installment

[patrice]

7. Oh dear! Oh, oh, oh . . . . (shakes head) I don't know what to say . . . .

Such an absolutely impossible situation for BOTH of you.

I have seen a few family elders off into the hereafter and have seen others, in laws and such, go through it; it is NOT easy even under the best of circumstances.

Find the things YOU need to help YOU through this an to do the best you can for him and for YOURSELF. I don't know how to tell you anything more about it.

Just please do take care of yourself, so you can be as good to him as it is possible to be under what are going to be VERY difficult circumstances.

Check back in with us here at DU now and then, when you want to, if it helps, k?

[nightscanner59]

9. Will do. Bringing separate residence for me (travel trailer) or my own sanity would end.

Seeing my doctor about sedative Rx's, and his doctor for him as soon as I arrive. I have six weeks to prepare. Best thing I will do for myself is keep my humor up, my laptop with me, serve him small meals often (elicits naps) and keep the car keys out of reach. I'm thank heaven the police have already removed the firearms.

[AtheistCrusader]

28. Get rid of the car entirely.

If you reached a point where he can't have any guns, same goes for the car. You never know when someone with Alzheimer's might have a moment of clarity, and find that set of keys you didn't know about, and go to the store or something simple that turns into a tragedy.

Just as dangerous as a gun. If you can't, at least disconnect the battery in the car, or if it's older, yank the distributor cap out.

Close call with the gun. He could have spent the end of his life in jail easily enough.

[nightscanner59]

50. Oh, yes a trade in will be tended to near immediately, and keys of whatever only under my control:

Other relatives are enroute for the interim. Dad does have moments of clarity, but blessing in painful disguise, hands are advanced arthritically crippled to even hold the gun long in the incident, much less to hold the steering wheel, manipulate keys, etc. Brother has car disabled for now (entire electronic ignition box removed while he was safehoused), regardless. Local authorities are familiar with the problems and are good with only his staying put at home. He was put in my brother's safe house for a while with full surveillence, now is okay, but only for now. He never became aware he was locked in. He's 93, feed him something and it's sleepytime.
His oldest brother died with same syndrome.
Caretaker only wants a settlement, done. No charges pressed.

[MADem]

51. I agree with those who suggest you contact the Altzheimer's Assn.

You might want to consider a GPS for him, too, if you think there's any possibility he might go walkabout: http://www.alz.org/comfortzone/

Sorry for your woes--this is a very difficult thing.

[nightscanner59]

53. Yes, my uncle has suggested that as well, thanx for link

[Ms. Toad]

35. Contact your local Alzheimer's association-

They should be able to put you in touch with local resources. There are often daycare settings, or respite care that are at low cost and will provide you with a much needed break.

There are often multiple meetings locally. I haven't found them to be terribly helpful with my spouse (MCI/early stages of Alzheimer's - or something else entirely), but they love me unconditionally - even if my family (we're both female) and my politics challenge them. It is good to have a place to just go and vent among people who know instantly what I'm talking about - and who don't know my spouse (most of our support systems are shared and she is not yet ready to tell anyone - not to mention that she insists there is nothing wrong with her - and based on what I know about where her greatest losses are she really isn't aware there is anything wrong).

[nightscanner59]

49. Thank you for the resource lead, Toad.

I'll need all the support I can get, once there. Other relatives are enroute for the interim. Dad does have moments of clarity, but blessing in painful disguise, hands are advanced arthritically crippled to even hold the gun long in the incident, much less to hold the steering wheel, manipulate keys, etc. Brother has car disabled for now, regardless. Local authorities are familiar with the problems and are good with only his staying put at home. He was put in a safe house for a while with full surveillence, now is okay, but only for now.
His oldest brother died with same syndrome.
Caretaker only wants a settlement, done. No charges pressed.

[Ms. Toad]

70. Your comment about local authorities reminded me of another thing

Wandering is fairly common with AD. Make sure he is registered with Safe Return or the local equivalent.

I'm nowhere near where you are with your father - and don't know that I'll get there. For the age at diagnosis with MCI consistent with the early stages of AD (late 50s), the progression is very slow so I still wonder if it is something else. But I spent 4 very frustrating hours over the last few days straightening out insurance messes caused by her inability to get a piece of paper to her doctor, and tell me clearly what the doctor had done.

[niyad]

8. I am so very sorry--been there, and it is not a good situation. personally, I think your non-

eloquence was quite eloquent. there really are no words.

[ellisonz]

10. I'm sorry to hear that as someone with a grumpy fortunately unarmed 93-year-old grandfather.

This may be of little comfort, but you're hardly alone in your situation:

The VA Tells the Truth About Guns. The NRA Can't Handle It.

[Cleita]

11. My hair stylist, who just turned sixty, announced to me today when I went

to get my hair done, that she wanted a gun. I asked why? Do you want to target shoot? She said she didn't feel safe and she wanted a gun. She's a new grandmother. Why would she have a gun around a brand new child? Why does she feel unsafe? She's been living and working in the same sleepy village for thirty years were nothing really happens? I know she's a conservative so I have a feeling there is some Fox News and Rash Limbug thinking going on there. I think maybe your father got the same brainwashing.

Honestly, something needs to be done. Why are senior citizens suddenly wanting firearms? I truly sympathize with you and I know you can't fire your father. I think I am going to fire my hair dresser. The thought of going to the beauty shop and knowing there are fire arms there makes me too nervous.

[nightscanner59]

56. It's what I'm coining "Hestonesque syndrome", how about that? NRA sucks.

[Bennyboy]

12. welcome to my world.

my dad used to pull guns on me ALL THE TIME. He avoided diagnosis so tehy would not be able to take his guns away from him.

[nightscanner59]

55. I'm just glad dad is at a city residence now. IF

he were at the cattle ranch where I partially grew up, the situation would have ended with someone bloody and likely dead in the last year or so.
BTW, neighbors are familiar and ready to dial police if he wanders but unlikely a worry now: Demented but he can hardly get himself to the bathroom these days and back to chair and bed. Wheelchair will be obtained soon.

[indepat]

13. My 96-year-old father (dementia) literally ran a care-giver out of the house wagging an air rifle

at her all the while. He normally wouldn't have hurt anyone or anything and probably still had sufficient reasoning not to fire the weapon. But he just didn't take a likening to her and she was leaving his house this minute. Good luck in dealing with a ticklish situation.

[SheilaT]

14. At the risk of seeming just a tad

judgmental or non-sympathetic, why in the world were there pistols in the home? Alzheimer's? Did he suddenly get Alzheimer's a week ago Thursday so that there simply wasn't any time to think about the guns?

Can we re-open the "responsible gun owner" discussion? Does a responsible gun-owner have Alzheimer's? Would the child of a person with it be responsible to leave the guns in the house?

Oh, and you said "Adult Protective Services and local Police Dept have removed firearms from the home." Firearms, plural. Were you blissfully unaware that your 93 year old father had any guns?

It is a shame that all this happened, but maybe if everyone reconsidered the entire gun-owning thing we'd all be a little safer. Just not "safe" in the way gun ownership has it. You'll be lucky if the caregiver doesn't sue.

[AtheistCrusader]

30. Took them all away from my dad, very early onset. Only in his 60's.

Sucked but it had to be done. Partway through the cancer he begged for one of them. Wanted to take a walk with his Luger. Not that he could walk, but that was the expression.

I-1000 didn't come soon enough for my father. He went out hard. Sucks, but what can you do?

If/when I lose my faculties, I EXPECT my son to remove my firearms. It's part of the deal. Fortunately, I won't be a drunken asshole about it, so he'll have an easier time of it.

[Mopar151]

32. It's not all that simple

Pistols can be hidden... And if you are worried that someone is stealing from you, the first thing you do is hide the valuables - the most valuable of which is a gun, to protect the valuables. And if some do-gooder, like your useless pinko son, tells you it'll be OK, nobody's stealing anything, but it's time to take all the guns - he's probably the one wants to steal the guns, so you better hide a couple just to be sure....
Worse, all his gunnin' pals at Fox, the NRA, and down at the Dunk 'n Dine have been telling him for years that somebody is coming for his guns, and he better be ready...

[SheilaT]

48. Well then, isn't it obvious that

you get *your* hands on the guns, get them away from the person with dementia.

First off, in my humble opinion, is to TAKE THE GUNS AWAY. I'm so incredibly sick of all the gun apologists out there. "Gee, I thought my dad who's well into his 90's and who has Alzheimer's wouldn't even think of going for the guns" and bullshit like that.

Responsible gun ownership. I'm beginning to conclude that there simply is no such thing as "responsible" gun ownership. Every single freaking gun out there is available to a child, to a son with some kind of craziness, to a parent with dementia. When will everyone finally wake up to the fact that it's the guns, pure and simple. Take the guns away and the terrible things won't happen.

Don't give me BS about "pistols can be hidden". Was it a total surprise that the elderly dad with dementia had pistols? I doubt it.

Every single time a child gets a gun and shoots himself or someone else, it was a "responsible" gun owner. Well spare me the breast beating. I've come to the conclusion that the only responsible gun owner is one who has no guns.

Otherwise, if the OP's father had killed the caretaker, too many here on DU and elsewhere would be lamenting the "tragedy". Tragedy my flaming ass. The very having of guns is a tragedy. Not having the good sense to take them away from the person who is descending into dementia is sheer carelessness, maybe even indictable negligence. Stop with the sorrowful "Oh, what a sad accident" crap. Take the fucking guns away in the first place.

[nightscanner59]

58. Actually, syntax error on my part now corrected in OP. See response # 52.

Also: This is just the rude awakening that triggered the massive response as posted. This is the first official documentable dementia episode and now, official diagnosis. We, as a family, only now have the right to intervene fully.
Yes, old folks are on this verge all over this country, ready to snap--- that's what this post is all about, a warning shot if you will, Sheila! Yes, gun was clandestine, dad did have a bedroom safe and gun was probably inside it as it has never been found before by housekeepers or previous caretaker. It's a wonder his old crippled hands got the combo and opened the thing. The have been mostly and remarkably autonomous and responsible. So minus previous minor incidents that caused hunting rifle removal sweep on me and my brother's part. As I have corrected, hunting collection was removed over a year ago and no one had business elsewhere, until now.
I don't know the whole scenario, I am 1290 miles away at contract work. Brother is in same town but was blissfully niave to remainder weapon possession. Other relatives are also less remote, but enroute. It is an emergent situation that had emergency response:.
Please do not trivialize our efforts, anything more than previous would have constituted illegal, immoral and unwarranted privacy invasion before, in the eyes of the law!
I'm not denying the situation was ready to snap, but up until now they have been responsible for self care and autonomous nothing we could do.
Note about gun safety here: NRA used to sponsor gun and hunter safety courses. I don't know, don't care anymore if they do, but it once was their primary function that got twisted into this sick mission to sell firearms for the industry and bunch of dipshits. They suck.
But there are responsible gun owners, yes. The guns are locked, unloaded and fully safe. There are also dipshit, very irresponsible "collectors" who need to be controlled, all guns removed. Hunting is a brutal neccessity to avoid an even grimmer outcome of animal overpopulation. We do have to provide for national defense in emergencies, thats why ex-military are trained.
But gun control must marry gun safety, as it once was in rural communities!!!! Once same sex marriage is passed, it will be allowed again. NRA caught fucking ALZHEIMERS and went nuts, just as Jim Carrey has so beautifully expressed. The timing of my event here is just uncanny.
Let's twist their phrase to the actual truth here:
"When guns are illegal (ly owned by the demented, the unlicensed, the un-background-checked, the irresponsible) then only criminals will own the guns"
NRA must be dismantled, and gun safety laws passed.
What my dad did was criminal, but no handcuffs required, gun removed and never again to be seen by him.

[nightscanner59]

60. This is not helpful nor are you fully cognizant of the situation here. You are snap judging.

Please discontinue posting here.

[SheilaT]

73. Snap judgment?

I guess it's a snap judgment that way too many people have access to guns who shouldn't have such access. And every single person out there who is aware that there are guns in the home of an aging parent should read the OP, as well as his reply (#58) to me as a huge wake-up call.

Hardly anyone actually needs a gun. For all of the claims that it provides safety, let's review again how many thousands of people are killed every year by guns. What is the multiple of that number that are those wounded or maimed by guns? The sheer presence of guns in the household are incredibly dangerous, regardless of the ages of household members or their emotional or intellectual status.

No one should be terribly surprised every time some innocent is shot, or even threatened by a gun. Far too many people think it's a trivial price to pay. I don't. I think it's a terrible price to pay.

And I think I am entitled to continue posting here, thank you very much for your concern.

[mahina]

78. Word.

Good luck with the whole situation.

[mahina]

77. I hope you are better to the people around you in real life.

You must really be a ray of sunshine.

This person is dealing with an evolving situation and is taking responsibility.

I've lost a dear friend to gun violence, and dealt with a family member slipping into dementia.

The smugness and arrogance in your posts are astonishing. Judgmental and insensitive? Just a bit. Bye now.

[nightscanner59]

52. Oh, correction as follows. There was a previous non-gun "incident", and brother removed

the hunting rifle rack and ammo removed to storage over a year ago. Police uninvolved then. Pistol was clandestine since until the other day this happened. Sorry, plurality was inaccurate, I'm a little PTSD'd from unrelated mugging and head injury incident and sometimes not altogether clear headed. Ironically, it's what left me placidly able to handle dad.
One pistol and one machete was confiscated, that I know of. I'll ask my brother.
But, I'm assured house now has been thoroughly searched and anything left of weapons grade is gone.
Gun safety note to be made here though, yes. This marks first incident to officially diagnose dad. Exactly what this is posted here, for! Poster child-- albeit 93 year old one-- against the Hestonesque!!!!

[nightscanner59]

57. Actually, syntax error on my part to be corrected. See response # 52.

[nightscanner59]

59. Yes, first official diagnosis and recognition of a defined problem here Sheila. See response #52.

And don't twist this into blaming the victim. They are not really upset, just damn surprised, and done there. We have given them a settlement and they are fine. They are freinds and want to help. You are not helping.

[enough]

15. The problem of firearms in the house with Alzheimer's/dementia sufferers

is a major issue, even more serious than the problem with driving and when to take away the keys and/or the car. This problem comes up over and over with people who are taking care of dementia folks. There is a tremendous amount of suffering and difficulty created by the presence of firearms in the house with people who are entering into the world of Alzheimer's/dementia.

The problem is that, as with the car, the gun is a major symbol of autonomy and power, the one thing the person who is descending into dementia cannot stand to let go of.

Every family has to go through this terrible time when they have to acknowledge that the person can no longer be seen as a self-determining adult. This is such a wrenching moment for everyone, that often the family cannot make the decision.

So terribly sorry this is happening to you and your family. Are you sure there is no other way besides giving up the entire structure of your life to deal with it?

As someone who has been through years of this, I seriously advise you to sign up and log into the Alzheimer's Association Caregivers Forum.

https://www.alzconnected.org/signup.aspx

This is where people who are actually in the trenches talk 24/7 about the reality of dealing with this awful disease in your family. No happy talk. I literally would not have made it through without this forum. You will find real information and real understanding.

Dear nightscanner, I wish you well.

[rdharma]

18. How true!

One symptom of Alzheimer's/dementia is extreme paranoia.

My elderly father with dementia wanted to grab his gatt when he thought "robbers" were in his driveway. Fortunately..... he couldn't remember where he had his gatt hidden.

I'm not exaggerating!

[enough]

22. Yes, with Alz/dementia there is no way to exaggerate! Nothing can be

as heart rending and mind-blowing (not to mention exhausting and depressing) as dealing with Alzheimer's Disease.

I remember when my father's doctor first told me he thought my father had Alzheimer's. The doctor was behaving as if he had told me my father was just about to die. I was thinking, oh well, how bad can it be? I had no idea we were just starting out on a long long and very strange trip.

And you're right. Extreme paranoia is front and center, until it gets so bad that there's no mind left to be paranoid. It actually gets easier in the later stages.

[rdharma]

23. "until it gets so bad that there's no mind left"

I know what you mean.

[wordpix]

37. that's where my mom is, still going with no mind

[rdharma]

40. It's so sad.

They're gone...... but they aren't.

[AtheistCrusader]

33. I beleive it.

My dad's issues were slightly different, but just as bad.

I don't intend to leave such a mess. There are legal options now, when my time comes. But you never know. When you get to that threshold, and your mind starts to go, you can't guarantee that you will carry out your old resolutions...

[enough]

42. I think this is the big problem. One can leave all kinds of directives

and have all sorts of plans. But when dementia takes over, one no longer has the competence or understanding to know what has to be done or to do it. Yet I know of no legal way to write a directive that asks for euthanasia to be carried out when one has reached a certain stage. Many times the person is totally healthy in body, so it's not a medical emergency at all.

I think almost anyone who has cared for a dementia sufferer would like to have a way to say: "When I reach this certain point, I want to opt for assisted suicide." I don't think there is any way to do this legally. It may be that the coming Alzheimer's tsunami will change society's attitude, but probably not fast enough.

The fact is, the only way to do it will be to commit suicide immediately when you get the first sign that it's happening. But how will you KNOW for sure? A horrible dilemma.

[AtheistCrusader]

45. Especially with human perception problems like normalcy bias.

A gradual decline doesn't necessarily have any clear 'turning points'...

I do my best to plan, but there's always the best laid plans of mice and men... ending up about equal.

[nightscanner59]

62. Onset was recognized but gradual, and only by family. Alheimer's Dx since tuesday now, officially.

But this is a warning blog as well as social commentary. The timing is uncanny. Before your parents symptoms get bad, have that heart to heart about the guns. When someone has it with me, I will sell my hunting camp. I have a few years left and my guns are safe.

[nightscanner59]

54. I've been prepared for this eventuality for some time, actually. Thank you for link.

It still sucks, but I do possess the resources, resolve, medical experience and ways around dad that my family has no clue of. Just to assure you: Travel CT tech here, and I've worked with countless demented patients in over 15 hospitals for 22 years, never met one I couldn't easily, safely subdue and eventually scan. Only the young ones have ever had to be sedated.
I feed him q2-3h, and he drifts off most of the day. Watches FOX, can't comprehend any of it anymore. Now he does not even cogitate the channel change. However:
I have had to safely physically restrain him until he slept again before, on previous visit, see further. I can usually just distract him away when I see a spell coming. If I don't: He is 93 now, weak as a kitten, very little to almost no "force" required to quell his outbursts. He combats the pillow protection with all the fierceness a fly can muster, no harm done. He's mostly frozen with arthritis, "handle with extreme care" stamped on. Mom witnessed the outbursts, approved and agreed, glad for my protection and would scoff at his demands to dial the police. Soonafter, he drifts off and remembers nothing of it. As he is worse now, reportedly he drops within a minute of agitation. She has been injured by him though and is safehoused until I arrive.
No, there are no highly reasonable alternatives for this case, I have to go. I am uniquely qualified to "handle" him. There were only a couple of these outbursts upon previous visit, just over a year ago. He mostly just hurls insults and expletives now during.
BTW, doc involved will have no problem with my medicating him pro re nata as well.

[enough]

76. He and your whole family are lucky to have you to step in with

so much knowledge and experience. Your long experience will probably protect you from the feeling of having at some point stepped into a nightmare horror story. It took me a year or two after both my parents died before I realizing how deeply I had gone down into a psychological worm-hole after dealing with two parents' dementia without knowing in advance anything about what was coming.

The upside (I see now) is that in Townshend's immortal words, "sickness will surely take the mind where minds don't usually go." After the fact, it does seem like an amazing journey. At the time, it seemed like hell.

[freshwest]

16. Sorry to hear that you are giving up your job to do this - but it's the right thing to do.

Take care of your health as best as you can - you'll never get it back - many caregivers develop serious illnesses. Let us know how it goes for you.

((((hugs))))

[xfundy]

17. That's what I thought. Till I did it.

Sociopathic True Christian™ sister tried to convince my dad I was stealing from him, when in reality she was stealing from both my parents as well as me, even as my mother lay dying w/dementia/ALZ.

She went out of her way trying to make life hell for me as well as him, manipulated him as she'd always done, and if he didn't go along with her screamed demands (to be "in charge" of his bank accounts, among other things) she'd scream even louder.

He was scared of the B and usually said yes just to shut her the hell up. She knew she could manipulate me if she upset him, and did so at every opportunity.

I lost everything while trying to do the right thing. I don't recommend it, especially at your age, especially if you have siblings. Money, possibility of inheritance, etc., does strange things within families. I'd never have believed my hateful pig sister could be so heartless and vindictive till I saw it for myself.

I don't usually come back to my posts, so if you (anyone) want me to read your opinion on my post, DUmail me.

Thx.

[freshwest]

19. Since you don't come back, I won't respond to you. My comment was to the OP.

[rdharma]

20. xfundy, true post!

I've personally witnessed this type of thing.

[peace13]

21. If your father has Alzheimer's a travel trailer won't help you.

Those folks roam all night. My sister is in a special care unit and everything and anything goes on there. You will still need caregivers if you expect to get any sleep at all. This disease is tenacious. You may want to rethink your plan unless you have others who will be helping. Even if you have help it will require massive amounts of patience and energy.

Best wishes to you. I am sorry that you are faced with this! We are four years into it with caregivers, assisted living and Hospice and at times I am still overwhelmed.

[AtheistCrusader]

34. Every case is different. Some do, some don't.

Certainly a risk to keep in mind though.

[nightscanner59]

61. Just answered email to brother with suggestion of GPS. matter under consideration. But:

Dad is hardly physically capable of getting himself around the house, past the driveway highly improbable. A fortunate albeit painful limitation on his part. Even the gun probably was not that serious a threat, I now understand, dad was subdued before barrel even pointed to anyone. It just appeared in his outbursts.

[Hoyt]

24. Sorry. Had to take guns away from my FIL some time ago.

Dementia and hallucinations. He had like 50 years in military and police. He didn't like it, but it passed.

Good luck.

[Iwillnevergiveup]

25. This is the stuff nightmares are made of, truly

It might help a bit if medical professionals asked Alzheimer patients' families if there are firearms in the home and insist they be removed. Just a hunch: there are thousands of (un)locked and loaded weapons in the hands of ALZ/dementia folks.

[ReRe]

26. Lewis Black says...

..."Fuckity-fuck-fucks!" Let me get this straight. You dad has Alzheimer's. Has a caretaker. And a gun. Wait, a GUN? WTF was your dad doing with a gun? It was his? Your dad should NOT have had access to a gun. OK, what's done is done. Thank god he didn't hurt anyone with it.

First, leave the cat food in the cabinet. Is your father ambulatory? Or is he wheelchair bound at this point? Do you have any siblings? If so, have an emergency meeting tomorrow night or no later than this weekend, even if it has to be via conference call. You didn't already quit your job and move there did you? I can give you some guidance if you want it. I was in the same position when I had to be my Mom's caretaker the last two years of her life. RRe

[nightscanner59]

66. I am 1290 miles away. Brothers have responded, more relatives enroute for temporary care.

Also, I have made correction to O.P. about the leftover gun-- one. See post #52. Alzheimers only now official, due to this incident. It crept up albeit anticipated. Overwhelming emergency response is coming from closer and less occupied relatives for now, I take the helm in six weeks. Meetings done long before posting here, decisions as were planned long ago.
This is just a timely blog. And a warning for people with similar conundri. (conundrums?)

[ReRe]

69. OK...

...I can stop worrying about you then.

[sheshe2]

27. I am sorry, nightscanner, and I feel your pain.

We tried, my sister and I to home care my dad, Alzheimer's and Dementia. He will be 92 in another month.I worked full time my sister part time. She housed him.

I spent 24 hours a week caring for my dad on top of my job. It was hard and nearly destroyed us. He showed no harm to anyone other than himself, that was a history for him.

I do not know what state you live in, however in Massachusetts we were able to find my dad a nursing home. He was suicidal, we could no longer protect him.

My sister did the research, exhaustive research, however she found help. There must be something out there for you. I sincerely hope there is.

I wish you the best it won't be easy.

So very sorry.

sheshe

[zonkers]

29. Hang tough. You are a solid dude for doing this.

[patrice]

31. +1!

[Spitfire of ATJ]

38. You have another option...

There are places that will care for him with a combination of his check and other services like housing.

Of course that will mean he will become dependent on the government.

[nightscanner59]

63. Considered, rejected.

He has special needs best served by family now. He accepts directives from us far easier except when confused and combative, and still calms far quicker with my brother than with any "stranger". He... is regressed as a baby when this happens... and "cries himself to sleep" with nonsense spitting, cursing and combativeness. Large pillows are handy to restrain, and little to actually no force one keeps him in soft chair, no danger to self or others. We are lucky his frail, arthritic frame can pose no serious threat now as disarmed.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

72. Do him a favor and turn off FOX "News".

[nightscanner59]

75. First nap of the day, channel gets switched, and he fails to even notice, per brother.

[loudsue]

39. Gawd nightscanner59, I'm really sorry.

I know it is not only infuriating, but it's so close to home. Your feelings of having to protect someone (anyone) who is so helpless, and the emotional gut-kick of it being your own father. AND the history that always comes along with that. It is an extremely difficult, but actually familiar to many, experience to go through. Been there, dunnit.

Sending you and your family a big hug and just hope like hell there are enough people around to give you more of 'em.

[nightscanner59]

74. Thanx, Sue, part of my unique ability to deal with dad neccessitates this.

[rightsideout]

41. Yikes!

My dad is just as crazy and doesn't own a gun (fortunately for us) and doesn't have Alheimers or Dementia. He's just plain mean and a jerk and I think a binge drinker. He's 76.

When I dropped by my parents house this past October he offered me a beer in the carport then launched into an angry tirade about my support for Obama and insisted I bet him $20 on the election. I had never told him who I was voting for but he knows I'm a Liberal. But he was yelling at the top of his lungs on how much he hated Obama. I was shocked at the ambush and his anger. I couldn't get a word in edge wise. I finally had enough and tossed my beer back at him and walked back to my car with my mom following behind me apologizing. She said he had been drinking the whole day before I arrived.

Last week he launched into another angry tirade at a restaurant after my son told him he was going out for football. He was yelling so loud everyone was looking around to see what was going on. Everyone in my family told him to calm down because he was causing a scene but he kept yelling louder. My son was almost in tears. Every time my mom told him to quiet it down he punched her in the arm. I started going back at him and said his anger was out of control and he better stop putting down his grandson. He hit me once in the arm then my wife tried to get him to stop yelling and to listen to what we had to say. He finally got up and stormed off to his car.

I haven't talked to him since. I'm pretty sure he doesn't have a gun but if he did I'm sure my mom or me would be killed by now since the man's temper is out of control.

At another restaurant gathering for my birthday in September my son had told my dad he was wanted to join the military and my dad went into another anger fit. Not as bad but he kept telling my son he didn't know what he was talking about.

He's been constantly putting me and my son down for the past year. I've finally had enough of his BS and can't see him again even though he's 5 miles away. My mom has been calling and coming over since I won't go back to their house. It's not fair to her since she's in her 80s and has to put up with his BS. She's actually talked about having him arrested or reporting him for abuse. She heard in our county he could be put away for six months for abuse. It's not so much physical abuse as it is mental abuse.

I've finally had it with the man. Our family is so angry at him we've been considering changing our names since both my son and I took his name. My son is the 4th and I'm the 3rd. Both my dad's parents were mean jerks. My Grandmother was constantly putting people down.

Not sure why these people get so angry as they get older. I hope not to end up like him.

[enough]

43. Dear rightsideout, your father sounds a lot like mine. For many years

we assumed that his problem that he was a lifelong drunk, and an angry asshole drunk at that. When he finally got the diagnosis of Alzheihmer's/dementia, the doctor couldn't believe how far along into the disease he was. The alcohol symptoms masked the dementia. The explosive hair-trigger anger and paranoia are classic dementia symptoms.

There's only one hopeful thing I can tell you. Once he got the diagnosis, he also got some medication (Seroquel). As soon as he started taking the medication, he LOST ALL INTEREST IN BOOZE. This is a man who had been drinking steadily and heavily for 65 years. Alcohol defined his life and the life of his family. Literally the day he took the first pill he never had another drink and never had the slightest interest in having a drink. He never even mentioned it again, even if other people were drinking around him. I've wondered many times what would have happened if he'd gotten some medication earlier in his life.

[nightscanner59]

64. Different problem, but similar exchanges with my dad just over a year ago.

Of the "you damn liberal" variety, but no more cognizant defense or reason for his stance, as are most "conservatives". I'm lucky for no alcoholism in the family, that would have made this worse and probably the disease would have progressed to it's current state 20 years ago if so. Dad would have been a serious threat if that were the case. They have lived clean living diets and never let religion bother them. These are the circumstances that make this situation manageable, albeit painfully so for us, as family.

[nightscanner59]

65. I hope maybe some intervention organization can help. Anyone have suggestions for rightsideout?

Adult Protective Services sounds like might have to intervene to protect your mom.

[snot]

44. I think if you have to move in with him to care for him, you should get to choose the news channel.

[nightscanner59]

67. First nap of the day, channel gets switched, and he fails to even notice, per brother.

[pacalo]

46. Before quitting your job & relocating, look into this:

http://www.medicare.gov/HomeHealthCompare/search.aspx?version=default&browser=IE%257C6%257CWinXP&language=English&defaultstatus=0&pagelist=Home&CookiesEnabledStatus=True&AspxAutoDetectCookieSupport=1

http://www.communityresourcefinder.org/

I wish you the best, nightscanner.

[nightscanner59]

68. Thank you Pacalo

This was predetermined response, I have this as somewhat an obligation, and uniquely situated to take over in six weeks. I will look into these for sure, but as far as other housing, unneccessary, expensive and I'm looking forward to gardening during his naps.
There is a bright side to this, actually.

[Warpy]

47. My mother had dementia related more to sensory deprivation

and could be pulled into the present if she needed to be, so I can't speak to the Alzheimer's component except to suggest medications to decrease your dad's potential violence.

I know when my dad finally yelled for help with my mother, I just looked at my self in the mirror and told myself my life was going to suck for a few years no matter what else happened.

And it did.

Now that they're both gone, I miss them terribly. I wanted them to live forever, just not like that.

Still, they had no guns to get rid of. I couldn't even find the air pistol my dad and I used to trade shots with, plinking his empties in a lake.

Good for you to standing up to gun hysterics who don't realize there are often compelling and excellent reasons to clean the guns out of someone's home.

Alzheimer's is close to the top of the list.

(If I had money to spare, I'd send the caregiver a bonus, something for combat pay)

[nightscanner59]

71. Yes, caregiver will be compensated. Kudos to Jim Carrey's timing of his wonderful and timely song.

He holds no grudge, just does not want to continue, had enough. He's a family friend. In his own words, dad drove him bonkers and that just marked time to go. He's been given an apartment at my brothers building and look forward to visiting with him as well.

[FJones3777]

79. Ban Metal Bullets And Only Allow Rubber Bullets

This type of bill is a lot more likely to be passed as it would stop people being killed when they were shot (they would just be knocked unconscious instead) AND it would still keep the 2nd Amendment in place. Please sign my Petition on the White House website at: http://wh.gov/lu4Wi

[Sancho]

80. Here we go again....so here's my generic response:

People Control, Not Gun Control

This is my generic response to gun threads. For the record, I grew up in the South and on military bases. I was taught about firearms as a child, and I grew up hunting, was a member of the NRA, and I still own guns. In the 70’s, I dropped out of the NRA because they become more radical and less interested in safety and training. Some personal experiences where people I know were involved in shootings caused me to realize that anyone could obtain and posses a gun no matter how illogical it was for them to have a gun. Also, easy access to more powerful guns, guns in the hands of children, and guns that weren’t secured are out of control in our society. As such, here’s what I now think ought to be the requirements to possess a gun. I’m not debating the legal language, I just think it’s the reasonable way to stop the shootings. Notice, none of this restricts the type of guns sold. This is aimed at the people who shoot others, because it’s clear that they should never have had a gun.

1.) Anyone in possession of a gun (whether they own it or not) should have a regularly renewed license. If you want to call it a permit, certificate, or something else that's fine.
2.) To get a license, you should have a background check, and be examined by a professional for emotional and mental stability appropriate for gun possession. It might be appropriate to require that examination to be accompanied by references from family, friends, employers, etc. This check is not to subject you to a mental health diagnosis, just check on your superficial and apparent gun-worthyness.
3.) To get the license, you should be required to take a safety course and pass a test appropriate to the type of gun you want to use.
4.) To get a license, you should be over 21. Under 21, you could only use a gun under direct supervision of a licensed person and after obtaining a learner’s license. Your license might be restricted if you have children or criminals or other unsafe people living in your home. (If you want to argue 18 or 25 or some other age, fine. 21 makes sense to me.)
5.) If you possess a gun, you would have to carry a liability insurance policy specifically for gun ownership - and likely you would have to provide proof of appropriate storage, security, and whatever statistical reasons that emerge that would drive the costs and ability to get insurance.
6.) You could not purchase a gun or ammunition without a license, and purchases would have a waiting period.
7.) If you possess a gun without a license, you go to jail, the gun is impounded, and a judge will have to let you go (just like a DUI).
8.) No one should carry an unsecured gun (except in a locked case, unloaded) when outside of home. Guns should be secure when transporting to a shooting event without demonstrating a special need. Their license should indicate training and special circumstances beyond recreational shooting (security guard, etc.).
9.) If you buy, sell, give away, or inherit a gun, your license information should be recorded.
10.) If you accidentally discharge your gun, commit a crime, get referred by a mental health professional, are served a restraining order, etc., you should lose your license and guns until reinstated by a serious relicensing process.

Most of you know that a license is no big deal. Besides a driver’s license you need a license to fish, rent scuba equipment, operate a boat, or many other activities. I realize these differ by state, but that is not a reason to let anyone without a bit of sense pack a semiautomatic weapon in public, on the roads, and in schools. I think we need to make it much harder for some people to have guns.