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In reply to the discussion: Add my "what went wrong" take to the pile [View all]summer_in_TX
(3,351 posts)116. Read a great thread by a Brit about the analogies to Brexit on Twitter today.
It gave me a degree of hope.
Link to tweet
Thread
Tom Bacon
@TomABacon
As a Brit, I've been watching the American election results with sorrow for my American friends. Some are comparing it to the Brexit vote here, imagining if we'd voted for Brexit twice. But here's the thing... in a sense, we did. And here are some lessons from it. 🧵
First, an explanation: The U.K. chose Brexit in a referendum in 2016. But Brexit did not become truly inevitable until 2019, when the country doubled down on this decision and gave Boris Johnson a massive 80+-seat parliamentary majority. /2
In context: our parliamentary system gives someone with an 80+-seat majority in parliament pretty much unlimited power. Their only real opposition comes from their own side. /3
But the Johnson government got almost nothing done. Why? Well, to be fair, partly it was due to unforeseen circumstances: a global pandemic. But it was also partly because of Johnson himself. /4
Johnson liked power in theory, but had no real interest in what to do with it other than serve his own interests. He ran Downing Street like an old Medieval court, where people vied for his patronage. /5
Policy agendas were pursued as long as one person was up, and then dropped as soon as they were down. Johnson's attention moved from one thing to another, lacking any real direction. /6
You can probably see the parallels here, and hopefully see why I'm drawing some of this out. Trump is Johnson multiplied by a factor of ten or more. Do NOT expect a coherent agenda. /7
I'm well aware of Project 2025 and the like. But here's the thing: Trump isn't interested in the Project 2025 agenda. He's interested in the Trump agenda. He doesn't want to be managed or controlled. /8
Did you see how the election changed tone over the last few weeks, when he got bored of being kept under control and in check. You really think he'll sign up to somebody else's agenda? Or at least... sign up to it for long? /9
Trump will run his White House like a Medieval court. He'll pursue an agenda for only so long, until he either loses focus... or somebody else catches his attention and he pursues their agenda instead. /10
Does this mean Trump's government will do no damage? No. But it does mean the damage it does will be scattershot, rather than the focused agenda seen in Project 2025. I don't know how far it'll get - I pray not far. /11
And there's a second factor to consider: events, dear boy, events. We have the misfortune of living in "interesting times." For Johnson, the unforeseen event was a global pandemic. What will Trump's events be? /12
And make no mistake: there WILL be events. There are people all over the world eager to take advantage of the opportunity they've been given now - a chance to cause yet more chaos. /13
Here in the UK, we saw what happens when a clown has turned government into a circus at a time when you need actual government. That, I'm afraid, is what America is about to experience too. /14
I don't know whether all this will give you relief or leave you even more stressed. But here's the thing to remember: Boris Johnson's government failed. It did so largely because of the character of the man in charge. /15
Likewise: My strong suspicion is that Donald Trump's government will fail. It will do so largely because of the character of the man in charge. /16
Don't expect to ever be able to say "I told you so" to Trump voters, incidentally. The goal isn't to be proved right; it's to win them over. "I told you so" causes people to dig in. So spend time listening and engaging. /17
Figure out how to WIN them, how to persuade them, how to play to their interests. Here in the U.K., Keir Starmer managed a remarkable feat in winning a strong majority through smart strategy. Do your own version. Engage. Persuade. Win. /18
In 2019, I was crushed. A British government with a parliamentary majority of 80+ should've been unassailable. The constitutional reforms the Tories were proposing should've cemented them in power for a decade more. /19
Likewise, right now, you feel crushed. Donald Trump and the Republican agenda seems unassailable. The constitutional reforms the Republicans are proposing have the potential to cement them in power for a long, long time. /20
But it's not over, because not all of it will happen. There will be a lot of damage, and it will take a very long time to repair the damage. Here, it'll probably take a decade or more. I'm afraid I suspect it'll take you longer still. /21
Don't give up. For now? My prayers are with America. I'm sorry for what you're about to go through, and I wish I could do something to help. Just know it's never too late - not in a democracy. /end
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Rove was also author Redmap, the Republican Party plan to use gerrymandering for permanent control of government.
Lonestarblue
Nov 7
#64
I definitely agree that curated spaces and echo chambers have contributed to her loss.
orange jar
Nov 7
#6
& it's reached almost insurmountable proportions. According to canvassers, the misinformation this election was insane,
Native
Nov 7
#18
I don't know about that. A lot of people are saying it's pandered too much to the left/progressives of the party.
Native
Nov 7
#29
sure, i cant remember them all, but one for sure that was mentioned was the transgender surgeries for inmates.
Native
Nov 7
#93
She REALLY should have hit-back on the transgender "prison surgery" thing,
Jack Valentino
Nov 8
#134
When Biden made sure they got COVID relief funds, he should have put his name on it like Trump did.
summer_in_TX
Nov 8
#119
Those differences in voting by income are all small. It's not a big factor.
muriel_volestrangler
Nov 8
#123
I think the income voting differences are mostly related to education (which trends to result in higher income),
deurbano
Nov 8
#145
The signs were there. Biden has been a great president. The economy is doing great. Yet most people don't agree.
Doodley
Nov 7
#8
I'm sure it did. It was an important part of their campaign. Our household of two received a dozen direct mail
Doodley
Nov 7
#15
If a supernatural being saved Trump from death, it was LUCIFER and not God.
Jack Valentino
Nov 8
#136
And yet, the Dems didn't continually publish the positive news, buy ads, etc. That's on us.
SharonAnn
Nov 7
#17
Good point. Trump maximized the racist, homophobic, transphobic, mysogynist vote. Kamala had to overcome that.
Doodley
Nov 7
#13
Along those same lines people expected prices to actually drop to pre-Covid levels
groundloop
Nov 7
#38
Finally, someone explaining how targeting works. We're an old group and very defensive to boot. Explanations like this
Native
Nov 7
#16
If no one's told you lately that you're a genius, EarlG, elbow them in the ribs (gently but definitely).
jaxexpat
Nov 7
#19
Earl, what about a small siloed section of DU where the rules are relaxed somewhat?
intrepidity
Nov 8
#160
We just got some stunning family news from some in-laws: almost the whole younger gen voted Trump
Hekate
Nov 7
#33
My Wife and I have been discussing this exactly as you have described for a couple of days now. I agree completely with
marked50
Nov 7
#46
The TOP (Trump's Oleaginous Party) can't help but fuck with Social Security and Obamacare.
LudwigPastorius
Nov 7
#49
I agree with your analysis. I still believe that racism and sexism played a role but so did social media
tulipsandroses
Nov 7
#54
For me, to break through the information bubble, it came down to critical thinking (education)
ffr
Nov 7
#59
I agree, EarlG. I've seen discussions of this on Twitter. From Asha Rangappa this morning:
highplainsdem
Nov 7
#85
Thought-provoking OP. I still think we've got a lot of folks who just won't vote for a woman,
TBF
Nov 7
#87
Read a great thread by a Brit about the analogies to Brexit on Twitter today.
summer_in_TX
Nov 8
#116
The incremental, stealth takeover by oligarchs is now open and in its final race to the finish line.
Hermit-The-Prog
Nov 8
#117
All incumbents across the world have lost vote share. The Biden to Harris loss was one of the smallest.
muriel_volestrangler
Nov 8
#124
"Algorithmic microtargeting". Yes. The microtargeting supports Inconsistent views and helps to dissuade real-life convos
lostnfound
Nov 8
#125
If buyer's remorse doesn't set in over the next 4 years for a significant number of people who voted for Trump,
Martin68
Nov 8
#139
People here keep thinking we'll have free and fair elections that will be winnable in 2026 and 2028.
Efilroft Sul
Nov 8
#140
We're in for scary times, and the old rules -- the old laws -- won't necessarily be applicable any more.
Efilroft Sul
Nov 8
#147
YES. We hit 1% with volunteers once in 6 months. They hit 90% twice a day -- at least.
Festivito
Nov 8
#148
Mis and disinformation coupled with lack of perspective is huge. But this was a change election.
andym
Nov 8
#150
A tech perspective. Great points. It seems like an application of the Facebook effect in 2016
underpants
Nov 8
#152
People almost always bleme the Executive branch for their troubles and complaints.
Ping Tung
Nov 8
#156
I just had a technician tell me Trump would stop the wars because he was strong
True Blue American
Nov 20
#165