Israel/Palestine

FBaggins

(27,720 posts)

31. “A real antisemite doesn’t just hate the Jews in Israel”: Ken Livingstone’s extraordinary definition

Fri May 6, 2016, 09:46 AM

May 2016

But his definition of antisemitism was the most telling remark:

“Blurring these two things [criticising Israel and being antisemitic] undermines the real importance of antisemitism, because a real antisemite doesn't just hate the Jews in Israel, they hate their Jewish neighbour in Golders Green or in Stoke Newington. It's a physical loathing.”

It is the use of the word “just” – as if hating Israeli Jews is excusable, or at least unimportant – that has outraged viewers. As some Labour activists have pointed out, when they protest against the Israeli government, it is about the treatment of Palestinians – not about attacking the Jews in Israel.

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/staggers/2016/04/real-antisemite-doesn-t-just-hate-jews-israel-ken-livingstone-s

Of course... today I learned that he has his own version of "some of my best friends are black". He can't be anti-Semitic because he once slept with a couple of them.

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Legitimate criticism of Israel is not anti-Semitism [View all] Little Tich May 2016 OP

Some of this I agree with aranthus May 2016 #1

For the record aranthus May 2016 #2

I believe that Israel doesn't have the right to exist as a Jewish state, Little Tich May 2016 #7

This message was self-deleted by its author 6chars May 2016 #8

I believe that no ethnic group should be allowed to create a state and discriminate against other Little Tich May 2016 #9

This message was self-deleted by its author 6chars May 2016 #11

Frankly, I think that liberal democracy is the only viable form of government. Little Tich May 2016 #12

Really? So what is your side doing to promote Palestinian liberal democratic values? shira May 2016 #14

You're really barking up the wrong tree. n/t Little Tich May 2016 #25

Not at all. If you truly want a liberal democratic 1-state solution, prove it... shira May 2016 #33

Wrong tree. Little Tich May 2016 #41

Without a state and strong Jewish army King_David May 2016 #20

It's this indifference to the safety of Jews worldwide that's telling... shira May 2016 #34

Israel already guarantees equal rights for all its citizens despite the fiction you're selling. n/t shira May 2016 #15

Read this OP and comment on it please... shira May 2016 #13

Of course it isn't FBaggins May 2016 #3

Comparing Israel to Nazi Germany is pure antisemitism. shira May 2016 #5

The quote that really gets me: FBaggins May 2016 #6

It's an irrational hatred so the lie that he's never once heard anyone say anything antisemitic.... shira May 2016 #52

Typical anti-Zionist trash. The OP writer is part of the problem... shira May 2016 #4

I put up the OP because it reflects my own beliefs on anti-Semitism to a great degree. Little Tich May 2016 #10

Yes, you believe you know better what antisemitism & zionism is than Jews. shira May 2016 #16

Ah, so Alan Johnson was just another pro-Israel shill after all... Little Tich May 2016 #19

See, it's hard to argue Alan Johnson is wrong when he distinguishes.... shira May 2016 #22

I've realized that Alan Johnson never mentions what he believes constitutes legitimate criticism of Little Tich May 2016 #27

In post #4, I wrote before the video that at 1:08 into it Johnson distinguishes... shira May 2016 #32

Did you watch the video? Still don't know the difference b/w legit criticism & demonisation? n/t shira May 2016 #43

I seem to struggle with that particular clip, but why don't you enlighten me? Little Tich May 2016 #44

I thought you saw it. Here's another link... shira May 2016 #45

So there's no illegitimate criticism of Israel whatsoever on DU then? Little Tich May 2016 #46

Calling Israel a Nazi, Apartheid state or calling for the forced transfer of Israel's Jews... shira May 2016 #47

I think that there is a difference in how we define the motivations for the examples you mentioned. Little Tich May 2016 #48

The worst critics of Israel spew out most or all of those examples constantly.... shira May 2016 #50

I'm going to jump this thread. Little Tich May 2016 #53

Wait - you didn't answer my last question. Let's see if what you're saying is legitimate.... shira May 2016 #54

I thought this thread was exhausted, but your question deserves an answer. Little Tich May 2016 #56

Where have you ever seen Israel's record on gay rights used to deflect criticism? shira May 2016 #57

You're exhausted because u don't want to distinguish b/w legit criticism & Jew hate? shira May 2016 #58

As to the Nazi comparison, that's Holocaust Inversion....a form of Holocaust Denial shira May 2016 #17

"Holocaust Inversion" - that's a real fancy name for a limited instance of a very common mistake in Little Tich May 2016 #21

You're giving Holocaust minimizers (deniers) a free pass to bash Jews. shira May 2016 #23

I'm not giving Livingstone a free pass - it's just that I can't go from his statement being possibly Little Tich May 2016 #24

Then perhaps you're more alike then you realize FBaggins May 2016 #26

It would of course clinch it if Livingstone would make comments that revealed that he really doesn't Little Tich May 2016 #28

You must no have read the entire interview FBaggins May 2016 #29

Source, please. n/t Little Tich May 2016 #30

“A real antisemite doesn’t just hate the Jews in Israel”: Ken Livingstone’s extraordinary definition FBaggins May 2016 #31

I'm not sure our friend agrees with what classical antisemitism.... shira May 2016 #35

Crickets. They won't admit there's a problem, ever. n/t shira May 2016 #38

Yet another bizarre statement made by a former Mayor of London. Little Tich May 2016 #40

It's all his bizarre statements & lies that prove w/o question he's a Jew hater. n/t shira May 2016 #51

You didn't answer what proof of being an antisemite would look like. shira May 2016 #36

It's actually simple - the proof must prove that a person is an anti-Semite. Little Tich May 2016 #39

How about lies that incite hatred & violence? Is that proof? n/t shira May 2016 #42

Sigh FBaggins May 2016 #18

Legitimate criticism of the PLO & Hamas is considered racist by Israel haters.... shira May 2016 #37

This message was self-deleted by its author 6chars May 2016 #49

Chilling but typical silence from the Israel hating Left. No time for reflection.... shira May 2016 #55