Religion

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)

44. Speaking of Stalin:

Sat Dec 15, 2018, 05:42 PM

Dec 2018

Hitler vs. Stalin: Who Killed More?

Timothy Snyder
March 10, 2011 Issue
Who was worse, Hitler or Stalin?
In the second half of the twentieth century, Americans were taught to see both Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union as the greatest of evils. Hitler was worse, because his regime propagated the unprecedented horror of the Holocaust, the attempt to eradicate an entire people on racial grounds. Yet Stalin was also worse, because his regime killed far, far more people, tens of millions it was often claimed, in the endless wastes of the Gulag. For decades, and even today, this confidence about the difference between the two regimes—quality versus quantity—has set the ground rules for the politics of memory. Even historians of the Holocaust generally take for granted that Stalin killed more people than Hitler, thus placing themselves under greater pressure to stress the special character of the Holocaust, since this is what made the Nazi regime worse than the Stalinist one.

https://www.nybooks.com/articles/2011/03/10/hitler-vs-stalin-who-killed-more/

War is an aspect of tribalism. And we both know that leaders can think of many reasons to start a war, but power is at the base of it.

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

98 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

Imagine a world without faith or religion. [View all] guillaumeb Dec 2018 OP

Someone beat you to this... True Dough Dec 2018 #1

I wondered who would be the first. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #2

John Lennon was a genius in his own right. MineralMan Dec 2018 #6

+1 LongtimeAZDem Dec 2018 #27

Yeah, probably best not to have gone there Major Nikon Dec 2018 #65

Yes. If your argument is refuted in a Wikipedia article, MineralMan Dec 2018 #71

Oh, the angry atheist meme Lordquinton Dec 2018 #72

No, Lennon was obviously an angry man guillaumeb Dec 2018 #79

What's the issue? Lordquinton Dec 2018 #81

I gave my opinion as to my favorite of the Beatles. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #82

And you brought up the angry atheist trope Lordquinton Dec 2018 #83

No, you claimed to find it. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #85

You repeated it even Lordquinton Dec 2018 #87

Ok, claim a victory. eom guillaumeb Dec 2018 #89

Gladly Lordquinton Dec 2018 #91

Claim another victory. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #92

What tactic is that? Lordquinton Dec 2018 #93

Can you imagine it, Guy? MineralMan Dec 2018 #3

I asked the questions of the readers. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #17

It's simple etiquette to answer your own thought questions marylandblue Dec 2018 #24

This is a common pattern here. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #43

No, you don't understand this one at all, since I did reply marylandblue Dec 2018 #45

You replied with non-answers. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #48

You didn't like my answer. I understand. marylandblue Dec 2018 #51

No faith or religion? thbobby Dec 2018 #4

you don't think slavery qazplm135 Dec 2018 #33

Since crusades and pogroms are religious in nature, I think we would not have those particular forms marylandblue Dec 2018 #35

they are religious in nature in the sense that qazplm135 Dec 2018 #36

Whataboutism and illogic. marylandblue Dec 2018 #37

Speaking of Stalin: guillaumeb Dec 2018 #44

wait a minute qazplm135 Dec 2018 #47

Post removed Post removed Dec 2018 #50

yeah no qazplm135 Dec 2018 #52

"...first of all Judaism is BOTH a religion AND an ethnicity." Adsos Letter Dec 2018 #53

Agree except qazplm135 Dec 2018 #70

Post removed Post removed Dec 2018 #55

Working out well for me. safeinOhio Dec 2018 #5

I asked some questions. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #18

I imagine a world without flamebait. Act_of_Reparation Dec 2018 #7

Not here, though. MineralMan Dec 2018 #8

Like this derivative one? guillaumeb Dec 2018 #15

You reap what you sow, Billy. Act_of_Reparation Dec 2018 #73

So what you're getting at here is that religion doesn't make us any better. trotsky Dec 2018 #9

That might have been what you read into it. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #16

China has over 4 times the population of the US with a similar land mass Major Nikon Dec 2018 #67

#Whataboutism n/t trotsky Dec 2018 #74

I asked some questions. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #19

Probably because nobody felt like taking the obvious bait LongtimeAZDem Dec 2018 #57

Bingo. trotsky Dec 2018 #76

If you think it is, guillaumeb Dec 2018 #80

Because everyone can see you posted flamebait. trotsky Dec 2018 #75

The world would be better in multiple aspects: DetlefK Dec 2018 #10

Pure imagination. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #20

HAHAHAHAHA! You are changing the topic mid-conversation! HAHAHA! DetlefK Dec 2018 #22

So we would have to press the reset button? guillaumeb Dec 2018 #78

re DetlefK Dec 2018 #84

I disagree. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #86

I said "less groupthink", not "no groupthink". DetlefK Dec 2018 #88

But it is speculation that is refuted by actual history. eom guillaumeb Dec 2018 #90

In actual history... DetlefK Dec 2018 #94

I would not and have never denied the role that religion played. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #95

In that case, yes. marylandblue Dec 2018 #25

Kinda funny how you must point to the most totalitarian examples as your proof of concept Major Nikon Dec 2018 #68

humanity's most oppressive hate group gone? oh no, then it's back to plain old msongs Dec 2018 #11

Where have you gone, Guy? MineralMan Dec 2018 #12

Hey hey hey Voltaire2 Dec 2018 #13

Oooo... MineralMan Dec 2018 #14

I posed some questions. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #21

Waitwaitwait. You just ridiculed me for speculating because you didn't like my answers. DetlefK Dec 2018 #23

Yes, but I answered another post by another person. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #38

Irrelevant. You have two contradicting opinions when talking to two different people. DetlefK Dec 2018 #61

If that's not the epitome of gaslighting Lordquinton Dec 2018 #60

There would be wars Soxfan58 Dec 2018 #26

Indeed. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #39

A world that never had religion would have people very different from ourselves marylandblue Dec 2018 #28

the irrational, the impulsive, matters of emotion and instinct qazplm135 Dec 2018 #34

Imagine the world 20 million years ago - Something like that ck4829 Dec 2018 #29

Very well said. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #40

To the contrary: It disconnects us and it imposes an horizon on us. DetlefK Dec 2018 #62

Considering that religion is Pandoris Dec 2018 #30

Welcome to DU, and this conversation. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #41

Thank you, and sure I would. Pandoris Dec 2018 #46

True. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #49

Religion and faith are not bad and are good. However many in today's churches lancelyons Dec 2018 #31

Do you really think this is a new thing? nt. Mariana Dec 2018 #32

Desire for money and power are both human behaviors. eom guillaumeb Dec 2018 #42

When was Christianity not that way? Voltaire2 Dec 2018 #69

OK Tikki Dec 2018 #54

one less thing to deal with in the morning at work. juxtaposed Dec 2018 #56

Lots of charlatans would have to get real jobs. malchickiwick Dec 2018 #58

The thought crossed my mind that if we consider other species, we might find an example. gtar100 Dec 2018 #59

I agree. guillaumeb Dec 2018 #77

I can't say "Jesus F***ing Christ" without religion Bretton Garcia Dec 2018 #63

Christianity mandated the destruction of the earth Bretton Garcia Dec 2018 #64

I suppose if one is prone to dichotomy they would be satisfied that all the answers are no Major Nikon Dec 2018 #66

A world without religion would be... old as dirt Dec 2021 #96

Agreed. eom guillaumeb Dec 2021 #97

The two videos above... old as dirt Dec 2021 #98