2016 Postmortem

Crunchy Frog

(26,984 posts)

97. I'm not claiming that there was no sexism or misogyny in 2016.

Tue Dec 6, 2016, 06:52 PM

Dec 2016

That would be ridiculous.

There was plenty of racism in 2008 and 2012, and yet Obama still managed to win both terms.

I absolutely refuse to accept the narrative being pushed, that women are fundamentally unelectable in this country.

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

134 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

What did OBAMA do differently in '08 from Hillary in 2016? [View all] yurbud Dec 2016 OP

For starters, he's just a much better public speaker n/t Stargleamer Dec 2016 #1

He was a brilliant public speaker yeoman6987 Dec 2016 #26

The "race speech" in response to the rev wright controversy bhikkhu Dec 2016 #34

Yes Chitown Kev Dec 2016 #49

yes DonCoquixote Dec 2016 #133

I've been thinking about that moment a lot recently. rogue emissary Dec 2016 #73

I wish he governed the way he campaigned. yurbud Dec 2016 #126

For starters, he was also a HE. nt ncgrits Dec 2016 #53

Having a long record is a disadvantage marylandblue Dec 2016 #2

I think you are right.. plus I think a younger president is more appealling Zing Zing Zingbah Dec 2016 #6

I disagree about younger being more appealing. Crunchy Frog Dec 2016 #71

Democrats seem to do better when they run younger candidates Zing Zing Zingbah Dec 2016 #95

Reagan got a shit load of Democrats to vote for him. Crunchy Frog Dec 2016 #100

Bill Clinton and Obama both won being relatively young Zing Zing Zingbah Dec 2016 #104

Feel free to keep your ageism. Crunchy Frog Dec 2016 #105

I'm trying to suggest something that I think will make the dems more likely to win Zing Zing Zingbah Dec 2016 #107

He is likable and she was not. He has charisma and she does not. Pisces Dec 2016 #3

Oh, piffle mcar Dec 2016 #13

Of course there is a higher standard. The first of anything has to be extraordinary. Pisces Dec 2016 #25

That might be your personal experience... Begabig Dec 2016 #56

You know Obama was the first black president, right? Goblinmonger Dec 2016 #57

Of course, there are absolutely no higher standards for African Americans... Crunchy Frog Dec 2016 #72

You genuinely believe she was as personable, charismatic and inspiring as Obama? And that people JudyM Dec 2016 #74

I did not say that mcar Dec 2016 #80

Ok so what's the distinction you're making here? Looks pretty much the same to me. JudyM Dec 2016 #82

The distinction is that I wasn't comparing one to the other mcar Dec 2016 #83

But you say it was a higher standard for her than him! That's totally making a comparison. JudyM Dec 2016 #86

Maybe Lotusflower70 Dec 2016 #101

Oh, puhleeze. LisaM Dec 2016 #27

speak for yourself. i supported Obama and i find her likable JI7 Dec 2016 #28

Exactly right... RazBerryBeret Dec 2016 #102

Be a relatively young outsider in a change election? nt geek tragedy Dec 2016 #4

He had a near-catastrophic predecessor and a country on the brink enough Dec 2016 #5

Hillary would have won pretty similar to BHO in 2008 Cosmocat Dec 2016 #14

I agree NewJeffCT Dec 2016 #64

Not convinced of that. Crunchy Frog Dec 2016 #77

She would not have won by the same margin Cosmocat Dec 2016 #87

Obama was a natural at campaigning & he had the luxury of running right after 8 yrs of Bush mtnsnake Dec 2016 #7

He was relatively new and had far less baggage PatsFan87 Dec 2016 #8

The Media hates Hillary. They "Gored" her. Va Lefty Dec 2016 #9

there is something to that. yurbud Dec 2016 #10

YEP Cosmocat Dec 2016 #15

add in the foreign influence and huge whoring for trump JI7 Dec 2016 #30

I would not say that Obama got a fair shake in 2008 NewJeffCT Dec 2016 #65

Obama WORKED for it. 87 days in Iowa at every small town dinner Dems to Win Dec 2016 #11

When Hillary took weekends off in August I was stunned. yeoman6987 Dec 2016 #31

She was sick and is 70 years old - can you cut her a little slack!?? Joe941 Dec 2016 #90

True. yeoman6987 Dec 2016 #91

This! NWCorona Dec 2016 #67

He had no expectation that it would be handed to him on a silver platter. n/t Crunchy Frog Dec 2016 #84

Obama was not beaten up in a primary. Demsrule86 Dec 2016 #12

nor by the M$M ffr Dec 2016 #16

Were we watching the same 2008 primary? PatsFan87 Dec 2016 #17

McCain even used a Hillary speech in a ad against Obama. NWCorona Dec 2016 #69

Obama took it in good humor and it kept Dems in the spotlight. yurbud Dec 2016 #18

Yes he was. He was just better at deflecting the he criticism. Exilednight Dec 2016 #43

OMG. Oh, lord. Man Goblinmonger Dec 2016 #58

Are you serious? That is a laughable statement. Hillary threw kitchen sink at Obama NWCorona Dec 2016 #68

How quickly folks forget... Begabig Dec 2016 #70

Post removed Post removed Dec 2016 #85

"Change" "Change" "Change" Bottom line. jmg257 Dec 2016 #19

Very good question, and one simple answer. Exilednight Dec 2016 #20

it reminded me of an Obama meme that sprouted up AFTER he was elected: yurbud Dec 2016 #50

So true! JudyM Dec 2016 #75

Obama followed the 50 state strategy NWCorona Dec 2016 #21

No, he really didn't. TwilightZone Dec 2016 #37

The only states that Obama didn't visit in 08 was Alaska and North Dakota NWCorona Dec 2016 #38

His first trip to NE was in 2012 for events in Iowa. TwilightZone Dec 2016 #40

Ok I see you now. NWCorona Dec 2016 #42

more accurately, he BENEFITTED from it. The brief window of control of Congress was thanks to Howard yurbud Dec 2016 #81

Post-Bush, rural outreach in purple states, pre-Shelby County v. Holder, favorable media coverage. Garrett78 Dec 2016 #22

He was running after two terms of Bush. LisaL Dec 2016 #23

2008 was after 8 years of Bush. media was better in calling out Palin JI7 Dec 2016 #24

Easiest answer ever... Mike Nelson Dec 2016 #29

He was a "fresh face" with lots of charisma. I would have voted for her in a 2008 GE, but... Buckeye_Democrat Dec 2016 #32

Simply put: Else You Are Mad Dec 2016 #33

be Fresh and New NRQ891 Dec 2016 #35

America wasn't ready for a Black President, and Hillary paid the price? stone space Dec 2016 #36

Hillary lost because Obama is black. Crunchy Frog Dec 2016 #92

OK here are my ideas hollowdweller Dec 2016 #39

excellent analysis. The WAR one can't be overstated enough yurbud Dec 2016 #78

Obama told gun owners in a town meeting that he couldn't ban "assault weapons" even if he wanted to. benEzra Dec 2016 #41

According to Obama RFKISNEEDED Dec 2016 #44

I think this question is missing the forest for the trees. TransitJohn Dec 2016 #45

when Obama ran the country had just had 8 years of bush La Lioness Priyanka Dec 2016 #46

Don't understand how we can easily compare the two either... JHan Dec 2016 #51

On policy, Hillary is the better candidate. But she is also a poor campaigner. Tatiana Dec 2016 #47

Obama put more focus on economic inequality JudyM Dec 2016 #48

Very True. Trump more or less ran Obama's 2012 campaign playbook against Romney on Clinton. hollowdweller Dec 2016 #60

Good point. Pity that raising people's consciousness only worked on Dems, not rethugs. JudyM Dec 2016 #76

Own a penis. Squinch Dec 2016 #52

YEP. That's pretty much the baseline. He was a HE. nt ncgrits Dec 2016 #54

You read my mind. hamsterjill Dec 2016 #59

LOL, I'm still remembering the Edwards supporters in '08 primaries Crunchy Frog Dec 2016 #93

Sure, sure. It had nothing to do with it. And yet, hostility to women is one of the greatest Squinch Dec 2016 #94

I'm not claiming that there was no sexism or misogyny in 2016. Crunchy Frog Dec 2016 #97

One more time: Hostility to women is one of the greatest predictors of a Trump vote. And Trump won. Squinch Dec 2016 #110

So you're saying that no woman can win the presidency because this one didn't. Crunchy Frog Dec 2016 #112

No. Actually, I never said that. I said that hostility to women was one of the strongest Squinch Dec 2016 #113

I also remember that Edwards' Iraq War vote never came up as disqualifying in any way. lapucelle Dec 2016 #108

Petraeus's responsibility for Benghazi doesn't seem to be being held against him. These are Squinch Dec 2016 #109

Men are allowed to be flawed. Women have to be perfect. lapucelle Dec 2016 #111

+1 uponit7771 Dec 2016 #122

Political baggage... Perceived and real... Begabig Dec 2016 #55

Obama had an edge Hillary couldn't: He offered a change from 8 disastrous years of Republicans DFW Dec 2016 #61

Hillary could have had that same edge but lost to Obama yurbud Dec 2016 #98

It was obvious after Cheneybish that the next president would be a Democrat DFW Dec 2016 #99

He was the change candidate and she wasn't bigbrother05 Dec 2016 #62

Win? FBaggins Dec 2016 #63

lol Grey Lemercier Dec 2016 #66

He won Lil Missy Dec 2016 #79

I posted about Obama's rev Wright speech rogue emissary Dec 2016 #88

He played to the media nt Buzz cook Dec 2016 #89

an incumbent WH party with sub-40 job approval ratings TuslaUltra Dec 2016 #96

President Obama Lotusflower70 Dec 2016 #103

He ran during Bush's eighth year for one. RandySF Dec 2016 #106

I agree overall though the comparison between Hillary and Obama is important to fix things yurbud Dec 2016 #125

Obama's popularity is personal and non transferable even to his own policies TheKentuckian Dec 2016 #114

Obama benefited from being against the Iraq war, not having a long neoliberal record, jfern Dec 2016 #115

He brought 4 million more people to the polls. Coyotl Dec 2016 #116

Oh, another "Hillary is a warmonger" dig. betsuni Dec 2016 #117

The point of the thread is what Dems can do differently next time--are we allowed to do that? yurbud Dec 2016 #119

should we just let people with money tell the party what to do? yurbud Dec 2016 #120

Same Reason Obama did better in 08 than 12 JI7 Dec 2016 #118

No Comey? uponit7771 Dec 2016 #121

He was running to replace a two-term president of the other party - he represented change nt EffieBlack Dec 2016 #123

RUSSIA did not interefere in '08 or '12. They did this time. nt LaydeeBug Dec 2016 #124

Ran as a challenger opponent against the exiting admin Politicub Dec 2016 #127

Shit was on fire in 2008. dawg Dec 2016 #128

"Eight Year Itch" Proud Liberal Dem Dec 2016 #129

Democrats might think about what they can do to earn back those third party votes yurbud Dec 2016 #131

I'm not berating anybody Proud Liberal Dem Dec 2016 #132

As simplistic as it seems, it was also the 8yrs. of one party in the WH thing JCMach1 Dec 2016 #130

It wasn't so much campaign tactics as it was personality. randome Dec 2016 #134