2016 Postmortem

JCanete

(5,272 posts)

53. Again, a livable wage implies being able to house and feed yourself, and maybe a child

Wed Dec 28, 2016, 05:54 PM

Dec 2016

working no more than 40 hours. If 12$ doesn't do that in most of the country, then it isn't a livable wage. Even if it does--and I doubt it does--while I applaud it for not being 7 an hour, I'm of the opinion that a higher minimum wage is good for all wage earners, since it's a baseline that companies have to compete with.

6000 dollar a year difference is a big deal. Besides, campaigning on a better more progressive plan is not bashing Clinton. I may be wrong on this one, and am happy to be proven so, but I feel like this wasn't really the area where the criticisms(or bashing) was occurring. It was an area where he was saying we need to demand more....similar to Clinton saying that Obama's advocacy for a 10$ minimum wage was insufficient.

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Bernie did not support getting rid of the ACA BEFORE Medicare for All was passed. [View all] Ken Burch Dec 2016 OP

THANK YOU PatsFan87 Dec 2016 #1

+1000 Duppers Dec 2016 #30

Of course he didn't. After all he voted for the ACA (and if he hadn't it wouldn't have passed... PoliticAverse Dec 2016 #2

Thanks for reminding people of this. Bernie will ALWAYS be looking out for those less fortunate... as sure as the day is long! InAbLuEsTaTe Dec 2016 #8

Not to mention that he got community health clinics to serve 10 million people as part of the ACA. jfern Dec 2016 #101

Yes but harping on getting rid of ACA supported GOP position that it didn't work. Justice Dec 2016 #3

Medicare for all is not a GOP position portlander23 Dec 2016 #4

you did. GOP is negative on ACA; so was Bernie. Bernie reasons might be different but both negative. Justice Dec 2016 #7

"Medicare for all" is the same as "no health care for anyone who can't pay" portlander23 Dec 2016 #9

? This is the stupidest post of the year ProfessorPlum Dec 2016 #105

Most of us are also "negative" on the ACA... Orsino Dec 2016 #106

The point is that he dishonestly made her out to be a corporate hack/sell-out R B Garr Dec 2016 #5

Got it! yallerdawg Dec 2016 #11

Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2016 #13

Wrong, and this kind of dishonesty is what causes the divisiveness. Hillary did not say R B Garr Dec 2016 #16

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Yet he stumped for it all over the United States knowing full well that he R B Garr Dec 2016 #19

Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2016 #28

Wrong. Remember when her husband was President and she fought for R B Garr Dec 2016 #34

Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2016 #79

She has explained how single payer wasn't viable, R B Garr Dec 2016 #82

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That's laughable you even reference it had R B Garr Dec 2016 #89

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Look, dead is dead. It's not doing the people of VT any good, is it? kcr Dec 2016 #35

She fought for healthcare decades ago, and she R B Garr Dec 2016 #83

This is as silly and dishonest as Trump's 30 years and why haven't you done X argument but TheKentuckian Dec 2016 #49

No, what's silly and dishonest is saying that Bernie has some superpower influence over policy R B Garr Dec 2016 #66

Ha, how ironic that you bother to flesh out the R B Garr Dec 2016 #85

A veto by the governor is NOT the same as "not getting it passed". Ken Burch Dec 2016 #80

Lol, this coming from those who hold the Clintons R B Garr Dec 2016 #84

Bernie got the bill through both houses of the Vermont legislature. Ken Burch Dec 2016 #87

This is just gratuitous Clinton bashing. Speaking of which, why didn't Bernie run R B Garr Dec 2016 #93

Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2016 #88

Yeah, the gratuitous and irrational Clinton hating shines R B Garr Dec 2016 #90

Forbes. sheshe2 Dec 2016 #99

Hillary Clinton: Single-payer health care will "never, ever" happen Jopin Klobe Dec 2016 #46

lol, saying it will never happen is far different from Sanders' dishonestly implying R B Garr Dec 2016 #65

she wasn't fighting for single payer any more, and certainly it wasn't part of her platform. how is JCanete Dec 2016 #22

He could not even get single payer passed in his tiny state of Vermont. It's not hard to R B Garr Dec 2016 #24

nothing is a viable option if we take it off the table, and even luke-warm legislation gets blocked JCanete Dec 2016 #26

Ha, wouldn't it be nice if he explained the reality of getting things passed instead of blaming R B Garr Dec 2016 #31

what reality? that we can do something if we all come together to do it? Is that a lie? nt JCanete Dec 2016 #33

Single payer failed in Vermont. That reality. He was unable to get it passed in R B Garr Dec 2016 #36

this is dumb. So he was unable to get it passed. What does that mean to you? If something JCanete Dec 2016 #39

He has no power in VT's state government. Gore1FL Dec 2016 #51

Yet that didn't stop him from maligning Hillary for being up against R B Garr Dec 2016 #63

When diid Sanders suggest it was Clinton's fault for not having it in VT? Gore1FL Dec 2016 #70

Sanders suggested that Hillary was against single payer and he said R B Garr Dec 2016 #71

Clinton said she was against single payer. She's wong. the ACA needs to be replaced with it. Gore1FL Dec 2016 #92

Sorry, but the "arguments" are reality. Bernie didn't get it passed in Vermont and he R B Garr Dec 2016 #96

There is nothing real about the argument presented, Gore1FL Dec 2016 #97

He was asked about this very real failure in a debate question. R B Garr Dec 2016 #98

This! mcar Dec 2016 #23

Wrong. Ken Burch Dec 2016 #74

Bernie said the ACA needed to be replaced, but he knew that single payer was not R B Garr Dec 2016 #75

"Single payer will never ever happen" - Hillary jfern Dec 2016 #102

Bernie couldn't make it happen, so noting it will never happen R B Garr Dec 2016 #103

It didn't fail, the Hillary supporting governor never tried to get it passed. jfern Dec 2016 #108

LMFAO! Lol, the lengths of the Clinton bashing are truly spectacular. R B Garr Dec 2016 #109

Look, Hillary made it quite clear she opposes single payer jfern Dec 2016 #111

Because it's not viable. Same reason it didn't pass in Vermont. R B Garr Dec 2016 #112

A lot of countries have single payer. I don't support "Democrats" who oppose single payer and say jfern Dec 2016 #113

LOL, that's funny, too. How completely self-serving and unrealistic. It doesn't R B Garr Dec 2016 #114

Great job parroting Hillary's "No we can't!" jfern Dec 2016 #115

More hilarity! Bernie should have been honest during his rallies about his failure R B Garr Dec 2016 #116

Give it up, Shumlin was a Hillary supporter, Bernie doesn't magically control jfern Dec 2016 #117

Bernie promoted single payer but couldn't even get it passed in his home state. R B Garr Dec 2016 #118

True, obviously. But what he did do is bash Hillary for not supporting single payer, and for DanTex Dec 2016 #6

pragmatism is what you go for when compromising with the other side. We shouldn't be compromising JCanete Dec 2016 #25

Governing means compromising. The ACA actually did get through congress. DanTex Dec 2016 #27

No she didn't. Name something that was drastic about her plans. nt JCanete Dec 2016 #29

$12 minimum wage. Debt-free college. Huge clean energy investments. Etc. DanTex Dec 2016 #32

12 dollar minimum wage is basic. Its really the bare minimum, and the point is it isn't livable. JCanete Dec 2016 #38

Compared to 7.25 it is drastic. Arguing about 15 vs 12 was one of Bernie's low moments. DanTex Dec 2016 #41

If livable has any bearing, then yes there is a difference, and being hyperbolic all republican JCanete Dec 2016 #43

They are all "livable", the question is the quality of life. DanTex Dec 2016 #44

or between 7 and 12 then for that matter? JCanete Dec 2016 #45

Or between 15 and 20. It's a sliding scale. DanTex Dec 2016 #47

well we know how people survive on 7. They get 2 or 3 jobs. A livable wage implies JCanete Dec 2016 #48

Yes, that's why it needs to be raised. DanTex Dec 2016 #50

Again, a livable wage implies being able to house and feed yourself, and maybe a child JCanete Dec 2016 #53

Depends on the size of the home, and the quality of the food. DanTex Dec 2016 #56

If you make $96 vs $120 a 8 hour work day that's $120 a week. Gore1FL Dec 2016 #52

Not as big as the difference between 15 and 20. DanTex Dec 2016 #54

$15 was established as a livable wage. Gore1FL Dec 2016 #57

By who? DanTex Dec 2016 #58

Apparently Seattle and San Francisco who set the $15 mark. Gore1FL Dec 2016 #60

Why fight for less than 20? DanTex Dec 2016 #62

$15 was the top standard set that I am aware of when the discussion was taking place. Gore1FL Dec 2016 #69

I mentioned 20. Who set 15 as the top standard? DanTex Dec 2016 #72

San Francisco and Seattle came up with those numbers. We already went over that. Gore1FL Dec 2016 #94

He was campaigning not bashing. OrwellwasRight Dec 2016 #37

Apparently doing it Bernie's way is the only way you really care about health, or wage stagnation.. JHan Dec 2016 #64

I don't think that's the point. kcr Dec 2016 #10

If Bernie was the Democratic Candidate padfun Dec 2016 #12

complete bullshit Skittles Dec 2016 #21

He didn't have the Clinton baggage to deal with in a year where political dynasties were rejected. Gore1FL Dec 2016 #55

the "Clinton baggage" was bullshit too Skittles Dec 2016 #61

It apparently wasn't bullshit to the Obama voters who decided to stay home or vote Trump. Gore1FL Dec 2016 #95

That baggage didn't just appear out of thin air, did it? kcr Dec 2016 #100

There were self-inflicted hits that didn't involved bullies Gore1FL Dec 2016 #107

complete disingenuous bullshit truebluegreen Dec 2016 #59

We couldn't have been any worse off, TheCowsCameHome Dec 2016 #40

This message was self-deleted by its author padfun Dec 2016 #78

Are you sure? That's not what Chelsea said. Hassin Bin Sober Dec 2016 #14

Well, yes, we knew this. PatrickforO Dec 2016 #15

Great post! tosh Dec 2016 #67

Thank you. K&R nt zentrum Dec 2016 #17

In order to win again.... Mustellus Dec 2016 #20

The campaign is over elmac Dec 2016 #42

Agreed. The only reason I started this thread Ken Burch Dec 2016 #110

Thank you Bernie for having our backs once again. jalan48 Dec 2016 #68

Thank you Ken. CentralMass Dec 2016 #73

The agenda is clear to many. guillaumeb Dec 2016 #76

Post removed Post removed Dec 2016 #77

Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2016 #81

Thanks Ken. K&R nt riderinthestorm Dec 2016 #104