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Gothmog

(154,604 posts)
18. Not really, there was a great deal of material
Tue Jan 3, 2017, 02:29 PM
Jan 2017

Remember that Sanders had never been vetted and so no one used the available material against him As for oppo research, there was ton of material to be used against Sanders including his rape essay, the fact that he was unemployed for long period of time and taught a course where he had praised Castro and other communist leaders Trump had an oppo book on Sanders that was two feet thick. No one in the real world thought that sanders had a chance of being the nominee and so Sanders was not vetted. This lack of vetting would have killed Sanders in the general election https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/democrats-would-be-insane-to-nominate-bernie-sanders/2016/01/26/0590e624-c472-11e5-a4aa-f25866ba0dc6_story.html?hpid=hp_opinions-for-wide-side_opinion-card-a%3Ahomepage%2Fstory

Sanders and his supporters boast of polls showing him, on average, matching up slightly better against Trump than Clinton does. But those matchups are misleading: Opponents have been attacking and defining Clinton for a quarter- century, but nobody has really gone to work yet on demonizing Sanders.

Watching Sanders at Monday night’s Democratic presidential forum in Des Moines, I imagined how Trump — or another Republican nominee — would disembowel the relatively unknown Vermonter.


The first questioner from the audience asked Sanders to explain why he embraces the “socialist” label and requested that Sanders define it “so that it doesn’t concern the rest of us citizens.”

Sanders, explaining that much of what he proposes is happening in Scandinavia and Germany (a concept that itself alarms Americans who don’t want to be like socialized Europe), answered vaguely: “Creating a government that works for all of us, not just a handful of people on the top — that’s my definition of democratic socialism.”

But that’s not how Republicans will define socialism — and they’ll have the dictionary on their side. They’ll portray Sanders as one who wants the government to own and control major industries and the means of production and distribution of goods. They’ll say he wants to take away private property. That wouldn’t be fair, but it would be easy. Socialists don’t win national elections in the United States .

Sanders on Monday night also admitted he would seek massive tax increases — “one of the biggest tax hikes in history,” as moderator Chris Cuomo put it — to expand Medicare to all. Sanders, this time making a comparison with Britain and France, allowed that “hypothetically, you’re going to pay $5,000 more in taxes,” and declared, “W e will raise taxes, yes we will.” He said this would be offset by lower health-insurance premiums and protested that “it’s demagogic to say, oh, you’re paying more in taxes.

Well, yes — and Trump is a demagogue.

Sanders also made clear he would be happy to identify Democrats as the party of big government and of wealth redistribution. When Cuomo said Sanders seemed to be saying he would grow government “bigger than ever,” Sanders didn’t quarrel, saying, “P eople want to criticize me, okay,” and “F ine, if that’s the criticism, I accept it.”

Sanders accepts it, but are Democrats ready to accept ownership of socialism, massive tax increases and a dramatic expansion of government? If so, they will lose.

Sanders would have been destroyed in the general election in the real world
Will this stuff ever end? n/t rzemanfl Jan 2017 #1
what "stuff"? Fast Walker 52 Jan 2017 #3
The Bernie would/wouldn't have lost stuff. It accomplishes nothing. n/t rzemanfl Jan 2017 #5
It's all that some have left. NWCorona Jan 2017 #10
Do you post the same protests in the "Bernie wudda won!" threads? baldguy Jan 2017 #21
I don't go looking for them. n/t rzemanfl Jan 2017 #22
Of course. baldguy Jan 2017 #23
Whatever that means. I thought my post made it clear I dread seeing both. n/t rzemanfl Jan 2017 #28
well thank the gods we had hillary!!!! bowens43 Jan 2017 #2
that is a different issue, but I think she was a better candidate overall than Bernie Fast Walker 52 Jan 2017 #4
Thank God, indeed. lapucelle Jan 2017 #6
environmental racist-- meaning his environmental policies might preferentially affect minorities? Fast Walker 52 Jan 2017 #12
Kurt Eichenwald of Newsweek saw the opposition research on Sanders, lapucelle Jan 2017 #15
ah, thanks. Fast Walker 52 Jan 2017 #62
lol. this. Joe941 Jan 2017 #61
I don't know anybody who is pro-abortion MiniMe Jan 2017 #7
Too bad we never had the chance to find out.... TheCowsCameHome Jan 2017 #8
I agree it would have been in fascinating to see it play out Fast Walker 52 Jan 2017 #13
If those are the attacks that Bernie would have faced in the GE NWCorona Jan 2017 #9
Really? Fast Walker 52 Jan 2017 #14
Yes. Really NWCorona Jan 2017 #19
Not really, there was a great deal of material Gothmog Jan 2017 #18
I don't take much stock in pundits who got very little right this election NWCorona Jan 2017 #20
Most apply to Warren HoneyBadger Jan 2017 #11
a lot of those things just don't have the power they used to, and I think Sanders could have JCanete Jan 2017 #16
I don't think we should under-estimate the power of rightwing bullshit after this past election Fast Walker 52 Jan 2017 #24
Sanders was treated with kid gloves by the Clinton campaign and there was a ton of material Gothmog Jan 2017 #17
that's a good piece, especially notable for when it was written Fast Walker 52 Jan 2017 #25
Sanders was treated with kid gloves Me. Jan 2017 #54
Think about what your premise is. HassleCat Jan 2017 #26
Favoring no restrictions at all on abortion.... bettyellen Jan 2017 #27
What restrictions are you in favor of? Just an honest question NWCorona Jan 2017 #32
I don't mind the current system that allows exceptions for the life and health for the mother or bettyellen Jan 2017 #36
I don't think it's weird. I believe it should be between a woman and her doctor NWCorona Jan 2017 #38
I think it's weird because it has zero support and would be a lightening rod for those religious bettyellen Jan 2017 #42
I can see it being a lightning rod as well but it's not like they would vote for him anyway NWCorona Jan 2017 #43
Well they would have used anything they could find. Unfortunately it's a big one for those bettyellen Jan 2017 #50
Yes they did. NWCorona Jan 2017 #56
What is it with this forum???? For some reason it's mired in looking behind rather than ahead. Vinca Jan 2017 #29
I'd vote for Bernie again in a heart beat. CentralMass Jan 2017 #30
Hillary's surrogates trotted out most of that already aikoaiko Jan 2017 #31
I keep waiting for info in that devastating op to drop. NWCorona Jan 2017 #33
There was a ton of good oppo on Sanders including tapes of his college course Gothmog Jan 2017 #34
This is nothing new and would only impact those that wouldn't have voted for him anyway. NWCorona Jan 2017 #37
Sanders was never vetted and so none of these materials had been used against Sanders Gothmog Jan 2017 #44
I never said that they wouldn't make effective ads I don't think they would have had NWCorona Jan 2017 #46
Denial is not just a river in Africa Gothmog Jan 2017 #48
And you want to school me on feelings. NWCorona Jan 2017 #49
That is because Sanders was running for media coverage and his efforts hurt the Democratic party Gothmog Jan 2017 #60
Match up polls are worthless Gothmog Jan 2017 #35
Maybe, but matchup polls said Hillary would lose to Trump and she did. They said Bernie would win. aikoaiko Jan 2017 #41
Go ask 538-I trust Nate Silver on this issue Gothmog Jan 2017 #45
538 may not have a good model when unconventional candidates are involved. aikoaiko Jan 2017 #47
How'd that work out for us....misplaced trust in my book Uggwearingdad Jan 2017 #57
The fact is, he generally outperformed Hillary in the rust belt, in the primaries. Warren DeMontague Jan 2017 #39
Yes. elleng Jan 2017 #52
I think we need to quit worrying about what the Republicans will say.. aidbo Jan 2017 #40
What's the point? HassleCat Jan 2017 #51
Except he wasn't the nominee, so why bring this up? The Velveteen Ocelot Jan 2017 #53
Attack Attack attack..but just remember if Bernie Sanders had been the nominee we would INdemo Jan 2017 #55
Love your speculation lastone Jan 2017 #58
so in your mind, why do you think "DNC / DWS put their boot on Sanders campaign"? Fast Walker 52 Jan 2017 #63
No way to know how attacking Bernie as Socialist vs. his greater authenticity would have played out MrPurple Jan 2017 #59
Bernie had not even been tested/vetted, and was a bit thin-skinned. Lil Missy Jan 2017 #64
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